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Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

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Comments

  • #3122
    GreeBo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,520 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    irishrebe wrote: »
    Being from a privileged background and having a talent for sports means you can't be a sorry excuse for a person now?

    Its been ages since someone brought up the idea of White Male Privilege, well done.


  • #3123
    SAMTALK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,353 ✭✭✭SAMTALK


    Sidebaro wrote: »
    I'm not sure I understand you? Are you saying that the personal attention, labelling of slut and liar doesn't matter because the general attention, #ibelieveher is worth it? Maybe I'm getting you wrong with that?

    You I just think you're intent on not seeing the bigger picture.
    You do realise there are a lot of unhinged people out there?
    You do realise there are a lot of attention seeking people out there/

    I actually believe that this girl thinks she was raped. Was she raped. I honestly dont know so I have to believe the jury got this right on the evidence that they had.
    The feminist movement jumped on the bandwagon straight away and from a lot of posts Im reading on facebook etc a lot of them dont even know what exactly they are marching for .


  • #3124
    RabbleRouser2k
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,661 ✭✭✭RabbleRouser2k


    irishrebe wrote: »
    This reeks of 'Nice Guy Syndrome'.

    Me? No, definitely not-she wasn't my type. I prefer girls who are tough, able to stand up for themselves and able to tell a guy to get lost.
    They often didn't have 'privileged' backgrounds either-but had a real backbone I found charming. (Had boyfriends too-story of mah life, dangit).

    Many of those ladies wouldn't hang out with the likes of 'low self esteem girl' because they would think she was a bimbo. (Actual wording used in relation to one girl in particular).

    The girls with backbone picked decent guys, one's who treated em equally with respect. There wouldn't be a situation like the belfast case, barring some sinister incident.

    On the other hand, I knew girls far older who, for some reason, still picked the douchebag. Like they never learned 'douchebags are always douchebags'. Those relationships would be lucky to last more than three months.
    GiftofGab wrote: »
    Do you have the link to the reddit??

    Yes, but its more of a discussion group, and I don't want boards to get in trouble, in case there is any controversial material, so can I pm you the link?


  • #3125
    irishman86
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,814 ✭✭✭irishman86


    Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »
    Men don't have any interest in women who won't put out for them. That goes without saying.

    I find men boring because they generally approach women solely on that basis and with the kind of infantile talk witnessed in those text messages.

    If a woman wants a "partner" she has to put up with this cr@p at the early stages.

    Where do you get this bull****
    You mentioned private rugby boys already and they dont talk like that
    Like serious nonsense being spouted right here


  • #3126
    Sidebaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 178 ✭✭Sidebaro


    goz83 wrote:
    Yes, it will inspire some women. You're naive if you think it won't. I won't pretend to understand, or know the motivations of others, but I do know that some will indeed draw motivation from the type of case I posted and the main one in this thread.

    I could understand that inspiration a lot more if it was a guilty verdict, or if guilty verdicts were more common.
    goz83 wrote:
    If you had to choose....even after the outcome of this case, who would you rather be: PJ, or the largely unknown girl in the case?

    The largely unknown girl is largely unknown to us. In her community she is widely known. I'd rather be Paddy Jackson. The verdict went in my favour.


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  • #3127
    Sidebaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 178 ✭✭Sidebaro


    GreeBo wrote:
    Its been ages since someone brought up the idea of White Male Privilege, well done.

    You added the white male bit in fairness.


  • #3128
    ShowMeTheCash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,651 ✭✭✭ShowMeTheCash


    irishrebe wrote: »
    Sure, no worries that a woman who is raped in Ireland can't have a legal abortion because women in Saudi Arabia have it worse! Silly b1tches should just all shut up and stop bothering you!

    You keep peddling this broken record in this thread.....

    Here is the thing, you want to harp on about woman's rights but the fact of the matter is, it is other women that mainly head up the pro-life campaign.

    You campaign for womans rights?
    Or is it the case you want all woman to agree with your opinion?


  • #3129
    Sidebaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 178 ✭✭Sidebaro


    SAMTALK wrote:
    You I just think you're intent on not seeing the bigger picture. You do realise there are a lot of unhinged people out there? You do realise there are a lot of attention seeking people out there/

    Of course. I don't think a case where the verdict returned was no guilty would encourage 'a lot' of people to falsely accuse others of rape. Especially since the chances of a conviction are so low. If it was a guilty verdict then I could get on board with you.


