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Antifa [Mod Warning on post #1 - updated 08/08/19]

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    #1292
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I agree with a large part of your post.

    To
    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Very good post

    What changed? I thought we were finding common ground.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1293
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Kimsang wrote: »
    Its hilarious the contrast in discourse between a liberal arguing vs a group of conservatives in say, CA forum, as opposed to the level of discourse of a conservative person arguing with a group of liberals in lets say the politics forum.

    Here is a genuine debate with facts, reason; in politics its just accusations flying around and inflammatory posts because feelings are hurt.

    That’s because posters are held to a higher standard in the politics forum. Here it’s loser and people are free to make all sorts of nonsense claims with little or no consequences.

    Like claiming Antifa controller the police.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1294
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    notobtuse wrote: »
    I agree. Might be because a conservative's lifespan is about one-two months in Politics anymore before actions by liberals are taken against conservatives in order to silence their viewpoints.

    There are plenty of conservative posters in the politics forum who lost freely within the rules. This is hilarious.

    People get warned for dumping links to storm front, or videos by white nationalist talking heads and they run off crying.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1295
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Brian? wrote:
    I don't think anyone is justified in attacking anyone physically, ever. I'm a bit strange that way though.

    I agree.
    Brian? wrote:
    Violence is wrong.

    I agree.
    Brian? wrote:
    I don't defend Antifa's methods in any way shape or form. What I strongly object to is people labeling them as fascists, because they dress in black and use violence to support their political aims. I also strongly object to the idea that they get support from law enforcement that right wing groups don't get.

    I am also in agreement that nobody can possibly defend the actions of antifa. I disagree about the other part and the other poster explained why

    Brian? wrote:
    Antifa have been made into a bogeyman by the right, even soft right. When realistically their ethos is to oppose the rise of far right movements. I feel that the right should stronger in their condemnation of the far right.

    Again, I agree with the first part. Antifa have been make bogeymen but I disagree that their ethos is just to oppose the far right. And as the other poster explained well, the right almost always condemn the actions of the KKK and white supremacists.

    Brian? wrote:
    I believe the left should be stronger in their condemnation of the political violence Antifa perpetrate. Their core value of opposing fascism is not worthy of condemnation though, it should be done peacefully though.

    I wholeheartedly agree. The definition of fascism is key here though.

    Brian? wrote:
    I don't accept that the responsibility for the violence is entirely the fault of Antifa or entirely the fault of far right groups. To twist a phrase, there are bad people on both sides, on both sides.

    I agree and it's nice to see you quote trump in a positive way.
    Brian? wrote:
    However I find the ideas of most far right groups abhorrent, regressive and worthy of opposition. But then I find that also to be true of most centerist and right groups as well, so I am probably not a good barometer.

    I am glad that you can admit your bias and say you aren't a good barometer. It's refreshing.

    Brian? wrote:
    As for what groups are "far-right". Apart from the obvious Neo-Nazis, the KKK etc. . I would also add groups who are right wing identarians. White nationalist groups, chauvanist groups etc. .

    I dunno about the chauvinist groups but I agree with the others.


    This is why I can say that I agree with you on a lot of things but also say that a post that disagreed with you was also good because he made good points on the parts I disagree with you on.

    I don't have to align 100% with any group to acknowledge similarities.


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    #1296
    Kimsang
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,170 ✭✭✭Kimsang


    Brian? wrote: »
    That’s because posters are held to a higher standard in the politics forum.

    Is this the higher standard you speak of?

    When I say that game theory is involved in geopolitics you reply with;
    Geopolitics isn’t a game. End.
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=110546354

    When I ask you about Roger Scruton you reply;
    That’s not dog whistling. That’s an openly racist thing to say.
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=110537276

    More amazing high quality posting:
    Maybe stop there then.
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110635192&postcount=1019
    So a five second google solves this debate:
    https://www.powerengineeringint.com/...ombergnef.html
    The only ludicrous thing is that you didn’t google it.
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110635144&postcount=1017
    Let's not get silly please- mod note.
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110610464&postcount=418


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    #1297
    20Cent
    Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Racist, addicted to speed, foulmouthed and sexist.
    No wonder bikers like him.

