Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

Roger Hassenforder · 03-04-2018 10:59PM

Mrsmum wrote: »

Look, is it that the only rapes you see as 'real' are hit you over the head types or taboo relationships types ? No, consent classes would never stop those. But lots of rapes are committed by 'friends' where guys take no to mean persuade me further. Consent classes would certainly help in this area. .

In the absence of empirical evidence, we're at an impasse. But delivering consent classes for the men of Ireland , because the mob demand it, and coralling them into classes, isnt the answer. (C.f my earlier post, back maybe 10 pages which i strongly believe is the default Irish male attitude to rape, as it appears you have not.)

But we do need better sex education for our kids, teaching them our acts have consequences, responsibility for ourselves and others, and yes, consent would be an important element. As would teaching kids that unintended and undesirable consequences can arise in intimate relationships, that exercising caution, or ensuring the welfare of your friends is important, thats neither victim blaming or exonerating offenders, but ensuring they have the language and ability to express themselves.

Roger Hassenforder · 03-04-2018 11:01PM

tayto lover wrote: »

I have a serious culture of eating crisps.

User name checks out!

GreeBo · 03-04-2018 11:05PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

Correct, it exists to tackle organised crime, in which there is a culture of murder! Whether we like to admit that this is also a part of Irish culture is another thing.

Answer me this. Why are League of Ireland games so heavily policed?

hill16bhoy wrote: »

Do you believe there is a culture of racism amongst, say, members of the BNP or the EDL in Britain or the National Front in France?

Was there a culture of racism in English football crowds in the 1970s?

A culture of racism is a racist culture.

Do y'all know what a culture is?

You can't pick a specific minority and then decide the majority are defined by the behavior of the minority.

Bambi985 · 03-04-2018 11:06PM

https://twitter.com/cgilroy14/status/981289542278893568

FrancieBrady · 03-04-2018 11:08PM

Bambi985 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/cgilroy14/status/981289542278893568

I would imagine that is designed with his solicitors to make the way clear for a return to rugby.

Fann Linn · 03-04-2018 11:08PM

GreeBo wrote: »

Do y'all know what a culture is?

You can't pick a specific minority and then decide the majority are defined by the behavior of the minority.

They're making it up as they go along. They have a full list a few pages back of their own definitions.

Roger Hassenforder · 03-04-2018 11:10PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

Hang on a minute, inserting inflammatory phrases that I never mentioned is not on. By all means argue your position, but that is unnecessary.

I NEVER made a claim that there was a prevalent rape culture....NEVER.

I no longer take offence because I have, what I feel, is a better understanding of its meaning.

I think you are referring to a culture of respect for women, I will let Irish women be judge of that.

We have a culture of spoof also, like kissing the Blarney stone...

Ah heor.
You've claimed we've a rape culture.
Ive asked you about rate of prevalence, you've nolens volens failed to answer.

So lets recap for the cheap seats;
Have we a rape culture in Ireland?
How prevalent is it, would you think a large majority/small minoriy/insignificant number of Irish males subscrive to what would be called 'rape culture"?

By all means, judge me on my respect for women; my mother, sisters, wife, daughters, exgirlfriends (except that Psycho one in Galway back in 98). Do you think Irish women are illserved by their menfolk in their "respect", notwithstanding any deficiencies in grooming, personal hygiene, or ahem, "technique".

FrancieBrady · 03-04-2018 11:11PM

Fann Linn wrote: »

They're making it up as they go along. They have a full list a few pages back of their own definitions.

They don't realise they are being used by the likes of LON, I bet she loves to see people repeating these buzz words.

freshpopcorn · 03-04-2018 11:11PM

I really do think they are a good few men and some women who'd be in public eye who'd be dreading messages/etc being leaked in the media for using inappropriate words.

jimbobalob309 · 03-04-2018 11:12PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I would imagine that is designed with his solicitors to make the way clear for a return to rugby.

tis an apology all the same though isnt it.

tritium · 03-04-2018 11:14PM

Mrsmum wrote: »

Look, is it that the only rapes you see as 'real' are hit you over the head types or taboo relationships types ? No, consent classes would never stop those. But lots of rapes are committed by 'friends' where guys take no to mean persuade me further. Consent classes would certainly help in this area. .

One of the biggest issue we have is folks taking the idea of rape to be one big homogenous melting pot. Like it or not there’s a massive area where the idea of rape is not simple he’d said/ she said. This case is a great example of it unfortunately and everyone lost as a result. Better communication skills are badly needed for men and women here, preferably done in a dispassionate way without the usual agendas in play.

