Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

launish116 · 08-11-2019 3:20pm

Clegg wrote: »

Ulster team named. Not a single home grown player in the pack. We know Ulster have a problem up front. But seeing the line up hammers it home. Doing much better with the backs though.

Guessing Rea is rotation, he's played every game so far? Henderson given an extra weeks rest

It is plain to see and has been for seasons, but I do think the academy is slowly starting to churn out some prospects in the forwards. Just give them another season or two.

That aside that's still a lot stronger team than I envisaged.

bilston · 08-11-2019 3:26pm

launish116 wrote: »

Guessing Rea is rotation, he's played every game so far? Henderson given an extra weeks rest

It is plain to see and has been for seasons, but I do think the academy is slowly starting to churn out some prospects in the forwards. Just give them another season or two.

That aside that's still a lot stronger team than I envisaged.

Still missing at least four starters in Henderson, Coetzee, Burns and Gilroy... arguably Ludik as well and for me anyway Treadwell would start against Bath next week.

Paul Smeenus · 08-11-2019 7:36pm

bilston wrote: »

Still missing at least four starters in Henderson, Coetzee, Burns and Gilroy... arguably Ludik as well and for me anyway Treadwell would start against Bath next week.

Addison and Lowry probably preferred to Ludik.

bilston · 08-11-2019 8:29pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Addison and Lowry probably preferred to Ludik.

To be honest I forgot about Addison!

mogwai81 · 09-11-2019 10:23pm

How did Jack McGrath play? If he can rediscover something close to his pre lions form and Eric O’Sullivan can continue his form from last season, Ulster will have serious depth among the props.

bilston · 10-11-2019 1:20am

mogwai81 wrote: »

How did Jack McGrath play? If he can rediscover something close to his pre lions form and Eric O’Sullivan can continue his form from last season, Ulster will have serious depth among the props.

McGrath seems to have given the scrum a boost, but O'Sullivan is more impressive around the park.

mogwai81 · 10-11-2019 1:27am

bilston wrote: »

McGrath seems to have given the scrum a boost, but O'Sullivan is more impressive around the park.

Hopefully O‘Sullivan will improve his scrummaging working with McGrath ( not that it’s poor, judging on last year). Like you said, he already offers more around the park.

Buer · 10-11-2019 1:51am

McGrath was never a tyro with ball in hand. At his best, he had an incredible work rate in defence and at clearing out. He's going to be an excellent signing but he's not going to burst through defenders in the loose ever.

He's precisely what Munster need though if guys like Coetzee and Henderson are fit and firing.

I reckon Ulster are still going to be far too reliant on a select group for carrying the ball though. I don't think there will be more than half the pack capable of bursting though a tackle.

bilston · 10-11-2019 9:43am

So preferred team for next week.

1 McGrath
2 Herring
3 Moore
4 Henderson
5 Carter
6 Rea
7 Murphy
8 Coetzee
9 Cooney
10 Burns
11 Stockdale (lucky boy)
12 McCloskey
13 Marshall
14 Gilroy
15 Ludik

Rob Lyttle would be the unluckiest man in Ulster, but I don't see Stockdale being dropped. But he needs to sort himself out. I wouldn't be against starting McBurney at hooker either, but doubt that would happen.

jacothelad · 10-11-2019 10:56am

Buer wrote: »

McGrath was never a tyro with ball in hand. At his best, he had an incredible work rate in defence and at clearing out. He's going to be an excellent signing but he's not going to burst through defenders in the loose ever.

He's precisely what Munster need though if guys like Coetzee and Henderson are fit and firing.

I reckon Ulster are still going to be far too reliant on a select group for carrying the ball though. I don't think there will be more than half the pack capable of bursting though a tackle.

EOS, Tom O'Toole, Henderson, Carter, Coetzee, Treadwell, Murphy(?) and Reidy are all guys who can carry with different degrees of success. Not sure about any of the young guys coming through. Treadwell is a very interesting player. He's huge and fast and can pass properly, win l/o ball and he tackles like a train. For a second row he is still young too and seems on an upward trajectory. I hope he continues to improve.

mogwai81 · 10-11-2019 12:28pm

bilston wrote: »

So preferred team for next week.

1 McGrath
2 Herring
3 Moore
4 Henderson
5 Carter
6 Rea
7 Murphy
8 Coetzee
9 Cooney
10 Burns
11 Stockdale (lucky boy)
12 McCloskey
13 Marshall
14 Gilroy
15 Ludik

Rob Lyttle would be the unluckiest man in Ulster, but I don't see Stockdale being dropped. But he needs to sort himself out. I wouldn't be against starting McBurney at hooker either, but doubt that would happen.

