Making A Murderer [Netflix - Documentary Series]

Mountainsandh wrote: »

Both are hunters and so are often "handling" blood (when dressing game : collecting it, mopping/wiping it off...they probably would know more about blood handling than you and I). She is not blaming the cops for the blood. She mentioned dilution and using a rag instead of the more sophisticated syringe or swab during the program (dilution fitted with the shape and looks of the drops iirc).

Do hunters plant blood?

Tipsy McSwagger wrote:

There’s no way either Bobby or Scott would know how to plant the blood evidence. Most people wouldn’t be able to do it, It’s not a straight forward thing to do. Zellner is blaming the cops for planting the blood in MaM, who next Averys mother?

You could also argue that Steven and Brendan wouldn't have known how to clean up the supposed blood in the trailer and the garage.

This case constantly brings up more questions than answers. I'm not sure of their guilt nor innocence.

Thepoet85 wrote: »

You could also argue that Steven and Brendan wouldn't have known how to clean up the supposed blood in the trailer and the garage.

This case constantly brings up more questions than answers. I'm not sure of their guilt nor innocence.

I think this is exactly where KZ wants people to be. Remember, she is looking to make a case for reasonable doubt.
She is not an investigator either, so the theories that she presents are just that, and they all have one purpose : establish reasonable doubt, present other potential criminals, so that a retrial is inevitable.

She says herself, she tries hard to find out who else could have done it, but ultimately, she doesn't have to.

She simply has to present enough evidence, or dismantle enough evidence to create doubt. I think she's got that, and more than enough.

She's smart though, and she knows that she also has to work on people :

a) Bobby and Scott, who, with everyday that passes without a disclaimer, are incriminating themselves a bit more. If they are innocent, surely at this stage they should come forward (lawyered up as suitable) and talk to her, give an affidavit of their version, or somewhat publicly (at least in some official manner) deny at least parts of what she is saying. Family members and other witnesses, who can surely feel the heat too. There could be one ready to crack.

b) Public opinion : as she stated, the more publicity, the more pressure, the best chance of having a case retrialed.

c) the DA and other officials who hold the reigns of the justice system. She is very subtly starting to present an opportunity for them to be the heroes everyone's been waiting for, to be the good guys who finally restored justice and stopped corruption in its tracks.
Who knows, there could be a cop about to crack too, there could be one weighing the for and against a disclosure at this point, to save their own back (to an extent) before the **** hits the fan.


Tipsy, re-your earlier comment, I can't reply for the piece of straw stuck in my eye.









I think if KZ gets the results she expects from a forensic examination of Bobby's garage (Teresa's blood or DNA), and if she has a definite proof that the replaced battery came from a recent cops car (so it can't be argued that it was a cops car bought by the ASY for parts), these will give a more definite credibility to her theories, which is bound to help. (we probably won't be told that until MaM3 though, or a retrial )

How are they allowed to analyse bobby garage and surely at this stage there is nothing left?

the whole year inn wrote: »

How are they allowed to analyse bobby garage and surely at this stage there is nothing left?

Sunflower 27 wrote: »

I'm off today so going to watch some of series 1 again in light of the new information. That will be interesting.

Something that always seemed odd to me: Bobby and Scott were very quick to point the finger at Steven and lie even though in doing so they were also implicating Brendan. What would possess a brother and a man sleeping with Brendan's mother to do that.? I can't think of anything unless they were protecting themselves.

I started rewatching series 2 myself, but never followed up. It's hard to find the time.

I agree re-Bobby and Scott.

Of note is that Bobby does not visit Brendan in prison, for all the excuses given in the series by Barb and Scott ("it's too hard for him... he's got his own kids now...").

Poor Brendan really pulled the short straw in life, and imo, he's just not clever enough to understand the wider picture of what's happened to him.

It's a tragic and sobering thought that when he does get out of jail, he's more likely to join the dots. How horrible to realize that your own Mum and brother left you rot in jail for so long just to save their own asses.

Blaine and Bryan then are also likely to feel terrible about it all, but at least they seem to be talking to Zellner in the background, now that they're older.


When I was watching MaM, I kind of liked Barb. Now I look at what she's doing to her own family and I think "how could you ?".