Reform of the legal system is also worth considering, but from both sides given how abysmally both the accused and accuser were failed here.

I do think that the progressive side has scored a serious own goal on this case though. Death threats and mob rule is not the face they’ve looked to shownin the past and they frankly come out of this looking pretty bad

FrancieBrady · 03-04-2018 11:15PM

jimbobalob309 wrote: »

tis an apology all the same though isnt it.

Yep, he'll never use the word slut again.
Probably use another word to describe somebody who behaves that way.
Horndog would be my males friends name for a man who behaves that way.

Mrsmum · 03-04-2018 11:15PM

Bambi985 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/cgilroy14/status/981289542278893568

Had to be done and PJ is a fool not to do it too.

emeraldwinter · 03-04-2018 11:17PM

tritium wrote: »

One of the biggest issue we have is folks taking the idea of rape to be one big homogenous melting pot. Like it or not there’s a massive area where the idea of rape is not simple he’d said/ she said. This case is a great example of it unfortunately and everyone lost as a result. Better communication skills are badly needed for men and women here, preferably done in a dispassionate way without the usual agendas in play.

Reform of the legal system is also worth considering, but from both sides given how abysmally both the accused and accuser were failed here.

I do think that the progressive side has scored a serious own goal on this case though. Death threats and mob rule is not the face they’ve looked to shownin the past and they frankly come out of this looking pretty bad

What reforms in the Irish Legal system would produce more convictions ? The witness is not in open court here.

Silentcorner · 03-04-2018 11:18PM

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Ah heor.
You've claimed we've a rape culture.
Ive asked you about rate of prevalence, you've nolens volens failed to answer.

So lets recap for the cheap seats;
Have we a rape culture in Ireland?
How prevalent is it, would you think a large majority/small minoriy/insignificant number of Irish males subscrive to what would be called 'rape culture"?

By all means, judge me on my respect for women; my mother, sisters, wife, daughters, exgirlfriends (except that Psycho one in Galway back in 98). Do you think Irish women are illserved by their menfolk in their "respect", notwithstanding any deficiencies in grooming, personal hygiene, or ahem, "technique".

We have a rape culture, like we have a hook up culture, like we have a culture of burying our heads in the sand and hope it all goes away culture!

I didn't fail to answer, it's like asking you how many decent men do you think are out there? I have no idea how large or small it is, how would I, we don't record stats on the matter, we don't know how many people go road bowling every year either, but it's part of our culture.

No doubt your thinly veiled smugness will go down well with the mob on here, personally I find your posting style to be quiet odious!

emeraldwinter · 03-04-2018 11:20PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

We have a rape culture, like we have a hook up culture, like we have a culture of burying our heads in the sand and hope it all goes away culture!

I didn't fail to answer, it's like asking you how many decent men do you think are out there? I have no idea how large or small it is, how would I, we don't record stats on the matter, we don't know how many people go road bowling every year either, but it's part of our culture.

No doubt your thinly veiled smugness will go down well with the mob on here, personally I find your posting style to be quiet odious!

Where do all these people go to meet up with there like minded cultural group ?

Nermal · 03-04-2018 11:23PM

hill16bhoy wrote: »

Denying that there is a problem with any of this.

So by trying to refute your argument, we're confirming it?

Is that the sort of logic they teach in consent class?

Silentcorner · 03-04-2018 11:23PM

emeraldwinter wrote: »

Where do all these people go to meet up with there like minded cultural group ?

They have bingo nights every 3rd tuesday of months ending in R, stay away from it though, the cops are all over it!

Luxxis · 03-04-2018 11:24PM

emeraldwinter wrote: »

Where do all these people go to meet up with there like minded cultural group ?

Grogans. Every Thursday night. Did you not get the memo form the patriarchy.

ShowMeTheCash · 03-04-2018 11:26PM

emeraldwinter wrote: »

Where do all these people go to meet up with there like minded cultural group ?

I think it is the flat earth society!
Seem to use the same logic strategy.

Roger Hassenforder · 03-04-2018 11:36PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

We have a rape culture, like we have a hook up culture, like we have a culture of burying our heads in the sand and hope it all goes away culture!

I didn't fail to answer, it's like asking you how many decent men do you think are out there? I have no idea how large or small it is, how would I, we don't record stats on the matter, we don't know how many people go road bowling every year either, but it's part of our culture.

