Adults living with their parents...

LirW wrote: »

I get what you mean but try see it from the other side, even if you have a lot of resentment.
There are many young adults out there that have seen 4 years of sharp rises in property and rental prices. If you're going to college it's either impossible to rent if you have to finance it yourself or you'll have a long commute.
So what many students in this situation see are some peers that have a financial headstart that helps immensely to get through formative educational years. And they wonder then how someone "normal" can do it, while already thinking ahead and all they see is a broken housing market that will see them handing half their pay going into rent for a room in proximity to work.
It is an incredibly hostile environment for people that try to get started. Have you ever read these spending diaries on the journal? Some young people there live really miserable lives by pinching pennies and all have this glimmer of hope that the country they were born in will one day welcome them as full members of society where they don't have to constantly struggle anymore.

So you put yourself through college by taking out loans and that's fair play. But financing your third level education is still not the norm in Europe and because it gets increasingly difficult to combine full time college with work, students don't see this as an option because they have no source of income and a summer job won't cover their expenses for the year. And I get this fear.
So all they see is how hopeless it is to make it work because it all doesn't go together, the market is in bits and if they ever want to have a slight hope of living independently in a country that still doesn't have a viable long term rental sector, is to save for a deposit straight away.
You made it work because you had to and you were fully aware that you'll be paying for your educational debt for a long time after college. But this concept is somewhat foreign to Europe and since third level costs are very high in Ireland and many other countries have lower cost of living and no college fees I understand the resistance to accept that you'll start your working live with a pile of debt.

I'm sure many of the ones wondering how people make it don't mean any harm, they genuinely don't see how they're supposed to make it work, especially if relocating to other countries isn't an option.

I 100% understand all of this. I graduated at just about the worst possible time and have struggled my entire adult life.

The problem is these people who look at people like me and assume we've had help don't actually realise that *they* are the ones who have it easier. You know why I ended up taking any job I could get and heading abroad to work? Because I had no fcking option. I didn't have Mammy's free house and home cooked meals. I think this is half the problem - people just get too comfortable and refuse to give up these home comforts and then moan about the 'economy'.

Sorry, but any working adult should be able to afford at least a basic room in a flatshare and to support themselves. The economy is far better than it was in 2008, and I was doing it then. The minimum wage in Ireland is really high and last time I looked, you could still get a room for 500 euro-ish.

I'm looking at possibly accepting a good job offer in Zurich and the jealous comments I've gotten have been pathetic. People saying 'isn't it well for you?' etc. Those same people who bullied me at school for being studious and not hanging around the park smoking and drinking feel entitled to have what I have despite doing absolutely nothing to earn it. One of these people turned down a job because she'd have to take two buses to get there. An absolute joke. I didn't get this offer out of nowhere or because one of my parents pulled strings. It's been years and years of hard work and graft and thankless sh1tty jobs and studying in the evenings after working all day. Many, many tears and feeling like it was all pointless and I'd never get anywhere. Feeling completely isolated and alone with no support from anyone and risking losing the little I had when I decided to go for a big career change at 32. Once I had a job again, spending all my disposable income and my little spare time on going to German classes at night because I'd been told I'd have better opportunities on the continent.

And people look at me and say my parents must have helped me out. It's galling, tbh. If others have no resilience or initiative, fine, but I wish people would stop going on as if everyone who isn't 30 and jobless and living at home is privileged.

eviltwin wrote: »

Respect for starters. Fairness as well. Why should your folks cover all the expenses out of their salary when you earn a wage.

Agree. I've no intention of freeloading off two pensioners when I have a good job. Parents don't owe their kids free, safe harbour their entire lives!

Macy Salmon Squeegee wrote: »

Covering some bills or paying towards food is different (if they accept it, many won’t) but actually paying rent makes zero sense. The mortgage is the same if you live there or not, many won’t even have a mortgage anymore also.

The majority of parents won’t accept rent, I bet most never even heard of the concept, I wouldn’t have only for reading about it on boards as I’ve ever seen it discussed or mentioned anywhere else. So saying it’s “respect” or fairness” doesn’t come into it at all.

