Life is too short for bad coffee - The Off Topic thread

juke · 19-04-2019 4:06pm

rubadub wrote: »

Does anybody know of any bricks & mortar shops/cafes in south dublin where you can get aeropress paper filters?

(I am aware of the metal ones)

Where are you? I have a load in D16 going unused.

Slaphead07 · 19-04-2019 5:09pm

rubadub wrote: »

Does anybody know of any bricks & mortar shops/cafes in south dublin where you can get aeropress paper filters?

(I am aware of the metal ones)

Nick's in Ranelagh has them, Fallon & Bryne too.

Richard Roma · 19-04-2019 7:32pm

juke wrote: »

Where are you? I have a load in D16 going unused.

Most independent specialty cafes (as opposed to a lunch place with tacked on coffee offering) should do it. Bought them in Kaph on Drury Street recently.

Day Lewin · 21-04-2019 11:11am

I've known people to actually cut them out, from ordinary Melitta conical filter papers!

rubadub · 21-04-2019 1:45pm

juke wrote: »

Where are you? I have a load in D16 going unused.

thanks a lot, I am asking on behalf of someone else and they are close to a Fallon & Byrne (thanks Slaphead07!) so they can try there first.

Richard Roma wrote: »

Most independent specialty cafes

that is what I thought, some have them listed online but I thought they might not be in the actual shops.

Day Lewin wrote: »

I've known people to actually cut them out, from ordinary Melitta conical filter papers!

that is what they are currently doing to get by! somebody should make a commercial cutting device for them.

Just found a reddit aeropress page, somebody using a 2.5" hole punch to make them. https://www.reddit.com/r/AeroPress/comments/730fyb/filter_cutterpunch_is_there_one/

lainey_d_123 · 23-04-2019 7:02pm

Not sure if this is the right thread for this. Moving into a flat with a friend and we've decided to treat ourselves to a capsule coffee machine since both of us love coffee and live so very frugally in most other ways that a treat would be really nice. I've previously just always used the Spanish style coffee pot or French press, so it's all new to me.

I've had coffee from Nespresso machines at friends' homes and been very impressed with it. One has the 'Citiz' model with the attached Aeroccino milk frother and it made a lovely latte, but she says it's a pain to clean and they tend to break easily (the Aeroccinos)? Another friend has a Tassimo machine but I wasn't really keen on the different pods or it. You can make latte, cappuccino, etc. but they taste a bit artificial and seem to use powdered milk or something and I'm not keen on that at all.

Would it be best to just go for the Nespresso if I like the coffee and the machine? There are so many different models, I don't really know where to start. Any advice about that or about the milk frother greatly appreciated!

limnam · 23-04-2019 9:10pm

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Not sure if this is the right thread for this. Moving into a flat with a friend and we've decided to treat ourselves to a capsule coffee machine since both of us love coffee

I'm confused.

You love coffee and want to treat yourself so going for capsule coffee?

Why not just buy an aeropress.

You can stay frugal and have coffee multiple times better than capsule machine.

That's not treating yourself. It's an expensive punishment.

igCorcaigh · 23-04-2019 9:16pm

I love aeropress. But do be aware that it has no crema. The texture is flat like tea. But very smooth.

limnam · 23-04-2019 9:17pm

igCorcaigh wrote: »

I love aeropress. But do be aware that it has no crema. The texture is flat like tea. But very smooth.

You can make crema.

You got no aeropress game. :pac:

igCorcaigh · 23-04-2019 9:35pm

limnam wrote: »

You can make crema.

You got no aeropress game. :pac:

Obviously not! Now I'm intrigued...

DaveyDave · 23-04-2019 9:52pm

Do Kaph have a good selection of coffees? I have a press and would like to get a grinder and some decent coffee.

Don't judge me, but there's one particular coffee in Starbucks I like to get. I think it says cocoa hints, the rest of their coffees are bitter or bland and I'm tired of hit and miss bags. Time to move up in the world.

lainey_d_123 · 24-04-2019 12:08am

limnam wrote: »

I'm confused.

You love coffee and want to treat yourself so going for capsule coffee?

Why not just buy an aeropress.

You can stay frugal and have coffee multiple times better than capsule machine.

That's not treating yourself. It's an expensive punishment.

I was perfectly happy with the Nespresso coffee I got at friends' houses, but will look into an Aeropress too!

s3rtvdbwfj81ch · 24-04-2019 7:36am

DaveyDave wrote: »

Don't judge me, but there's one particular coffee in Starbucks I like to get. I think it says cocoa hints, the rest of their coffees are bitter or bland and I'm tired of hit and miss bags. Time to move up in the world.

Could be the Medium or Light roast that Starbos do, I much prefer medium and light roast beans to the point where if the only coffee in a coffeeshop is dark roast, I'll order a different drink.

You do get a sweeter, more floral drink with the lighter roasts too.