  • #3130
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »
    Men don't have any interest in women who won't put out for them. That goes without saying.

    I find men boring because they generally approach women solely on that basis and with the kind of infantile talk witnessed in those text messages.

    If a woman wants a "partner" she has to put up with this cr@p at the early stages.

    What kind of "men" did you hang out with? I and most guys I know talk to women as human beings.

    And that "infantile talk" is used because if a guy is after sex, that kind of "infantile talk" is what gets you laid. Not a debate on the pros and cons of Brexit for example. Guys quickly learn any sort of meaningful conversation in a bar or nightclub scenario turns off women.

    How about actually talking to a guy and getting to know him? Is that out the window entirely now? Or do women look for quality men by getting hammered in a pub and shagging them indiscriminately? If that's what they want to do then more power to them, but they are not going to find a life partner that way.


  • #3131
    hill16bhoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,029 ✭✭✭hill16bhoy


    OwlsZat wrote: »
    Where was that said? I dismissed earlier speculation about drugs but maybe there is more to it. I'd assume that the photo's that were taken on the night we analysed closely for dilated pupils? Also is there much of a scene in Belfast for ecstasy. That's the only drug I could imagine would keep someone up as long. 30 hours awake is no mean feat regardless of the mental state.

    The complainant stated it during the trial. It's in Conor Gallagher's summary of the trial in yesterday's Irish Times.

    That you're speculating about drugs and ecstasy as a reason for this betrays a rather hefty bias against the complainant on your part, I would venture.

    I would find it entirely understandable that a woman who believed she had been raped would not be able to sleep for 30 hours.

    Also, I would imagine most people here have stayed awake for longer than 30 hours plenty of times without drugs. Certainly I have.


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  • #3132
    OwlsZat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭OwlsZat


    Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »
    Men don't have any interest in women who won't put out for them. That goes without saying. 

    I find men boring because they generally approach women solely on that basis and with the kind of infantile talk witnessed in those text messages.

    If a woman wants a "partner" she has to put up with this cr@p at the early stages.

    Stop conflating the thread with your obvious prejudice against men. It's a thread for discussing the outcome of the trial, not dissecting the workings of your mind.


  • #3133
    SAMTALK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,353 ✭✭✭SAMTALK


    Sidebaro wrote: »
    Of course. I don't think a case where the verdict returned was no guilty would encourage 'a lot' of people to falsely accuse others of rape. Especially since the chances of a conviction are so low. If it was a guilty verdict then I could get on board with you.

    I give up!
    I wasnt talking about the verdict which at lot of people dont seem to respect.
    Im talking about all the media attention.

    You do realise that some people just jump on a bandwagon without all the facts, but sure thats ok.. it's for my fellow women Im doing it
    The amount of people who didnt even realise where this trial took place is actually scary


  • #3134
    cloudatlas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,713 ✭✭✭cloudatlas


    irishman86 wrote: »
    cloudatlas wrote: »
    you want to normalise it I don't that's the difference.
    What are you talking about. This is how men and women talk about the opposite sex
    The catholic church doesnt rule us anymore, we are freely let talk about banging
    You are a prude, i am not thats the difference

    Your own social circle is not exclusive. No I'm not a prude I don't talk about women referring to them as sluts and prostitutes. I show respect towards sex partners.


  • #3135
    hill16bhoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,029 ✭✭✭hill16bhoy


    professore wrote: »
    What kind of "men" did you hang out with? I and most guys I know talk to women as human beings.

    And that "infantile talk" is used because if a guy is after sex, that kind of "infantile talk" is what gets you laid. Not a debate on the pros and cons of Brexit for example. Guys quickly learn any sort of meaningful conversation in a bar or nightclub scenario turns off women.
    I don't think you could have contradicted yourself any more if you had tried.

    Though I'm not sure many women would be turned on by such infantile talk as you have displayed here.


