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Homeless junky aggression

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    #62
    Jimmy McGill
    Closed Accounts Posts: 287 ✭✭Jimmy McGill


    Gerry G wrote: »
    I was one for many years, now gladly retired. Unlike you, I didnt rely on the herald for my information.

    I'm sure you were. A couple of pages back you didn't know what powers the garda have to deal with junkies.


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    #63
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    There was a homeless person living near my old flat in Portobello. I used to see him sitting alone on the benches near Portobello College, in the middle of the night, or sleeping on the canal benches.

    Then someone gave him a tent, and he used to live there for a while. He was very friendly with the local community. I don't want to say too much about him as anyone local probably knows who I'm talking about, but he was a lovely guy and, in fact, a nice neighbour.

    There was nothing intimidating about him at all. I really think a lot of the people who are frightened by the homeless would baulk at their own shadow. Poverty isn't catching, you know.


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    #64
    donkeykong5
    Registered Users Posts: 7,259 ✭✭✭donkeykong5


    Jimmy McGill wrote: »
    Genuinely can't remember the last time I seen the Garda patrolling on foot around the city centre. It used to be a common sight up until circa 2008, now you never see them anymore.
    Gay pride parade a couple of weeks ago was covered with them.


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    #65
    Beechwoodspark
    Registered Users Posts: 15,425 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    A lot of them wouldn’t work in a fit but are the worst scoundrels and thieves for anything not secure.


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    #66
    AnMuinteoirOg
    Registered Users Posts: 121 ✭✭AnMuinteoirOg


    donkeykong5 wrote: »
    Gay pride parade a couple of weeks ago was covered with them.

    There is also one permanently on the GPO


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    #67
    Jimmy McGill
    Closed Accounts Posts: 287 ✭✭Jimmy McGill


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    There was a homeless person living near my old flat in Portobello. I used to see him sitting alone on the benches near Portobello College, in the middle of the night, or sleeping on the canal benches.

    Then someone gave him a tent, and he used to live there for a while. He was very friendly with the local community. I don't want to say too much about him as anyone local probably knows who I'm talking about, but he was a lovely guy and, in fact, a nice neighbour.

    There was nothing intimidating about him at all. I really think a lot of the people who are frightened by the homeless would baulk at their own shadow. Poverty isn't catching, you know.

    It's the ones that cause a public nuisance with free reign in the inner city that we have a problem with. Most of them would rob their own granny.


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    #68
    Beechwoodspark
    Registered Users Posts: 15,425 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    When I say scoundrel I mean

    The worst of the worst of the worst.


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    #69
    Infernal Racket
    Registered Users Posts: 1,418 ✭✭✭Infernal Racket


    Jimmy McGill wrote: »
    I'm sure you were. A couple of pages back you didn't know what powers the garda have to deal with junkies.

    Incorrect Jimmy, I asked another poster what powers the guards have to deal with them. You're not very good at this game are you? If you read a little more carefully rather than throwing out the old cliches, you might just learn a little.


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    #70
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Thelonious Monk wrote: »
    They're mostly from horrible backgrounds from horrible areas surrounded by horrible people and no one ever really cared about them. When heroin addiction is where you end up I'd probably be pretty angry with the world too.

    So you're saying theres plenty of people he could legitimately be annoyed at and abuse with just cause instead of harassing innocent people on the street going about their day?


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    #71
    Jimmy McGill
    Closed Accounts Posts: 287 ✭✭Jimmy McGill


    Gerry G wrote: »
    Incorrect Jimmy, I asked another poster what powers the guards have to deal with them. You're not very good at this game are you? If you read a little more carefully rather than throwing out the old cliches, you might just learn a little.

    Exactly, suggesting that you didn't know yourself. If you knew it all Inspector Clueso I'm sure you would've shared your knowledge with us instead of defending an inept police force at every opportunity.


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    #72
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Jimmy McGill wrote: »
    It's the ones that cause a public nuisance with free reign in the inner city that we have a problem with. Most of them would rob their own granny.

    I experienced theft myself a few weeks ago. I even wrote about it here. Someone (presumably an addict) stole my luggage full of clothes and kinda ruined a trip I was about to go on.