But going from ground coffee that you brew yourself to a Nespresso is not moving up in the world. Not at all.

cnocbui · 01-05-2019 12:23am

Coen Glamorous User wrote: »

Could be the Medium or Light roast that Starbos do, I much prefer medium and light roast beans to the point where if the only coffee in a coffeeshop is dark roast, I'll order a different drink.

You do get a sweeter, more floral drink with the lighter roasts too.

But going from ground coffee that you brew yourself to a Nespresso is not moving up in the world. Not at all.

I find it hard to formulate a credible case against Nespresso when so many Michelin starred restaurants use it.

The Nal · 01-05-2019 12:52pm

DaveyDave wrote: »

Do Kaph have a good selection of coffees? I have a press and would like to get a grinder and some decent coffee.

Don't judge me, but there's one particular coffee in Starbucks I like to get. I think it says cocoa hints, the rest of their coffees are bitter or bland and I'm tired of hit and miss bags. Time to move up in the world.

Yeah the regular Kaph blend they use in the shop is lovely. Pricey though.

Bawnmore · 01-05-2019 2:42pm

cnocbui wrote: »

I find it hard to formulate a credible case against Nespresso when so many Michelin starred restaurants use it.

I've thought about this before too and still find it strange. If I'm eating somewhere nice and I get a coffee, I'll know it's a Nespresso when I get it and it's fine but not great by any means.

My thought would be that Michelin star restaurants use it to guarantee consistency by taking out the human element in making the coffee. Could just be me being a picky arsehole when it comes to coffee though - I'm sure it wouldn't matter to 99% of people.

The Nal · 01-05-2019 2:58pm

Do Michelin star restaurants use Nespresso?!

Bawnmore · 01-05-2019 3:53pm

The Nal wrote: »

Do Michelin star restaurants use Nespresso?!

I've read an article before that suggested about 40% of Michelin starred restaurants were using Nespresso. Most notable benefit being consistency.

The Nal · 01-05-2019 3:57pm

Bawnmore wrote: »

I've read an article before that suggested about 40% of Michelin starred restaurants were using Nespresso. Most notable benefit being consistency.

Hmm. Id be very surprised if that stat was still that high. People are waking up to the fact that Nespresso is fairly shít coffee.

cnocbui · 01-05-2019 4:13pm

The Nal wrote: »

Hmm. Id be very surprised if that stat was still that high. People are waking up to the fact that Nespresso is fairly shcoffee.

I grind my own coffee and have a nice espresso machine, but that statement just doesn't hold up to rational scrutiny. I don't want it to be true, but it seems beyond any doubt to me that that Nespresso 'can' be as good as any other method. The main variable is probably the quality and freshness of the coffee in the pods.

Julian Baggini wrote two years ago in Aeon magazine about how (then) more than 15 Michelin-starred restaurants in London used Nestle's Nespresso machines, as did more than 100 Michelin-starred restaurants in France and more than 20 Michelin-starred restaurants in Italy, with many others using espresso machines from Illy, Kimbo, Lavazza, and Segafredo. Those are some of the fanciest restaurants in the world choosing to use a capsule espresso machine rather than leave coffee to baristas.

Baggini held a blind taste test between a Nespresso and the espresso served by a barista in a two Michelin-starred restaurant. The Nespresso won hands down:

https://www.businessinsider.com/baristas-are-going-obsolete-2015-6?r=US&IR=T

limnam · 01-05-2019 4:15pm

cnocbui wrote: »

I find it hard to formulate a credible case against Nespresso when so many Michelin starred restaurants use it.

I'm not sure what level the Michelin inspectors are in regards to "cupping" :pac:

your removing a lot of the uncontrollable elements to making good coffee.

You don't need properly trained baristas

Don't see why it's that hard to understand why they use it.

But it's easy to understand why most "good" coffee shops do not.

It's a bit similar in not been able to find a case against Guinness. When the best pubs and hotels in the country all offer it.

The Nal · 01-05-2019 4:33pm

cnocbui wrote: »

I grind my own coffee and have a nice espresso machine, but that statement just doesn't hold up to rational scrutiny. I don't want it to be true, but it seems beyond any doubt to me that that Nespresso 'can' be as good as any other method. The main variable is probably the quality and freshness of the coffee in the pods.

Oh sure, some pods can be. Lavazza pods for example are lovely (but not as nice as freshly ground). Nespresso however, isn't.

caviardreams · 01-05-2019 7:21pm

Taste is subjective really. The likes of nespresso offer an option that seems to go down well with the average coffee drinker who may never have even experienced high quality coffee and don't know what they are missing out on for example.

You could draw parallels with chocolate (if you think I am a coffee snob, din't get me started on cacao

:D) Your cadbury, green & blacks and lindt are incredibly popular and appeal to many, but if you move in to the likes of valrhona, dolphin, zotter, pralus etc. you will never look back - the complexity of the flavour is another level, but many don't realise this as they have never tried it.

Richard Roma · 01-05-2019 8:31pm

Nespresso works well in Michelin Star restaurants because by the time you get to it your tastebuds have been pummeled half to death. A strong Nespresso, rather than a top notch subtle coffee, is a relief at that point.

