Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

If Collins, Murkawski and Flake all say they will not vote to confirm Kavanaugh without the FBI investigation, then McConnell can't force through diddly squat. He'll lose the vote.

Duck Soup wrote: »

Will somebody please peel President Trump off the ceiling.

CBS are saying he is rather relaxed over it, he did actually like Ford Yesterday. It will be Mc Connell on the war path for now not him.

Pelvis wrote: »

If they can prove that she lied, then yes.

If they lie to the FBI, then the FBI can charge them but I'm not sure that the FBI will be looking for perjury charges arising from the senate testimony. Like I said, I'm not sure so I may need to be corrected on this. I have doubts because I thought that one of Mueller's perps was charged with lying to the senate. I'll go look it up and get back later.

Duck Soup wrote: »

If Collins, Murkawski and Flake all say they will not vote to confirm Kavanaugh without the FBI investigation, then McConnell can't force through diddly squat. He'll lose the vote.

Pretty big if

Looking forward to Trump's measured take on this later!

McConnell has Democrats he could work on too for the numbers. I'm hopeful of a week delay, but I'm not expecting it right now.

McConnell has spent his entire political life dedicated to a goal, I can't see how backing off it easily.

Rjd2 wrote: »

CBS are saying he is rather relaxed over it, he did actually like Ford Yesterday. It will be Mc Connell on the war path for now not him.

DJT just on a spray along with some dude from Chile.... Seems quite sanguine about it alright. Quite measured and statesman-like in fact... Gave props to both Ford and Kavanaugh... Possibly he'll be screaming at the remote later, but for now that seemed very measured...

Rjd2 wrote: »

CBS are saying he is rather relaxed over it, he did actually like Ford Yesterday. It will be Mc Connell on the war path for now not him.

Just seen the interview, he is genuinely relaxed and was very respectful towards Collins, Ford etc. Absolutely astonishing how respectful he was.

Probably tweeting madness in a few hours now I said that. :eek:

Give him time, he was caught on the hop and as Graham said, someone is going to have to explain to Trump what has actually happened, which will probably be him

When he actually understands the potential ramifications we will see the real Trump appear

mcmoustache wrote: »

If they lie to the FBI, then the FBI can charge them but I'm not sure that the FBI will be looking for perjury charges arising from the senate testimony. Like I said, I'm not sure so I may need to be corrected on this. I have doubts because I thought that one of Mueller's perps was charged with lying to the senate. I'll go look it up and get back later.

OK. Sam Patten appears to have pleaded guilty to misleading the senate as part of his plea with Mueller so I don't know how this really works.

What Sam Patten pleaded guilty to doing

According to the criminal information document filed by the DC US attorney’s office, Patten and Kilimnik (who is not named but referred to as “Foreigner A”) founded a lobbying and consulting company together. They did campaign work in Ukraine and lobbying work in the US, and were paid over $1 million between 2015 and 2017.
Specifically, the document claims that Patten contacted members of Congress and their staffers, State Department officials, and members of the press on behalf of his Ukrainian clients — all without registering under the Foreign Agents Registration Act, as required by law.
Patten also admits to helping his Ukrainian oligarch client get around the prohibition on foreign donations to Donald Trump’s inauguration committee. The oligarch sent $50,000 to Patten’s company, and then he gave that money to a US citizen, who bought the four tickets. The tickets were given to the oligarch, Kilimnik, another Ukrainian, and Patten himself.
Finally, Patten also admits to misleading the Senate Intelligence Committee and withholding documents from them during testimony this January.

Duck Soup wrote: »

Good point made on MSNBC - Flake wouldn't have put himself out on a limb on this unless he was absolutely sure he had back-up from Collins and Murkawski.

Looks to be confirmed.

Yup, Murkawski now confirming she's supporting Flake. I'd assume Collins will shortly follow suit.

Now, only Trump can order the FBI investigation, but without it McConnell will lose the vote.

Duck Soup wrote: »

Good point made on MSNBC - Flake wouldn't have put himself out on a limb on this unless he was absolutely sure he had back-up from Collins and Murkawski.

This is true. Interestingly it was speculated that Manchen was going to vote for Kav as he really likes the guy, this has stopped him and other nervous red state dems in there tracks.

Its crazy as it did look like Mitch had played a blinder in getting the party behind Kav and maybe even got a few red state dems, but this is up in the air now.

Mitch could push the vote through, but Flake and the red state dems will want the week at very least to investigate. Mitch even with all his ruthlessness and Koch brothers influence can't win this vote without the investigation.

The grandstanding from both sides and talk of 'optics' is unseemly to the point of being uncomfortable. Not a backbone among them.

I'm seeing the fact that the matter is now back with Mitch is Senator Grassley passing the poisoned chalice along the GOP hierarchy-line.

Mahogany Gaspipe wrote: »

Why did you post this particular screen shot?

It is a fair reflection of his appearance yesterday...he was angry.

I am totally anti-trump and pretty strongly anti-republican in general but I must say I am torn over this whole thing. It is really a very tough situation all round but they do seem to finally have come to a sensible solution of a quick investigation. Even Trump is being pretty sensible about it so far (there's a thing I never thought I'd say).

As for Kavanaugh...I understand his anger yesterday and have no issue at all with that. If I was accused like that and innocent, I would probably react the same. On the other hand, he DID lie yesterday also repeatedly. Flatulence my arse!!! Drinking game? I don't think so.
I honestly don't know though if he is actually guilty of something or just liked to party (which is fine). It is a no-brainer to investigate or at least just ask the only other person who was (possibly) there.

To sum up....Lindsey Graham and Grassley are dicks. Booker and Harris are dicks. Flake seems to have character and hopefully, he sticks to his guns and gets backup.