Fighter jets for the Air Corps?

Heraldoffreeent · 14-01-2019 9:35pm

jonnybigwallet wrote: »

I think we'll have to put that fella SPARKY in charge of the entire defence of Ireland ! Sure the fella has the last word on everything.. the man is a military genius! If auld Jonny Hitler had him on board we would probably had a different outcome for WW2. God Bless him. Sure he's a grand auld divil. A genius !

He is a hell of a lot more clued in than your self.

sparky42 · 14-01-2019 9:57pm

jonnybigwallet wrote: »

I think we'll have to put that fella SPARKY in charge of the entire defence of Ireland ! Sure the fella has the last word on everything.. the man is a military genius! If auld Jonny Hitler had him on board we would probably had a different outcome for WW2. God Bless him. Sure he's a grand auld divil. A genius !

Never said any of the above, just that you tend to post a lot of "out there" suggestions.

As I've said Brazil has them, has the corporate knowledge of sustaining them and the industrial base to rebuild them to a new generation, so it makes sense for them to have gone down this route.

For us, buying surplus F5's and upgrading them to such a standard is utterly pointless, either the Gripen leasing option or F/A 50's would make much more sustainable sense (with current international trends I'd prefer European but that's just me).

Larbre34 · 16-01-2019 4:25am

European is indeed the way to go. In fact the Learjet is already the only non European airframe left in service. It would be the Gripen leasing option for me too.

Jonny Hitler must be an ancestor of our friend above. Figures.

prinzeugen · 17-01-2019 2:25am

sparky42 wrote: »

If the US wasn't going to let Croatia (a NATO nation) buy full up Israeli variants they aren't going to let us get them.

We could. Ireland is not a NATO member. The issue with Israeli jets is that they are kitted out with domestic avionics etc which is not compatible with NATO kit.

Also the US tends to block the sales of any aircraft that that Iran uses. So thats the F5 out. The US buys back all components of scrapped planes to stop Iran getting hold of spares on ebay etc (its happened).

Thats why there are almost no F4 phantoms in museums outside the US. It was a condition of sale.

sparky42 · 17-01-2019 2:31am

prinzeugen wrote: »

We could. Ireland is not a NATO member. The issue with Israeli jets is that they are kitted out with domestic avionics etc which is not compatible with NATO kit.

Actually in this case it seems to be that other Eastern EU/NATO members started asking for the same deal from Israel and the US demanded Israel turn them down, when they didn't the US pulled permission to sell.

A few days later Bulgaria announces they are buying new build F16v's from the States...

jonnybigwallet · 08-03-2019 7:53pm

I wonder when the PC12's are arriving? Two expected this year I believe.

Savage93 · 09-03-2019 9:22pm

jonnybigwallet wrote: »

I wonder when the PC12's are arriving? Two expected this year I believe.

Question and answer

jonnybigwallet · 10-03-2019 7:25pm

Now that's a clever chap!

jonnybigwallet · 11-03-2019 8:13pm

This discussion has become somewhat moribund of late.

Savage93 · 11-03-2019 9:11pm

jonnybigwallet wrote: »

This discussion has become somewhat moribund of late.

Maybe you should try MENSA or suchlike as we are obviously not intelligent enough to engage with you

jonnybigwallet · 12-03-2019 10:16pm

Good suggestion.

jonnybigwallet · 12-03-2019 10:16pm

Good suggestion.

Leonidas BL · 13-03-2019 1:45am

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

Should it be established, the Irish Air Force should have:

44 F-35A multirole fighter jets, 40 for operational use and 4 as conversion trainers.
4 P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft in addition to the 2 CASA aircraft.
6 Atlas C-1 and 6 C-17 transport aircraft.
8 Apache gunships, 56 Chinooks.
2 MQ-9 Reaper drones.
2 Airbus Voyager and 2 Learjet 45 aircraft as government jets.

That's probably more money than exists in this country lol

sparky42 · 13-03-2019 3:48am

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

It is achievable.

It's non-sensible.

jonnybigwallet · 13-03-2019 10:09am

It's a little over ambitious. I would suggest 8 Scorpion light attack aircraft or the Aeromacchi equivalent. 12 Gripens. 2 of them new Embraer military transports for troops and a Phenome jet for VIP use. Some lighter attack helicopters which could operate off ships would be handy as well.

Captain Chaos · 13-03-2019 10:16am

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

Should it be established, the Irish Air Force should have:

44 F-35A multirole fighter jets, 40 for operational use and 4 as conversion trainers.
4 P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft in addition to the 2 CASA aircraft.
6 Atlas C-1 and 6 C-17 transport aircraft.
8 Apache gunships, 56 Chinooks.
2 MQ-9 Reaper drones.
2 Airbus Voyager and 2 Learjet 45 aircraft as government jets.

