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Employer forcing me to work over Christmas

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  • 20-12-2018 10:50am
    #1
    IrishGirl18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭


    So 2018 hasn't been my greatest year, My mum got diagnosed with breast cancer back in August and its been a tough road since.
    My employers have been completely aware of this situation as you can imagine I had to take a few days off since August to attend appointments etc..
    Roll on November, my Brother got called to go overseas for 6 months with the army as they were short and needed an extra body. Because of this my Mum would be on her own for Christmas if I wasn't there.
    I explained this to my employer back in November and they said they would try their best.
    Its getting closer and closer to Christmas and im in constant contact asking about Christmas, each time I get no reply.
    I received a message from manager this morning saying my roster is the same, 8-5 monday to friday. Meaning im working all over Christmas yet yesterday when I had a meeting with a manager they said we'll try work something out for Christmas day only.
    I explained to them that as I do not drive and there is no buses Christmas Day I would not be able to get into work, everyone I know is not working Christmas so there is no one to grab a lift off, not only that but my Mum lives down the country while I work and live in Dublin so getting down to her would be impossible. I asked about a regional manager giving me a lift as they done so back in March in the snow to get everyone into work, their reply was "we'll see the closer it gets" (??).
    To top it all of, they want me to fill the position of supervisor over the Christmas but not get paid extra just my basic rate ?

    I would really appreciate some advice on what my options are or if I even have any options.

    Thanks in advance!

    EDIT:
    Juts thought I would add that this company is "Irelands largest employer" in this particular work field so there is plenty of cover work to replace me for two days.
    Tagged:


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Comments

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    #2
    mikekerry
    Registered Users Posts: 613 ✭✭✭mikekerry


    they want you to work xmas day?
    I presume you get double -time?
    that sounds like a terrible place to work


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    #3
    IrishGirl18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭IrishGirl18


    mikekerry wrote: »
    they want you to work xmas day?
    I presume you get double -time?
    that sounds like a terrible place to work


    I think its time and a third, im not too sure.


    Its a little bix toxic to be honest but I need this job


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    #4
    Cushie Butterfield
    Registered Users Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    Consider bringing her to stay with you in Dublin for the Christmas period.


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    #5
    cruizer101
    Registered Users Posts: 3,205 ✭✭✭cruizer101


    What sort of work do you do, it is very uncommon to have to work christmas day, outside of emergency services.
    And normally it should be timetabled well in advance so it is clear.
    That said it is just a public holiday so your entitlements are the same as for others.

    On a Public Holiday All workers are entitled to one of these :
    A paid day off on the public holiday
    An additional day of annual leave
    An additional day’s pay
    A paid day off within a month of the public holiday

    Sounds like a crappy place to work mind I'd be looking for something else.


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    #6
    IrishGirl18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭IrishGirl18


    Cushie Butterfield wrote: »
    Consider bringing her to stay with you in Dublin for the Christmas period.


    Shes not really fit to travel to be honest


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    #7
    mikekerry
    Registered Users Posts: 613 ✭✭✭mikekerry


    "Consider bringing her to stay with you in Dublin for the Christmas period"
    what ! she is working xmas, day, do you expect her mother to come up to Dublin for the day out of the family home and wait in an apartment or house until she comes home.
    seriously.


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    #8
    IrishGirl18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭IrishGirl18


    cruizer101 wrote: »
    What sort of work do you do, it is very uncommon to have to work christmas day, outside of emergency services.
    And normally it should be timetabled well in advance so it is clear.
    That said it is just a public holiday so your entitlements are the same as for others.

    On a Public Holiday All workers are entitled to one of these :
    A paid day off on the public holiday
    An additional day of annual leave
    An additional day’s pay
    A paid day off within a month of the public holiday

    Sounds like a crappy place to work mind I'd be looking for something else.


    I work in Security, the site im on has to be manned 24/7.
    Ive already used all my holidays plus a few unpaid days & a couple days of force Majeure leave, I pretty much have nothing left to take off and thats what their saying


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    #9
    Pintman Paddy Losty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,913 ✭✭✭Pintman Paddy Losty


    Call in sick. Fcuk them. You've tried to sort it out.


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    #10
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,277 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Sounds illegal


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    #11
    mikekerry
    Registered Users Posts: 613 ✭✭✭mikekerry


    just call in sick and look for a new job in the year.
    there are plenty of jobs going in Dublin.
    there's more to life to than taking crap like that


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    #12
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    This sounds like a pretty crap scenario, but it also sounds like whatever the company is, is always open on Xmas day. So somebody has to draw the short straw, and this year it's you.