I still think it smacks of entitlement tbh. There's no way I could live at home, earn a wage and have my parents pay for everything. I'd be shoving cash into their pockets or transferring money to them directly without their choice in the matter.

Your parents are always going to be your parents, of course. However when you become an adult and earn a wage, you should pay your own way and be self sufficient. Shouldn't be relying on them if you can afford to contribute. Is it not incredibly embarrassing?

My siblings and I all lived at home at various points for various lengths of time after University. Never paid rent. My Dad would have never accepted that. Mind you, the reasons we were there in the first place were financial in that we were all either broke or saving at the time. And the Parents didn't have a mortgage.

SusieBlue wrote: »

Yeah, my parents don't ask for a cent but I still hand up a few hundred every month. Its still significantly below the market rate to even rent a room so I'm still saving a lot. They still have a few years left on their mortgage.

My mam had her eye on a lamp in Dunnes for ages so I picked them that up as a treat last month. If I'm getting a takeaway I'll pay for theirs too, I do the lotto for them a few times a month, pick the newspaper up for my dad if I'm passing the shop etc.
Just little things like that, which are no trouble to me but that they're very grateful for to show I appreciate them.

I hope there is an implied agreement that you can have a share in the winnings!

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

I 100% understand all of this. I graduated at just about the worst possible time and have struggled my entire adult life.

The problem is these people who look at people like me and assume we've had help don't actually realise that *they* are the ones who have it easier. You know why I ended up taking any job I could get and heading abroad to work? Because I had no fcking option. I didn't have Mammy's free house and home cooked meals. I think this is half the problem - people just get too comfortable and refuse to give up these home comforts and then moan about the 'economy'.

Sorry, but any working adult should be able to afford at least a basic room in a flatshare and to support themselves. The economy is far better than it was in 2008, and I was doing it then. The minimum wage in Ireland is really high and last time I looked, you could still get a room for 500 euro-ish.

I'm looking at possibly accepting a good job offer in Zurich and the jealous comments I've gotten have been pathetic. People saying 'isn't it well for you?' etc. Those same people who bullied me at school for being studious and not hanging around the park smoking and drinking feel entitled to have what I have despite doing absolutely nothing to earn it. One of these people turned down a job because she'd have to take two buses to get there. An absolute joke. I didn't get this offer out of nowhere or because one of my parents pulled strings. It's been years and years of hard work and graft and thankless sh1tty jobs and studying in the evenings after working all day. Many, many tears and feeling like it was all pointless and I'd never get anywhere. Feeling completely isolated and alone with no support from anyone and risking losing the little I had when I decided to go for a big career change at 32. Once I had a job again, spending all my disposable income and my little spare time on going to German classes at night because I'd been told I'd have better opportunities on the continent.

And people look at me and say my parents must have helped me out. It's galling, tbh. If others have no resilience or initiative, fine, but I wish people would stop going on as if everyone who isn't 30 and jobless and living at home is privileged.

I really respect you and wish you well on the continent, you deserve every bit of it.

I see where your resentment comes from a lot better now. I am from the continent where living at home and third level all works differently. Moving to Ireland and seeing very different values was indeed a bit of a culture shock, vastly different to what I grew up with. We were turfed out at the age of 19/20 because living and sharing is a lot cheaper and college degrees don't require constant attendance so it's easier to work but it'll take you 4-5 years to get your ordinary bachelor's degree (Hons don't exist where I come from and my sister just finished her BA after more than 5 years).

As an example: my husband and his peers also graduated right after the crash and all that was waiting for them was the dole queue. One of his best friends though came from a quite wealthy background. While the husband and other peers moved on to normal secondary schools, said friend went to a well known private school in Dublin. Coupled up as teenager with a girl from fairly good background too, they're married now. He went on to college with all expenses paid, graduated and connections got him into a very sweet job and he moved on to one of the big banks, earns really good money.
Now he's a really sound lad and not arrogant in any way but this was his life, himself and the wife bought on a very nice area on the Northside 3 years ago and while they did get a headstart for buying, they were still working hard.
But their peers stayed behind. For my husband it wasn't a flatshare with his friend because he decided to move in with the girlfriend. For him it was a 17k a year desktop support job after college and living at home. He very prone to burning out quickly when stressed.
Besides the one friend everyone struggled. It is now getting better but even statistics have proven that starting a career during an economic disaster will see your income staying behind.