  • #3136
    RabbleRouser2k
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,661 ✭✭✭RabbleRouser2k


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Roe McDermott on TV3 Tonight Show last night wasn't picked up when she suggested that even if a woman, after a night of what the male believed to be consensual, if drunken sex, wakes up in the morning and decides it wasn't consensual, must be listened to and action taken.

    Does she realise how mindbogglingly impossible it makes things?

    She wrote a piece about an alleged assault she experienced-but it's so vague, and so 'huh'? That I'm confused as to what she's implying.

    It reads far more like a 'he had a one night stand, then dumped her'. She then brings up the Listowel case, and suddenly I had to check if she was actually Louise O' Neill in disguise.

    http://therumpus.net/2015/04/his-greatest-masterpiece/

    Much of their ideas stink of impracticalities.


  • #3137
    goz83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,035 ✭✭✭goz83


    Sidebaro wrote: »
    I could understand that inspiration a lot more if it was a guilty verdict, or if guilty verdicts were more common.

    The verdict won't be much of a deterrent. False accusations are made out of malice, greed, jealousy, revenge, attention seeking and the list goes on. The accused are tarnished and a not guilty verdict is nothing more than a get-out-of-jail-card. Many will not accept the verdict and will continue to publicly defame the lads.
    The largely unknown girl is largely unknown to us. In her community she is widely known. I'd rather be Paddy Jackson. The verdict went in my favour.

    So you think PJ won? I think everyone lost tbh. It's hard to say this as a man, but gender aside, I would prefer to be in the position of the woman (from a purely outsiders perspective, not knowing either the woman, or PJ). Even if I were raped, I believe I would be able to have a better life going forward than to be someone who was accused of rape.


  • #3138
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    hill16bhoy wrote: »
    I don't think you could have contradicted yourself any more if you had tried.

    Though I'm not sure many women would be turned on by such infantile talk as you have displayed here.

    How is that a contradiction? You can still talk about lighthearted topics without being an asshole. It's not a choice between talking about the Maastricht treaty and calling a woman a slut.

    What's wrong with people?


  • #3139
    Appledreams15
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 379 ✭✭Appledreams15


    irishman86 wrote: »
    What are you talking about. This is how men and women talk about the opposite sex
    The catholic church doesnt rule us anymore, we are freely let talk about banging
    You are a prude, i am not thats the difference

    I love how youre speaking for all women now as well.
    I and my friends have yet to refer to men as prostitutes or to a man as a merry go around after two of us took a turn on him and left him crying


  • #3140
    GreeBo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,520 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    razorblunt wrote: »
    Rape covers digital penetration too. They didn't find any proof he had sex though.
    If he couldn't get it up, he might just been, you know, back there. The position then made it look like he was.

    No, in NI rape requires a penis.


  • #3141
    Wombatman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,349 ✭✭✭Wombatman


    446919.png


    https://twitter.com/ronanlyons/status/979306341004206081


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  • #3142
    drugstore cowboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭drugstore cowboy


    I don't remember this level of outrage in a case that recently happened in this country concerning a Cork girl who claimed she was raped on a rappers tour bus by a couple of roadies. It was a pretty heavy case with reports of girls begging/fighting to be let on the bus, drugs openly being taken in a well known Cork nightclub by the rapper and crew, the crew picking which women were brought onto the bus after the club closed, I believe each guy brought 2 girls on the bus and there's a lot of similarities to the belfast case and the whole bus party sounds pretty debauched.

    I'm struggling to grasp why that case was left alone by them and this one isn't? I know the likes of LON complain about white men a lot so did they decide it was best not to protest that case and get stuck into this one?

    Genuinely wonder.


  • #3143
    Sidebaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 178 ✭✭Sidebaro


    SAMTALK wrote:
    I give up! I wasnt talking about the verdict which at lot of people dont seem to respect. Im talking about all the media attention.

    It's borderline impossible to see all the media attention, realise it's about a rape case, and not know the verdict.


  • #3144
    tritium
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,793 ✭✭✭tritium


    MarinersBlues wrote: »
    The irony is that a lot of the people "protesting" The verdict would also join a protest against prejudice.