    And given that you've already had exceptional time made available to you for family reasons, it's going to be hard to argue that you should get Xmas off because "Family". Especially if you didn't book Xmas off months in advance.

    So arguing it based on any pseudo-legal basis is not going to fly. Time and a third is awful compensation for Xmas, but they don't really have to compensate you extra anyway. Bonus pay for standing in as supervisor for a short period is also not a requirement.

    You need to attack this from a practical point of view;

    - Are there any colleagues who don't do Xmas or don't care about Xmas (there's always at least one), who would take the shift for you?

    - Explain that you have no physical way of getting to work on Xmas Day and ask them to arrange a taxi for you to & from home. This is typical in most companies for Xmas day, and it's not a big expense for them.

    - Assuming you're going to be stuck working Xmas, get your Mum to come up and stay with you, so at least you can do Xmas together, even if you do have to work. You don't have to go to her house.

    Outside of that your only real option is to press the nuclear button, forwarn them that you won't be in work for 2/3 days, and just deal with the consequences when you come back.


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    #13
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/leave_and_holidays/public_holidays_in_ireland.html

    From the link:
    You may ask your employer at least 21 days before a public holiday, which of the alternatives will apply. If your employer does not respond at least 14 days before the public holiday, you are entitled to take the actual public holiday as a paid day off.

    You asked what was happening with working over Christmas more than 21 days before the public holiday and they replied to you today, less than 14 days before the public holiday. That, in my eyes, means you are entitled to have the time off. Pointing this out to your employer might not make you very popular with them however.


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    #14
    Sonics2k
    Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Sonics2k


    cgcsb wrote: »
    Sounds illegal

    It is absolutely not illegal to have someone work on Christmas day.

    The vast majority of call centres for example will open as normal on Christmas day, they just might be a bit more generous with PTO.


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    #15
    c6ysaphjvqw41k
    Closed Accounts Posts: 466 ✭✭c6ysaphjvqw41k


    IrishGirl18 wrote: »
    I think its time and a third, im not too sure.


    Its a little bix toxic to be honest but I need this job

    They have to pay you double time, or give you a day back. Not sure if they are giving you time and a third and a day back. If so they are giving you a little extra. If not they need to either make it double or give you the day back. Same for Stephens Day and all bank holidays. My sister always used to have to work Christmas Day and she isn't emergency services. She was a petrol station manager and certain ones had to be open on xmas day to supply emergency vehicles. She did it for a few years then moved on.


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    #16
    IrishGirl18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭IrishGirl18


    I actually applied for Christmas off back in January but I didnt know old emails automatically delete after three months so I could not prove it but I just accepted that


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    #17
    ratracer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,218 ✭✭✭ratracer


    IrishGirl18 wrote: »
    I work in Security, the site im on has to be manned 24/7.
    Ive already used all my holidays plus a few unpaid days & a couple days of force Majeure leave, I pretty much have nothing left to take off and thats what their saying

    It doesn’t seem like the employer is being unreasonable here. You’ve had all the time off you are legally entitled to. The short notice is a pain, but when/ how far in advance does your normal roster be given to you?
    Can anyone else that works with you swap with you for the day?
    It’s sucks, but that’s the nature of the job you are in.
    Seems your options are 1) Quit, 2) call in sick, although you’ve tried so hard to get off this will be seen for what it is and possibly lead to disciplinary action.,


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    #18
    Cushie Butterfield
    Registered Users Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    mikekerry wrote: »
    "Consider bringing her to stay with you in Dublin for the Christmas period"
    what ! she is working xmas, day, do you expect her mother to come up to Dublin for the day out of the family home and wait in an apartment or house until she comes home.
    seriously.
    Yes, seriously, although I didn’t suggest just for the day.
    It may be the family home but considering there’ll be no family in it she’d be alone in it otherwise. OP will only be gone 8am to 5pm, at least she could spend the evenings with her only family.

    It’s really not that outrageous a suggestion, considering she’d be alone otherwise.


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    #19
    washman3
    Registered Users Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    Surely a workmate can work a swap with you considering your situation.
    Used to do it all the time in a previous place where I worked.


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    #20
    IrishGirl18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭IrishGirl18


    washman3 wrote: »
    Surely a workmate can work a swap with you considering your situation.
    Used to do it all the time in a previous place where I worked.


    Theres only Three per team per building and they already has it booked off


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    #21
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    AlmightyCushion wrote: »
    You asked what was happening with working over Christmas more than 21 days before the public holiday and they replied to you today, less than 14 days before the public holiday. That, in my eyes, means you are entitled to have the time off. Pointing this out to your employer might not make you very popular with them however.
    Yeah, but....
    IrishGirl18 wrote: »
    I actually applied for Christmas off back in January but I didnt know old emails automatically delete after three months so I could not prove it but I just accepted that
    So the OP knew what the story was with Xmas, all year.