You did the smart thing and went abroad and it was easy for you to do so. People will always be nasty and begrudge hard earned success because they don't see the struggle you went through.
I think the issue is though that there are two separate things at play: you resent people that are entitled pr*cks and hate to see you successful because they couldn't do it for whatever reason. Chances are these people will always, in every run of life be completely useless and hard work.
The other issue is legitimate economic struggle that has little to do with how the economy was 10 years ago since it affects young adults differently. Right now it does make sense for young people to stay at home, otherwise their chances of ever owning a home in a country where renting isn't viable in the long run, is going to be minimised. That does affect young people that decided against going abroad to work and live and it's fair play, not everyone can cope with such a radical change.

Be proud of being the self-made woman you are by fighting for it and f*ck the haters.
But it has little to do with young adults in 2019 trying to get on their feet. In return said adults should understand that success stories from 10-20 years ago aren't relevant for their success because things have been different, in a good and a bad way.

mr_fegelien wrote: »

What if you have autism and can't get a job?

But I don't have autism and I do have a job?
Whether its earning a wage or getting social welfare, if you are living at home you should contribute towards the running of the house.
No one should get a free ride, its that simple.

partyguinness wrote: »

These posts are predicated on the assumption of a working child living with parents.

Bringing up medical issues is just pivoting into a completely different angle.

Or just plain trolling.

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

I'm with you there, but that doesn't mean that living at home in your thirties is the norm unless you had financial help. Sorry, but that's utter bullsh1t.

I don't think anyone is saying that it's the "norm" or that they are comfortable about the reality of such situations. The vast majority of people would rather not live with their parents when they are in their late 20's and into their 30's. But the fact is that it is extremely difficult to make ends meet, with regards to ones future housing concerns, if you are out pissing away money of exorbitant renting costs.

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

What I do have a problem with is people insinuating that it's impossible to move away/abroad without financial help from parents and implying that those of us who could do it were lucky. That's utter delusional sh1te, sorry.

Again, I don't think anyone is saying that it's "impossible", but it is very difficult to do, for most, without help of some kind.

You, because of your unfortunately family situation, were forced to move out and go your own way. But that doesn't mean that others should be happy to follow in your footsteps. Moving out of a family home - one that runs with a certain amount of functionality - and into a crappy renting situation where one wastes a large bulk of their wages (which have been largely stagnant since 2008) will never be a superior move to staying in that family home and trying to save enough money to buy a place of your own.

It used to be easier and make more sense in my day, where you'd move into a rented house in your 20's, with a long term view to buying something more permanent later in life. But in the late 90's property prices were mangled into this nightmarish nonsense of unaffordable dreams and that hasn't really changed in the last 20 years, despite the crash. It's only been made worse, too, by leech landlords upping their rents, because they have a captive audience who cannot afford to buy their own place.

None of the above should be happening and it's very damaging to society in serious ways, as we've seen with grown men and women in their 30's and 40's moving back home with their elderly parents, or never moving out in the first place.

mr_fegelien wrote: »

As I said, it's mostly an American thing. I know of one guy who pays rent in my class and he's 19. He's from a pretty strict African family so no surprises there.

And why should he feel guilt for sponging off his parents? It's hard living in Ireland. Very expensive. Would you say the same for kids from rich parents?

It is also hard and expensive for parents. When I moved back home in my early 20's I had a job but not enough to live away from home so of course I paid rent. Thankfully I was only there for about 18 months but I paid rent. Did I pay the going rate? No: I paid about half.

You shouldn't think of this as paying parents rent. You should think of this as getting a good deal on rent which you would otherwise have to pay elsewhere.

I do find the sense of entitlement shocking and disappointing. Parents are under no obligation to let their adult children stay at home. Let's face it, staying at home probably means meals, laundry and other benefits so not paying rent when able to smacks of not only entitlement but predatory greed.

Trigger Happy wrote: »

But do you not find it a bit demasculating having your parents still look after you long in to adulthood? Like when do the apron strings get cut?

Until he got married, noxy still brought his washing back home to mammy, those strings are fairly long.....