    The same folks doing this would have been going nuts at the antics of Ched Evans supporters after the original trial....,


  • #3145
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    sightband wrote: »
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

    The problem when is that when you're famous - especially for something that involves representing your country - you're expected to be upstanding and ethical in behaviour and presentation at all times. Even when not "on duty". These guys were far from it and any organisation that they represent has the right to drop them from any endorsement duties

    At the end of the day you know as well as I do: what people see these guys are endorsing isn't just the product or a rugby shirt.

    How did Simon Zebo and Connor Murray escape totally unscathed from their own threesome soirée few years back? Granted there was no question ever of it being non consensual but it was hardly behaviour fitting of representatives of their country, sponsors didn’t seem to have an issue and Murray is the golden boy of Irish rugby. Different rules back then perhaps? How times have changed in only a short few years.

    What I really don’t get is why these rugby lads want to be getting intimate with each other and women at the same time. Bunch of f*cking oddballs.

    Not familiar with the case: but the problems these guys face wasn't having a threesome - nothing wrong with that - it's the attitudes and language used in the whatsapp messages.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • #3146
    Sidebaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 178 ✭✭Sidebaro


    goz83 wrote:
    So you think PJ won? I think everyone lost tbh. It's hard to say this as a man, but gender aside, I would prefer to be in the position of the woman (from a purely outsiders perspective, not knowing either the woman, or PJ). Even if I were raped, I believe I would be able to have a better life going forward than to be someone who was accused of rape.

    You didn't ask who I thought won, you asked who I'd rather be. You'd rather be the woman, I'm not going to ask you 'so you think she won?'


  • #3147
    Appledreams15
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 379 ✭✭Appledreams15


    Assetbacked wrote: »
    The possibility that she would want to be gangbanged, be penetrated in every hole possible and degraded is non-existent to people. Why? It’s kinky sex; people love it and do not need to feel guilty for it. We don’t know her situation, perhaps her fear of being named publicly with videos and the witness telling people was too strong so tentatively went down the path of “it wasn’t consensual” but then it snowballed. We don’t know though and I’m not spreading that around unlike #IBelieveHer attention seeking ignorant fools who seem to have a proper insight into the girl’s mind. It really is so pathetic and misguided.

    Have you ever wanted to be gangbanged in every hole?

    PORN IS NOT REAL!!!

    And is another problem. It gives men violent norms if how to treat women.

    Why was she crying and hysterical after it if she wanted it


  • #3148
    ShowMeTheCash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,651 ✭✭✭ShowMeTheCash


    drugstore cowboy wrote: »
    I don't remember this level of outrage in a case that recently happened in this country concerning a Cork girl who claimed she was raped on a rappers tour bus by a couple of roadies. It was a pretty heavy case with reports of girls begging/fighting to be let on the bus, drugs openly being taken in a well known Cork nightclub by the rapper and crew, the crew picking which women were brought onto the bus after the club closed, I believe each guy brought 2 girls on the bus and there's a lot of similarities to the belfast case and the whole bus party sounds pretty debauched.

    I'm struggling to grasp why that case was left alone by them and this one isn't? I know the likes of LON complain about white men a lot so did they decide it was best not to protest that case and get stuck into this one?

    Genuinely wonder.

    I think the main reason is, it happened in a different country!
    In Ireland the defendants only get named if found guilty, so in reality if this happened in Ireland. We would not of heard about it unless it was leaked.


  • #3149
    SleetAndSnow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,757 ✭✭✭SleetAndSnow


    Appledreams15 wrote: »
    Have you ever wanted to be gangbanged in every hole?

    PORN IS NOT REAL!!!

    And is another problem. It gives men violent norms if how to treat women.

    Why was she crying and hysterical after it if she wanted it

    Because, like them, she was drunk and generally being drunk has a big effect on your emotions, which can swing drastically from one end of the spectrum to the other.

    Also you don't know what people like, some people may like being 'gangbanged in every hole' while others don't. Nobodys the same.


  • #3150
    SAMTALK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,353 ✭✭✭SAMTALK


    Sidebaro wrote: »
    It's borderline impossible to see all the media attention, realise it's about a rape case, and not know the verdict.

    But do you not get that the protesters believe it was the wrong verdict and that these men are guilty??


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  • #3151
    backspin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,091 ✭✭✭backspin.


    I see Paddy Jackson is suing Aodhan O'Riordan for that tweet.


This discussion has been closed.
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