    DjznVG2UcAAYCM6.jpg


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    #1298
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Kimsang wrote: »
    Is this the higher standard you speak of?

    When I say that game theory is involved in geopolitics you reply with;

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=110546354

    When I ask you about Roger Scruton you reply;

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=110537276

    More amazing high quality posting:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110635192&postcount=1019

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110635144&postcount=1017


    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110610464&postcount=418

    That’s exactly what I’m talking about. Thanks for helping.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1299
    Tasfasdf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 660 ✭✭✭Tasfasdf


    20Cent wrote: »
    Racist, addicted to speed, foulmouthed and sexist.
    No wonder bikers like him.

    DjznVG2UcAAYCM6.jpg

    You really just show yourself up when you bring racist, hate for Trump etc etc with a picture like that but I suppose that all you see on CNN to reiterate to us.


  • Options
    #1300
    Kimsang
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,170 ✭✭✭Kimsang


    Brian? wrote: »
    That’s exactly what I’m talking about. Thanks for helping.

    All of these examples serve to prove your complete inability to research a topic.


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    #1301
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I agree.



    I agree.



    I am also in agreement that nobody can possibly defend the actions of antifa. I disagree about the other part and the other poster explained why




    Again, I agree with the first part. Antifa have been make bogeymen but I disagree that their ethos is just to oppose the far right. And as the other poster explained well, the right almost always condemn the actions of the KKK and white supremacists.




    I wholeheartedly agree. The definition of fascism is key here though.




    I agree and it's nice to see you quote trump in a positive way.



    I am glad that you can admit your bias and say you aren't a good barometer. It's refreshing.




    I dunno about the chauvinist groups but I agree with the others.


    This is why I can say that I agree with you on a lot of things but also say that a post that disagreed with you was also good because he made good points on the parts I disagree with you on.

    I don't have to align 100% with any group to acknowledge similarities.

    I’m honestly confused. The other poster disagreed with 90% of my post. But hey, I’m not the sensitive type. I just want to have an honest debate.

    Chauvinist groups: aren’t the Proud Boys a chauvinist group. I’m open to correction.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1302
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Kimsang wrote: »
    All of these examples serve to prove your complete inability to research a topic.

    Actually they don’t. They show I debate with actual thought out viewpoints I came to myself. Instead of mindlessly parroting bloggers etc. .

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • Options
    #1303
    Kimsang
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,170 ✭✭✭Kimsang


    Brian? wrote: »
    Actually they don’t. They show I debate with actual thought out viewpoints I came to myself. Instead of mindlessly parroting bloggers etc. .
    "each Chinese person is a kind of replica of the next one and that is a very frightening thing"
    You've already said this is an openly racist thing to say.. you've lost all credibility in my eyes... especially after disregarding facts given to you.
    The conservative philosopher has a point about his quotes being taken out of context....shows Scruton making a point about the conformity demanded by the authoritarian Chinese government, rather than denigrating Chinese people. This should have been made clearer-The Guardian
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/26/roger-scruton-not-victim-leftwing-witch-hunt


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    #1304
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Kimsang wrote: »
    You've already said this is an openly racist thing to say.. you've lost all credibility in my eyes... especially after disregarding facts given to you.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/26/roger-scruton-not-victim-leftwing-witch-hunt

    What facts. It’s just more chatter. Why some you tell me in your own words instead of constantly posting links?

    I’m not sure how I’ll sleep tonight after my loss of credibility.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1305
    20Cent
    Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Tasfasdf wrote: »
    You really just show yourself up when you bring racist, hate for Trump etc etc with a picture like that but I suppose that all you see on CNN to reiterate to us.

    A "biker for trump" with an ss tattoo. What more needs to be said.

    Why do you think they like him?

    They have also threatened to ride on Washington and "protect" him if trump gets impeached not exactly fans of democracy.