    So, I'm not living in some parallel universe. I understand that petty crime is correlated with homelessness and addiction. I'm just saying, there's no need to panic when you see a homeless person.

    You shouldn't leave precious belongings in front of them, but you don't need to run back to the suburbs either. Most homeless people are ordinary, decent folk just like anyone else.

    A lot of the commentary about them borders on the hysterical. I really don't know how some people manage to cross the street.


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    #73
    Infernal Racket
    Registered Users Posts: 1,418 ✭✭✭Infernal Racket


    Jimmy McGill wrote: »
    Exactly, suggesting that you didn't know yourself. If you knew it all Inspector Clueso I'm sure you would've shared your knowledge with us instead of defending an inept police force at every opportunity.

    Read it any way you like sir and keep taking those pot shots if it makes you feel better about yourself.


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    #74
    caff
    Registered Users Posts: 954 ✭✭✭caff


    I heard that a portion of the beggars are not addicts at all but in debt to loan sharks.


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    #75
    caff
    Registered Users Posts: 954 ✭✭✭caff


    Beechwoodspark wrote: »
    Fully agree

    As I said a few weeks ago

    Drug users detained into a secure location for treatment.

    Long term unemployed detained in a secure location working on some tasks

    Free travel - no way.

    Do some work and get clean before asking for even the most basic hand out
    Why not just give them heroin on prescription, some people just won't be able to get clean. If they are provided with safe free herion they won't be begging or stealing for it. It also ruins the gangs entire business model wiping out their profits. The way I look at it the only people benefiting from not doing this are the dealers and gangs.


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    #76
    Potential-Monke
    Registered Users Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    Jimmy McGill wrote: »
    They seem to have plenty of time for checkpoints and watching sky sports/playing pool in the station

    Checkpoints are assigned by the Super or higher, the Gardaií are assigned to those and have no choice unless the conditions dictate the checkpoint would be unsafe. It's not the Gardaií on the ground deciding these (the vast majority of the time). While they may be looking at tax/insurance/nct, it's also a highly valuable way of gathering intelligence.
    Jimmy McGill wrote: »
    So what about the pool tables and sky sports in garda stations thing?

    From my experience, the pool tables, gyms, etc are paid for by the GRA through member subs. Sky I believe is paid by the station. There was no Sky Sports on our Sky box.
    Jimmy McGill wrote: »
    You really believe they only watch it during their break? Especially if a sergeant or higher up rank isn't around? All on tax payers money to boot

    And you have proof they watch it during their working time?


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    #77
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    caff wrote: »
    Why not just give them heroin on prescription, some people just won't be able to get clean.

    Lets call it "Methadone"


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    #78
    ZilkyG
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 71 ✭✭ZilkyG


    caff wrote: »
    Why not just give them heroin on prescription, some people just won't be able to get clean. If they are provided with safe free herion they won't be begging or stealing for it. It also ruins the gangs entire business model wiping out their profits. The way I look at it the only people benefiting from not doing this are the dealers and gangs.

    Toss them in prison if they can't get clean. Government funded heroin is a stupid idea.


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    #79
    Thelonious Monk
    Registered Users Posts: 13,965 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    gctest50 wrote: »
    no ? this sort of thing going on :


    https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/past-champion-dog-handler-at-crufts-faces-prison-for-knife-point-muggings-936051.html

    That same f*cking scumbag killed someone I knew 21 years ago and got away with it. I hope to god every day is a nightmare for him.

    Literally let away with murdering an innocent man in a savage attack.


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    #80
    caff
    Registered Users Posts: 954 ✭✭✭caff


    ZilkyG wrote: »
    Toss them in prison if they can't get clean. Government funded heroin is a stupid idea.

    It works in other countries. Tossing them in prison costs money and you still don't address the drug dealing gang issue. As the Philippines shows even execution doesn't deter them as there is so much money in it.
    Making it illegal and not providing it through the health care system only provides and incentive to make millions off it. You'd think the drugs gangs are lobbying the government to keep it that way......


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    #81
    caff
    Registered Users Posts: 954 ✭✭✭caff


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    Lets call it "Methadone"

    Completely different the Swiss use heroin assisted treatment for a reason it works better.