That and money. I’d be surprised if Michelin Star restaurants have to pay for them.

rubadub · 01-05-2019 8:55pm

Richard Roma wrote: »

I’d be surprised if Michelin Star restaurants have to pay for them.

Why not? I doubt they are advertising the fact they use them so why would nescafe supply it free? Also nobody was claiming all they use was these machines, I expect they do regular filter coffee too.

I remember hearing something about espresso and espresso based drinks being poorly suited to restaurants due to the relatively long time to get to the tables.

In more expensive "gourmet" burger places you will see them usually use bog standard heinz ketchup and frenchs mustard, consistency appears to sell, though I still doubt many michelin star restaurants are screaming about using nespresso.

Richard Roma · 01-05-2019 9:20pm

rubadub wrote: »

Why not? I doubt they are advertising the fact they use them so why would nescafe supply it free? Also nobody was claiming all they use was these machines, I expect they do regular filter coffee too.

I remember hearing something about espresso and espresso based drinks being poorly suited to restaurants due to the relatively long time to get to the tables.

In more expensive "gourmet" burger places you will see them usually use bog standard heinz ketchup and frenchs mustard, consistency appears to sell, though I still doubt many michelin star restaurants are screaming about using nespresso.

Why not? The whole context of this conversation is Cnocbui’s post that he finds it hard to believe Nespresso is bad when most Michelin Star restaurants use them. It’s fantastic brand association which Nespresso heavily publicize. Patrick Guilbault (proprietor of Ireland’s only two Michelin starred restaurant) is their ‘brand ambassador’ in Ireland. Hestor Blumenthal is their UK brand ambassador.

I’d be very surprised if many Michelin Star restaurants do a choice of Nespresso or filter based on my experience.

rubadub · 01-05-2019 11:41pm

Richard Roma wrote: »

Why not?

ah right, I was unaware of this, so doubt they just get it free but reckon they must also get paid in some way or other. I would just not expect them to serve it, just like if a michelin star restaurant did ketchup or mayo I would not expect it to be heinz or hellmans available in dealz or tesco -even if the owner did prefer it I would think they would not have the cheek to be charging what I would guess they would.

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/food-and-drink/features/the-cult-of-nespresso-could-it-really-be-the-best-cup-of-coffee-money-can-buy-395944.html

If you visit Sketch in Mayfair, one of London's most glamorous party venues, where the Michelin-starred Library restaurant offers a carte main courses for upwards of £50, and boasts of offering an experience "at the very top of food", the £7 coffee they produce with your petits fours will also (though your waiter may not admit it) be a product of the same Nestlrand.

Price-wise, the product isn't bad value. The price of a 10-pack (of environmentally unfriendly) capsules is around £2.30

wersal gummage · 02-05-2019 12:16pm

Short question, would a dedicated espresso machine produce better coffee than an aeropress?? (I'm talking in the 300 euro range)...

Longer version... I use nespresso for espresso as I find it very decent, consistently... Have been using it for close to a decade. Prior to that I used a proper coffee machine but it was a palaver in the morning and sometimes excellent coffee, occasionally not great etc....

I use the aeropress for mugs of coffee, make a "shot" and top up from the kettle. I find the aeropress coffee noticeably better than nespresso in this way (mugs of coffee), but I find the espresso shots better, with crema etc, from the nespresso....

So basically thinking of replacing both the nespresso and aeropress with one proper espresso maker....

Bawnmore · 02-05-2019 12:21pm

wersal gummage wrote: »

Short question, would a dedicated espresso machine produce better coffee than an aeropress?? (I'm talking in the 300 euro range)...

Longer version... I use nespresso for espresso as I find it very decent, consistently... Have been using it for close to a decade. Prior to that I used a proper coffee machine but it was a palaver in the morning and sometimes excellent coffee, occasionally not great etc....

I use the aeropress for mugs of coffee, make a "shot" and top up from the kettle. I find the aeropress coffee noticeably better than nespresso in this way (mugs of coffee), but I find the espresso shots better, with crema etc, from the nespresso....

So basically thinking of replacing both the nespresso and aeropress with one proper espresso maker....

Yes and no. With a little practice fine tuning espresso (measuring beans, output etc.), you can get consistent results from an espresso machine. With €300, a Gaggia Classic is well within budget for example but the kicker is you'd need to have a good grinder to go with it to make it anyway worthwhile.

J_E · 11-05-2019 5:45pm

Bawnmore wrote: »

Yes and no. With a little practice fine tuning espresso (measuring beans, output etc.), you can get consistent results from an espresso machine. With €300, a Gaggia Classic is well within budget for example but the kicker is you'd need to have a good grinder to go with it to make it anyway worthwhile.

This is quite true. You're going to have a hard time getting any espresso machine to shine without a grinder that can consistently produce a good grind with accuracy and fine-tuning.

Life is too short for bad coffee - The Off Topic thread

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