  • Options
    #1306
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Tasfasdf wrote: »
    You really just show yourself up when you bring racist, hate for Trump etc etc with a picture like that but I suppose that all you see on CNN to reiterate to us.

    The guy has an a Wafen SS tattoo. Do you see it?

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1307
    Sweetemotion
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Sweetemotion


    Brian? wrote: »
    Or because they don’t fit their definition of fascist?

    Brian? wrote: »
    The guy has an a Wafen SS tattoo. Do you see it?


    Little Asian guy with a camera gets attacked for being a Fascist, Big biker dude who might hit back with an SS tattoo is left alone because he doesn't fit their definition of Fascism. Do you see it?


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    #1308
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,500 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Brian? wrote: »
    The guy has an a Wafen SS tattoo. Do you see it?

    He and ANTIFA will join together in fighting a group of Poles and then turn on each other, too alike to be colleagues.

    Part deux.


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    #1309
    20Cent
    Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Sweetemotion wrote: »
    Little Asian guy with a camera gets attacked for being a Fascist, Big biker dude who might hit back with an SS tattoo is left alone because he doesn't fit their definition of Fascism. Do you see it?

    Or maybe the biker dude wasn't at Portland.
    Seems like a nazi to me if he gets an ss tattoo.


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    #1310
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Sweetemotion wrote: »
    Little Asian guy with a camera gets attacked for being a Fascist, Big biker dude who might hit back with an SS tattoo is left alone because he doesn't fit their definition of Fascism. Do you see it?

    You don't think location has anything to do with it?

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1311
    20Cent
    Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Brian? wrote: »
    You don't think location has anything to do with it?

    Breaking: Antifa obey the laws of physics.


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    #1312
    Sweetemotion
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Sweetemotion


    Brian? wrote: »
    You don't think location has anything to do with it?


    Nope, I think they are just bullies targeting weaker opponents. Otherwise they would be fighting the bikers but they're not.


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    #1313
    20Cent
    Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Sweetemotion wrote: »
    Nope, I think they are just bullies targeting weaker opponents. Otherwise they would be fighting the bikers but they're not.

    They have always said they are counter protesting far right events. It's their critics who say they randomly attack anyone who "thinks differently".


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    #1314
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Sweetemotion wrote: »
    Nope, I think they are just bullies targeting weaker opponents. Otherwise they would be fighting the bikers but they're not.

    What the hell is the point of all this nonsense exactly?

    No one is defending their methods.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1315
    Sweetemotion
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Sweetemotion


    Brian? wrote: »
    What the hell is the point of all this nonsense exactly?

    No one is defending their methods.


    You're defending their nonsense, just look at the post you thanked before you wrote this post. :confused:


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    #1316
    Tasfasdf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 660 ✭✭✭Tasfasdf


    Sweetemotion wrote: »
    You're defending their nonsense, just look at the post you thanked before you wrote this post. :confused:

    Yeah I was quite puzzled when I read his post too.


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    #1317
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Sweetemotion wrote: »
    You're defending their nonsense, just look at the post you thanked before you wrote this post. :confused:

    Show me once where I have defended the methods of Antifa.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1318
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Tasfasdf wrote: »
    Yeah I was quite puzzled when I read his post too.

    You're easily confused so.

    I wrote a very detailed post about what I think of Antifa earlier.

    I object to people lying about them though.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1319
    Sweetemotion
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Sweetemotion


    Brian? wrote: »
    Show me once where I have defended the methods of Antifa.


    Do you condemn Antifa?


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    #1320
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Sweetemotion wrote: »
    Do you condemn Antifa?

    I condemn their use of violence. I’ve done so more than once now.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #1321
    Sweetemotion
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Sweetemotion


    Brian? wrote: »
    I condemn their use of violence. I’ve done so more than once now.

    I haven't seen them use anything else but violence.

    Here look, I know it must be hard for some people to condemn the name Anti-Fascist. They might have started out with good intentions but if you're the ones using violence as intimidation to try and silence any one with a different political view. You've become the fascist.


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