I was surprised towards the end of last season to see Stockdale at 15 and Ludik at 11. I wonder is there a chance we could see Stockdale at 15 and Lyttle at 11. Maybe the first round of Europe is deemed too important to try it.

Paul Smeenus · 10-11-2019 12:50pm

jacothelad wrote: »

EOS, Tom O'Toole, Henderson, Carter, Coetzee, Treadwell, Murphy(?) and Reidy are all guys who can carry with different degrees of success. Not sure about any of the young guys coming through. Treadwell is a very interesting player. He's huge and fast and can pass properly, win l/o ball and he tackles like a train. For a second row he is still young too and seems on an upward trajectory. I hope he continues to improve.

Treaders completely stalled under Gibbes, and looks much closer to fulfilling his potential under McFarland. Hopefully his trajectory continues - he night feature for Ireland again.

Need to rewatch the game, but not too disconsolate, given the players we held back and rotated out. Our fourth choice OH had his first start at ten, having seemingly previously been moved to centre. No idea who our equivalent would even have been last season... Nelson?

Hopefully Burns' return will help steady Stockdale. A couple of dinks over for Jacob to regather, or those crossfire kicks Burns ha started to nail. Should be good for Jacob's confidence. Speaking of whom, I also think that Burns has started to become pretty important to us - he's unshowy but good. For all that many fans tend to think of him as a stopgap, he was pulling the strings during our European run last season. He was there when we went toe to toe with Leinster, when we turned it around away to Leicester, when we got those good wins at home. He's not a world beater, but he is under-rated.

I also see that BBC NI are now going to produce a highlights package. Would be surprised if the rights don't end up with them again - they're too important to the organisation. The reason they didn't get them last time was because BBC Scotland didn't contribute much to the bid, leaving NI and BBC Wales hanging.

It hasn't been a straightforward kick on at the start of this season, but I suspect there's quite a bit of evolution happening behind the scenes. Just need to step up for Bath now. Can't afford to come away with no points.

Squidgy Black · 10-11-2019 1:11pm

mogwai81 wrote: »

I was surprised towards the end of last season to see Stockdale at 15 and Ludik at 11. I wonder is there a chance we could see Stockdale at 15 and Lyttle at 11. Maybe the first round of Europe is deemed too important to try it.

With the form Stockdale's in at the moment it'd be mental to stick him at 15 for Europe, some of his defensive reads have been awful.

Sinbad_NI · 10-11-2019 2:23pm

I'd have Little in the team over Stockdale at the minute.

He's been fantastic every time he been on the pitch this year. Stockdale is in shocking form.

bilston · 10-11-2019 2:56pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Treaders completely stalled under Gibbes, and looks much closer to fulfilling his potential under McFarland. Hopefully his trajectory continues - he night feature for Ireland again.

Need to rewatch the game, but not too disconsolate, given the players we held back and rotated out. Our fourth choice OH had his first start at ten, having seemingly previously been moved to centre. No idea who our equivalent would even have been last season... Nelson?

Hopefully Burns' return will help steady Stockdale. A couple of dinks over for Jacob to regather, or those crossfire kicks Burns ha started to nail. Should be good for Jacob's confidence. Speaking of whom, I also think that Burns has started to become pretty important to us - he's unshowy but good. For all that many fans tend to think of him as a stopgap, he was pulling the strings during our European run last season. He was there when we went toe to toe with Leinster, when we turned it around away to Leicester, when we got those good wins at home. He's not a world beater, but he is under-rated.

I also see that BBC NI are now going to produce a highlights package. Would be surprised if the rights don't end up with them again - they're too important to the organisation. The reason they didn't get them last time was because BBC Scotland didn't contribute much to the bid, leaving NI and BBC Wales hanging.

It hasn't been a straightforward kick on at the start of this season, but I suspect there's quite a bit of evolution happening behind the scenes. Just need to step up for Bath now. Can't afford to come away with no points.

I think there have been some steps forward. Carter is proving quietly impressive, getting Moore back makes a big difference (although TOT has done well and is developing all the time). Add Henderson and Coetzee are we should kick on even more next week.

I agree with everything you say about Burns. He was never as bad as some made out last season anyway. He improved as the season went on, and this year he has kicked on quite a bit.

Oh and having Luke back in midfield is really important.

I think we've improved a bit from last season, but the extent of that improvement will only be known after we've played a few big European games.