I'm off too by the way, so here's a bit of info to share for people who might not follow all this on Twitter and Facebook : people are starting to mention this case of missing person from 2006 : Deidre Harm went missing, a guy got caught for that but he committed suicide in prison, all in WI.
There might be nothing in it but the portrait and tattoo are food for thought.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=466197&d=1542358557

Mountainsandh wrote: »

I started rewatching series 2 myself, but never followed up. It's hard to find the time.

I agree re-Bobby and Scott.

Of note is that Bobby does not visit Brendan in prison, for all the excuses given in the series by Barb and Scott ("it's too hard for him... he's got his own kids now...").

Poor Brendan really pulled the short straw in life, and imo, he's just not clever enough to understand the wider picture of what's happened to him.

It's a tragic and sobering thought that when he does get out of jail, he's more likely to join the dots. How horrible to realize that your own Mum and brother left you rot in jail for so long just to save their own asses.

Blaine and Bryan then are also likely to feel terrible about it all, but at least they seem to be talking to Zellner in the background, now that they're older.


When I was watching MaM, I kind of liked Barb. Now I look at what she's doing to her own family and I think "how could you ?".

Poor Brendan confessed to his mother and on the stand that he was complicit in the crime. Oh wait he was following a ‘narrative’ planted by those nasty cops, that he could not deviate from outside an interrogation room, hilarious. This slow (not mentally retarded) teenager (not child) was actually the most decent person out of the lot of them, who went to school and looked after his younger brother. He was sexually abused by Steven Avery (one of many) but still idolized him. Avery is a scumbag who not only murdered TA but also ruined his nephews life.

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Poor Brendan confessed to his mother and on the stand that he was complicit in the crime. Oh wait he was following a ‘narrative’ planted by those nasty cops, that he could not deviate from outside an interrogation room, hilarious. This slow (not mentally retarded) teenager (not child) was actually the most decent person out of the lot of them, who went to school and looked after his younger brother. He was sexually abused by Steven Avery (one of many) but still idolized him. Avery is a scumbag who not only murdered TA but also ruined his nephews life.

A teenager is a child.
slow = mentally retarded.
Nasty cops : yes.

Sunflower 27 wrote: »

Unless he covered it somehow to make him look more straight and innocent.

............because all tattooed people are guilty criminals ??? Really? Ffs!!

I hope you don't end up on jury duty :rolleyes:

Sunflower 27 wrote: »

I saw that pic, the tattoo is quite low down the arm and I think would have been visible with the polo shirt he wore at trial, which has shortish sleeves.

Yeah, not sure.
Maybe Brad Dassey'd be able to help with that, he's on the group I follow on Facebook, but he's in Facebook prison until Sunday as he posted screenshots of Barb's text messages to his phone, and her phone number was up on them !

Either way Zellner knows about these missing girls' cases so if there was anything to it she's sure to be on it. She did mention "serial killer" in one of her Tweets, so it caught peoples' eyes, but she could have been talking in general.

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Zellner is blaming the cops for planting the blood in MaM, who next Averys mother?

Zellner said yesterday it can't have been the cops who transferred the blood. It had to have been someone who knew it was SA's blood and the cops would not have know that.

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Avery claims the blood was taken 4 days after TA went missing, his taillight story. Zellner takes this as fact and does a reconstruction in MaM blaming the cops. She’s changing her tune now to fit her narrative. There’s no way those 2 yokels would know how to plant blood evidence.

SHE'S CHANGING HER TUNE TO FIT HER NARRATIVE ?

Well duh ! Of course she is.

She is considering every and all possibility in this case, and attempting to find evidence for any and every theory.

Of course, she's going to uphold and then discard some scenarios.

I can't believe you'd even use that as a bloody argument Tipsy, cop on now really.


Zellner's new theory, now that she has discarded the previous one (ffs), is that the killer only would have known that Steven's wound had reopened, and that the killer only would have had access to Steven's trailer when needed.

So it has to have been either Scott or Bobby, according to her, who collected the blood. That person would have been in a state of panic after the police visited the same day.

It doesn't really take a genius to figure that any bit of blood, be it diluted or not, would lead to someone in particular. It doesn't take a genius to wipe the blood with a piece of cloth, wet it a bit, and wring it over the spots you want to contaminate. (of course it would help if you were used to butchering deers and dealing with the blood)