No doubt your thinly veiled smugness will go down well with the mob on here, personally I find your posting style to be quiet odious!

Incidentally, i was road bowling last week. Its part of the culture in West Cork. Localised. You wouldnt say its part of the Irish culture. Although using your rationale you might extrapolate its part not only of Irish culture, but in fact, its European. I mean, they were Europeans bowling... On a European road...

And now youre upset because your "argument" has suffered a humiliating reductio ad absurdum , and you've attempted a few under the belt blows, not only at me, but at those in the front row.

A wise man once said, you know youre winning an argument with a women, when they try and change the subject.

We're done.

GreeBo · 03-04-2018 11:36PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

We have a rape culture, like we have a hook up culture, like we have a culture of burying our heads in the sand and hope it all goes away culture!

I didn't fail to answer, it's like asking you how many decent men do you think are out there? I have no idea how large or small it is, how would I, we don't record stats on the matter, we don't know how many people go road bowling every year either, but it's part of our culture.

No doubt your thinly veiled smugness will go down well with the mob on here, personally I find your posting style to be quiet odious!

Do you perhaps mean a sub culture?

I'm mean it's still bull****, but you'd be wrong in a smaller way.

We have a rape culture amongst rapists, how about that?

A murder culture amongst murderers.
And a horse **** posting culture amongst several posters on this thread.

GreeBo · 03-04-2018 11:40PM

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Incidentally, i was road bowling last week. Its part of the culture in West Cork. Localised. You wouldnt say its part of the Irish culture. Although using your rationale you might extrapolate its part not only of Irish culture, but in fact, its European. I mean, they were Europeans bowling... On a European road...

And now youre upset because your "argument" has suffered a humiliating reductio ad absurdum , and you've attempted a few under the belt blows, not only at me, but at those in the front row.

A wise man once said, you know youre winning an argument with a women, when they try and change the subject.

We're done.

bMPEOE5_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

Roger Hassenforder · 03-04-2018 11:41PM

GreeBo wrote: »

Do you perhaps mean a sub culture?

I'm mean it's still bull****, but you'd be wrong in a smaller way.

We have a rape culture amongst rapists, how about that?

A murder culture amongst murderers.
And a horse **** posting culture amongst several posters on this thread.

Thats a very magnanimous gesture
Fair play

Silentcorner · 03-04-2018 11:43PM

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Incidentally, i was road bowling last week. Its part of the culture in West Cork. Localised. You wouldnt say its part of the Irish culture. Although using your rationale you might extrapolate its part not only of Irish culture, but in fact, its European. I mean, they were Europeans bowling... On a European road...

And now youre upset because your "argument" has suffered a humiliating reductio ad absurdum , and you've attempted a few under the belt blows, not only at me, but at those in the front row.

A wise man once said, you know youre winning an argument with a women, when they try and change the subject.

We're done.

Irish culture is part of European Culture...West Cork culture is part of Irish Culture, Road Bowling is part of Irish and therefore European Culture...

But I haven't tried to change the subject...

I find your posting style odious, it doesn't upset me though, it is a reflection on my perception of you however.

We're done eh? Wanna change the subject?

Appledreams15 · 03-04-2018 11:47PM

Craig Gilroy has apologised now.

Appledreams15 · 03-04-2018 11:49PM

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

What about the 1.6 million men who didnt.

Why was it allowed to happen in a court room in front of a victim.

Appledreams15 · 03-04-2018 11:51PM

Mrsmum wrote: »

Had to be done and PJ is a fool not to do it too.

PJ 's lawyer is not the best at PR.

The heat went off SO after apologising

It intensifed on PJ after it was announced that he was going to sue.

tretorn · 03-04-2018 11:54PM

What did Craig say

Forgive me feminists for I have sinned and I want to play rugby, now and forever Amen.

Have the womens rugby associations anything to say about the bold lads.

Could some of the women fill the gap now that Paddy, Stuart and Craig are in the bold corner.

FrancieBrady · 04-04-2018 12:00AM

tretorn wrote: »

What did Craig say

Forgive me feminists for I have sinned and I want to play rugby, now and forever Amen.

Have the womens rugby associations anything to say about the bold lads.

Could some of the women fill the gap now that Paddy, Stuart and Craig are in the bold corner.

He used a descriptive word that is in every dictionary and part of the language.

Big sin apparently.

Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

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