We are definitely better off now than we were this time last season. But last year the real improvements weren't seen until after Christmas.

mogwai81 · 10-11-2019 4:47pm

Squidgy Black wrote: »

With the form Stockdale's in at the moment it'd be mental to stick him at 15 for Europe, some of his defensive reads have been awful.

Fair point, but maybe it’s better to move position now, instead of moving a form player out of position. I just feel fullback could eventually be Stockdale‘s best position. Barring injury, I would love to see...

15. Stockdale
14. Baloucoune
13. Addison
12. McCloskey
11. Lyttle
10. Burns
9. Cooney
8. Coetzee
7. Murphy
6. Rea
5. Carter
4. Henderson
3. Moore
2. Herring
1. McGrath

Sinbad_NI · 10-11-2019 8:15pm

Burns was really good in the big games last year.

It was in some of the "easier" league games he seemed to go missing a bit.

Henry Ford III · 11-11-2019 11:43am

Moore's conditioning is suspect. He looks a few stone overweight.

Utah_Saint · 11-11-2019 12:21pm

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Moore's conditioning is suspect. He looks a few stone overweight.

I thought that was his default setting...

Digifriendly · 11-11-2019 5:23pm

Bath completely out-muscled Northampton at the weekend so Ulster need to step up a gear.

launish116 · 11-11-2019 6:51pm

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Moore's conditioning is suspect. He looks a few stone overweight.

He’s only back from injury, never was gonna have the match fitness.

Dubinusa · 11-11-2019 7:16pm

Moore was great last season. I think if he performs like last season, he'll be capped internationally again.
Bath are a big strong side. Ulster will be in a war! Fades should not be in the 23, based on his current form.
It appears Rea is the primary 6. He's a great prospect and I really hate him. Along with Nordi and Coetzee, that's a good looking back row. Timoney and Jones are very good replacements also.
Ulster could be a tough side to face for anyone this year.

mogwai81 · 11-11-2019 7:34pm

Has Matty Rea really improved this year, or had he always the attributes required and was just held back by injuries?

launish116 · 11-11-2019 8:18pm

mogwai81 wrote: »

Has Matty Rea really improved this year, or had he always the attributes required and was just held back by injuries?

I really rate Rea Snr and want him to push on, the blindside is his to lock down! He has the attributes and the current injury free run is really highlighting it. Would like to see him a little more offensive though, but it is developing.

Guessing based on rotation we’re looking at a Rea, Murphy, Coetzee backrow for Bath.

bilston · 11-11-2019 9:09pm

mogwai81 wrote: »

Has Matty Rea really improved this year, or had he always the attributes required and was just held back by injuries?

He is becoming a more effective carrier and his lineout work is impressive. It's a tight call between himself and Reidy.

For me Rea starts, but it could go either way.

Locke_Lamora · 12-11-2019 4:51pm

3 year extension for Lyttle. Awesome player.

Dubinusa · 12-11-2019 6:49pm

What about Dalton? Has he improved? Should he get a senior contract? I suppose Regan would be in the same boat, but I think he may have lost a season to injury?
Angus Kernohan is not getting into the squad, he is only 20 and I think he will be a star in the future. He might be a candidate to loan out?

Paul Smeenus · 12-11-2019 7:35pm

Dubinusa wrote: »

What about Dalton? Has he improved? Should he get a senior contract? I suppose Regan would be in the same boat, but I think he may have lost a season to injury?
Angus Kernohan is not getting into the squad, he is only 20 and I think he will be a star in the future. He might be a candidate to loan out?

I think Kernohan is solid for a young wing, and he's game. But for me, he'd be behind Stockdale, Gilroy, Baloucoune, Lyttle and possibly Faddes, if he gets back the form he had in the SH. I certainly don't think he'll be a star in the future.

Locke_Lamora · 12-11-2019 8:29pm

Dubinusa wrote: »

What about Dalton? Has he improved? Should he get a senior contract? I suppose Regan would be in the same boat, but I think he may have lost a season to injury?
Angus Kernohan is not getting into the squad, he is only 20 and I think he will be a star in the future. He might be a candidate to loan out?

I wouldn’t say Kernohan has shown anything to suggest he might be a star. A lot can change obviously and development is difficult to predict, but I would be surprised if he turned out better than any of Stockdale, Lyttle, Baloucoune, Gilroy, Faddes or Addison. I’d wager McIlroy from the academy will overtake him long term as well.

Locke_Lamora · 12-11-2019 8:34pm

Any there’s no real harm in him not being in the squad right now. He got playing time last year due to retirements and an injury crisis, but I don’t really think he’s quite at the right standard yet. If you look at Leinster the have a couple young backs coming through now who played in the u20’s with Stockdale.

Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

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