That would be a better airforce than what most EU countries have lol.:D

Heraldoffreeent · 13-03-2019 8:56pm

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

Should it be established, the Irish Air Force should have:

44 F-35A multirole fighter jets, 40 for operational use and 4 as conversion trainers.
4 P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft in addition to the 2 CASA aircraft.
6 Atlas C-1 and 6 C-17 transport aircraft.
8 Apache gunships, 56 Chinooks.
2 MQ-9 Reaper drones.
2 Airbus Voyager and 2 Learjet 45 aircraft as government jets.

You're gettin' bored a' th'ould' Brexit Nige?

Heraldoffreeent · 13-03-2019 8:58pm

jonnybigwallet wrote: »

It's a little over ambitious. I would suggest 8 Scorpion light attack aircraft or the Aeromacchi equivalent. 12 Gripens. 2 of them new Embraer military transports for troops and a Phenome jet for VIP use. Some lighter attack helicopters which could operate off ships would be handy as well.

For once, Johnny makes a little more sense than another poster on the thread.

Its true that the longer you live, you will see everything.

Markcheese · 14-03-2019 2:22pm

Careless of me I know, but who is it we're planning on invading...?

ohnonotgmail · 14-03-2019 2:24pm

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

What the Irish Navy needs is:

12 patrol vessels.
8 frigates.
2 guided missile destroyers.
2 submarines.
Establishment of an Irish Marine Corps.

nuclear or diesel-electric?

sparky42 · 14-03-2019 4:10pm

Markcheese wrote: »

Careless of me I know, but who is it we're planning on invading...?

Waiting for Jonny to come in about Rockall...:P

sparky42 · 14-03-2019 4:11pm

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

What the Irish Navy needs is:

12 patrol vessels.
8 frigates.
2 guided missile destroyers.
2 submarines.
Establishment of an Irish Marine Corps.

Ah, what? Like seriously what?

Heraldoffreeent · 14-03-2019 7:51pm

Markcheese wrote: »

Careless of me I know, but who is it we're planning on invading...?

With that fleet, I'd fancy our chances against the Russians, problem is that it would take all 4.8 million of us to occupy them, and who would keep the lights on back here?

sparky42 · 14-03-2019 9:29pm

Heraldoffreeent wrote: »

With that fleet, I'd fancy our chances against the Russians, problem is that it would take all 4.8 million of us to occupy them, and who would keep the lights on back here?

Ah but its cold up there, couldn't we pick a nice sunny island chain to conquer just for a national holiday destination?

skooterblue2 · 14-03-2019 9:36pm

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

nuclear or diesel-electric?

Solar Duh!!! We can get Duncan Stuart to install solar panels on them, it would be great for the environment.

Psychlops · 14-03-2019 11:15pm

jonnybigwallet wrote: »

It's a little over ambitious. I would suggest 8 Scorpion light attack aircraft or the Aeromacchi equivalent. 12 Gripens. 2 of them new Embraer military transports for troops and a Phenome jet for VIP use. Some lighter attack helicopters which could operate off ships would be handy as well.

Why the scorpion? Its unproven, nice looking jet but why exactly? Why the new Embraer KC-390, also unproven, are you picking it because it was shown to the IAC? Also, who are we going to get to fly them? The AC is losing pilots quicker than getting them. DF as a whole has a huge manpower shortage.

sparky42 · 14-03-2019 11:28pm

Psychlops wrote: »

Why the scorpion? Its unproven, nice looking jet but why exactly? Why the new Embraer KC-390, also unproven, are you picking it because it was shown to the IAC? Also, who are we going to get to fly them? The AC is losing pilots quicker than getting them. DF as a whole has a huge manpower shortage.

There seems to always be an issue with the AC particularly for looking at "flashy new ****e" no matter whether it makes sense or not. I'd stick with airframes that are in more widespread use particularly look at those nations that we might be serving with (ie European designs). As to the manpower issue without question that's the huge outstanding issue.

prinzeugen · 15-03-2019 3:07am

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

Should it be established, the Irish Air Force should have:

44 F-35A multirole fighter jets, 40 for operational use and 4 as conversion trainers.
4 P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft in addition to the 2 CASA aircraft.
6 Atlas C-1 and 6 C-17 transport aircraft.
8 Apache gunships, 56 Chinooks.
2 MQ-9 Reaper drones.
2 Airbus Voyager and 2 Learjet 45 aircraft as government jets.

44 x F35A?? Lol! 10 x F16 are more realistic.

Ireland does not need the F35. 44 airframes in service at any point is what the RAF are looking at over the 40+ year timeframe of the aircraft.

sparky42 · 15-03-2019 5:14pm

Nigel Dodds wrote: »

20 F-35s for operations and 4 for traing. Would that be more realistic?

Subs would be diesel-electric BTW.

No, there's zero need for us to have a 5th gen fighter, particularly when we go from nothing to Jets. The Gripens would most likely be the utter high point.

Honestly none of the suggestions are realistic or sensible, even if we were going to increase defence spending even back to 90's level (1%).

Psychlops · 15-03-2019 10:31pm

At best we could hope to see is Hawk T2's, they are plumbed for AAM's.

Fighter jets for the Air Corps?

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