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    #82
    Franz Von Peppercorn II
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn II


    caff wrote: »
    Completely different the Swiss use heroin assisted treatment for a reason it works better.

    It’s not completely different. It’s a government supplied opiate. We might as well use heroin now but I doubt if it’s going to help things much.


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    #83
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    caff wrote: »
    Completely different the Swiss use heroin assisted treatment for a reason it works better.
    How much better?

    I've tried to read a good deal on this issue, and the more I read, the more I am convinced that we need to focus on prevention.

    Those with serious heroin addictions are, quite sadly, fairly doomed.


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    #84
    kowloon
    Registered Users Posts: 13,407 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    ZilkyG wrote: »
    Toss them in prison if they can't get clean. Government funded heroin is a stupid idea.

    52joGBJ.png


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    #85
    caff
    Registered Users Posts: 954 ✭✭✭caff


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    How much better?

    I've tried to read a good deal on this issue, and the more I read, the more I am convinced that we need to focus on prevention.

    Those with serious heroin addictions are, quite sadly, fairly doomed.
    That the UK police are lobbying for it so they can starve the drug gangs on money, the only people against this are those who want to support the drug gangs. It's like you want to keep them in business https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/drug-addict-police-crime-heroin-treatment-addict-commissioner-west-midlands-david-jamieson-home-a8205651.html


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    #86
    Franz Von Peppercorn II
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn II


    kowloon wrote: »
    52joGBJ.png

    Trite. Ireland has a large social security state and a relatively low prison population.


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    #87
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    Potential-Monke wrote: »
    ...............

    it's also a highly valuable way of gathering intelligence.

    Might want to use the bit they were given sometimes :


    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/carlow-man-sues-garda%C3%AD-for-wrongful-arrest-over-savage-attack-on-fianc%C3%A9e-1.3952814


    How many hours were wasted over that fckup ?


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    #88
    corner of hells
    Registered Users Posts: 8,365 ✭✭✭corner of hells


    caff wrote: »
    That the UK police are lobbying for it so they can starve the drug gangs on money, the only people against this are those who want to support the drug gangs. It's like you want to keep them in business https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/drug-addict-police-crime-heroin-treatment-addict-commissioner-west-midlands-david-jamieson-home-a8205651.html

    Whether you place addicts on state provided heroin or methadone is not the issue , it's the plan to detox is what's needed.
    At the moment a methadone detox and rehab takes five months, before that you need to reach criteria for that detox and after the rehab at least two years of aftercare.
    Saying heroin provided by the state is better than methadone is pointless.


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    #89
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    corner of hells wrote: »
    Whether you place addicts on state provided heroin or methadone is not the issue , it's the plan to detox is what's needed.
    At the moment a methadone detox and rehab takes five months, before that you need to reach criteria for that detox and after the rehab at least two years of aftercare.
    Saying heroin provided by the state is better than methadone is pointless.


    Waste of € 200 million Euro, waste of time



    6,917 of addicts in Ireland have been on methadone for more than three years, with 3,048 of those recorded as taking methadone for a decade or longer


    https://m.herald.ie/news/3300-heroin-addicts-on-hse-methadone-for-more-than-10-years-at-a-cost-of-20mayear-31068636.html


    3,300 heroin addicts on HSE methadone for more than 10 years at a cost of €20M-a-year


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    #90
    corner of hells
    Registered Users Posts: 8,365 ✭✭✭corner of hells


    gctest50 wrote: »
    6,917 of addicts in Ireland have been on methadone for more than three years, with 3,048 of those recorded as taking methadone for a decade or longer




    https://m.herald.ie/news/3300-heroin-addicts-on-hse-methadone-for-more-than-10-years-at-a-cost-of-20mayear-31068636.html



    3,300 heroin addicts on HSE methadone for more than 10 years at a cost of €20M-a-year

    Along with very limited detox beds .

    Methadone, also known as liquid handcuffs.


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    #91
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,923 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    Visibility of our Police Force would be welcomed wholeheartedly by every law abiding citizen.

    It has nothing to do with sentencing or arrest or anything like that, it is optics for those paying for it to feel a bit safer around the capital city.

    Has to be done sooner rather than later. Drew Harris, over to you.


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