    It's also worth noting OP, that just because you applied for Xmas off, doesn't entitle you to get it. So having sent the email is less important than whether they replied and said you'd been granted Xmas off. If they replied at the time and said no, then there's not much you can do.

    I really think finding a workmate to swop is your best option. It's very late in the day, but there may be someone who already knows that they're going to spend the day watching TV and feeling uncomfortable and might prefer to earn some money instead.


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    #22
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,732 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Anastasia Few Styrofoam wrote: »
    They have to pay you double time, or give you a day back.

    Note the OR in that statement: effectively you just get the paid day at some other time.

    OP surely your mother has a friend or neighbour at home who they could spend some time with on the day? Yes it sucks - but you work in a 24x7 industry so it shouldn't be a surprise. Especially if you know you have no leave left.


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    #23
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,294 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    IrishGirl18 wrote: »
    I think its time and a third, im not too sure.


    Its a little bix toxic to be honest but I need this job

    and a third

    f**k that

    is that even legal?


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    #24
    JMNolan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,075 ✭✭✭JMNolan


    IrishGirl18 wrote: »
    I work in Security, the site im on has to be manned 24/7.
    Ive already used all my holidays plus a few unpaid days & a couple days of force Majeure leave, I pretty much have nothing left to take off and thats what their saying

    Geez, not sure what you can do to be honest. I worked security for years and someone has to work Christmas... Tough situation, call in sick perhaps? This won't help you in the long run but you'll be off Christmas day.


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    #25
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    While I sympathise with your situation, if you call in sick one of your colleagues who has booked the day off will be called in to cover you.

    As this will be unexpected & unaccounted for, it will upend all their plans and potentially ruin their Christmas. Imagine getting that phone call Christmas day and how gutted you'd be if that happened you.

    Try to resolve it before it comes to that if possible. I do strongly sympathise with your issue but I have to agree that your employers have been more than reasonable with their efforts to accommodate you over the course of the year, and I don't think they are being unreasonable by expecting you to work.


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    #26
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    seamus wrote: »
    Yeah, but....

    So the OP knew what the story was with Xmas, all year.

    It's also worth noting OP, that just because you applied for Xmas off, doesn't entitle you to get it. So having sent the email is less important than whether they replied and said you'd been granted Xmas off. If they replied at the time and said no, then there's not much you can do.

    I really think finding a workmate to swop is your best option. It's very late in the day, but there may be someone who already knows that they're going to spend the day watching TV and feeling uncomfortable and might prefer to earn some money instead.

    The OP did not know. I'm assuming some people have the days off so OP didn't know they would be working those days. They asked what is happening and the employer only replied today which is less that 14 days before the public holiday. Going by what is in the link I posted above, after the OP asked (whether that was in January or November) and the employer did not reply until today, so that would entitle them to the days off as a paid day off.


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    #27
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,191 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    You work in a 24/7 industry, on a small team and you are scheduled to work christmas day. You have already used up all your holidays and extra time off has already been accommodated by the employer over the last few months.

    You don't want to work christmas day because your mum will be on her own and it will be difficult for you to get to work.

    Those are the facts here, and based on those facts I suspect most people would have a little sympathy for the employer, they need to operate their business after all.

    Does the fact that your mum is sick change everything? Does it give you more right to christmas day off than your colleagues?


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    #28
    SortingYouOut
    Registered Users Posts: 1,374 ✭✭✭SortingYouOut


    Quit and get a new job.

    You have one mother who won't be around forever and you don't know how things will go. You'll be able to get another job in this climate.

    Beverly Hills, California



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    #29
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    bucketybuck wrote: »

    Does the fact that your mum is sick change everything? Does it give you more right to christmas day off than your colleagues?

    Excellent point. The colleague who will be called in to cover you if you pull a sicky may have their own family issues going on at the moment.
    They could also really need the day to look after their families.


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    #30
    shanno66
    Registered Users Posts: 20 ✭shanno66


    Just tell whatever contracts manager you deal with from g4s that if they roster you in christmas day you will not be there.

    Theres really not much they can do and all the other big companys are screaming out for workers at the moment.

    The security industry is the worse for stuff like this and you really have to stand your ground. Theres too much work out there to be taking this crap from them.

    Stop asking them and start telling them you are not available to work those days.

    Best of luck


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    #31
    elderberry
    Registered Users Posts: 146 ✭✭elderberry


    lawred2 wrote: »
    and a third

    f**k that

    is that even legal?

    No it's not, should be double pay.


This discussion has been closed.
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