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Breaking: At least 1 man dead after stabbing rampage in Dundalk

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    #1382
    Buford T. Justice XIX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    Mod Note: doylefe, do not post in this thread again.

    Buford T. JUstice


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    #1383
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    inforfun wrote: »
    Yep.
    As long as they dont claim to be under 18, it doest really matter.
    But 33 year old murderers claiming to be 17, is a different story
    I would not be surprised if we hear from his lawyer that he meant to say "under 18" and not "18". Already the Gardai have revised the original info given that he was Egyptian. Basically they know nothing about him. Also it seems he is not very bright.

    As regards the open border with NI, I don't think that is the issue at all. The issue is that when the Gardai first encountered him, they found he was an illegal migrant but they did not detain him. Apparently advised him to head for Dublin and claim asylum as if it was some kind of Sanctuary City for illegals.

    The next time they encountered him, he had murdered one person and attempted the murder of two others.

    We don't need to turn RoI into a fortress. But when we find such people have just wandered in, we should detain them, and deport them ASAP.


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    #1384
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Eliza Tall Stance wrote: »
    Goes to show how much you know.

    Why would the Aus govt fly the remains of a 17 year old to Ireland? He lived his life in Perth, with his mother.

    https://www.google.com/amp/www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/charlie-mccarthy-cork-perth-australia-11754762.amp

    I know more than you anyway, it would seem.


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    #1385
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    pilly wrote: »
    Because they're not in government in those countries perhaps?

    What would you like them to do about other countries?


    I don’t want them to do anything about “other countries”.
    I want them to stop dodging questions about human rights in countries where the immigrants they want us to accommodate in vast number here hail from, and how their culture might impact on our more tolerant inclusive society.
    That’s what I want.


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    #1386
    Grayson
    Registered Users Posts: 16,161 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Coles wrote: »
    It also seems that the most homophobic misogynists are also Islamophobic. Very confusing. When did the fascists and bigots start caring so much about the gays and the wimmin?

    There is a large intersection of groups who are anti muslim and are anti feminist.


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    #1387
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 17,849 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Grayson wrote: »
    There is a large intersection of groups who are anti muslim and are anti feminist.

    just like a lot of feminists seem to be pro Islam? the Hijab is feminist dress ware these days don't you know :pac:

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #1388
    Snake Plisken
    Registered Users Posts: 12,505 ✭✭✭✭Snake Plisken


    Coles wrote: »
    It also seems that the most homophobic misogynists are also Muslims. Very confusing.

    Fixed that for you there Cole! It’s also amazing that feminist and some gays are so supportive of such an anti feminist anti gay Cult of Islam. Also in the far left in Europe anti-semitism is rife! But hey keep up the good work. Now I’m going back to do a productive days work! Bye


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    #1389
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    tayto lover wrote: »
    He seemingly sought political asylum and it was in the process of being decided from what i've read.

    After he was caught with no documentation. Try and keep up.

    ****



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    #1390
    wakka12
    Registered Users Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    Coles wrote: »
    It also seems that the most homophobic misogynists are also Islamophobic. Very confusing. When did the fascists and bigots start caring so much about the gays and the wimmin?

    I don't care much for people who never cared about gay rights now using it as an argument against muslims, like those who started to only care about homeless irish when refugees came to europe. But millions of muslims coming from cultures which are extremely homophobic and misogynistic is extremely problematic for current european residents, do you not think? Even second and third generation muslims in britain are significantly more homophobic than their christian peers. Clearly liberal attitudes towards minorities in britain isn't having much influence on the muslim community.


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    #1391
    Irishmale0399
    Registered Users Posts: 3,249 ✭✭✭Irishmale0399


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    After he was caught with no documentation. Try and keep up.

    This a problem all over mainland Europe. They conviently misplace their passports and so on once they enter the EU and go from country to country creating new identities and ages as it suits them.

    Then they claim to be Syrian (suspect this is where the first nationality report after the crime came from) and apply for political refuge. No EU government can do much then due to the following:

    1. Detention centers are overfilled EU wide and new centers cannot be opened quickly enough. So they start sending them from center to center within a certain country hoping it will kill time whilst they start to try and identify the person and where in the EU this person was first registered.
    (EU law states an EU state can deport these people back to their first registration point within the EU, which is normally Italy or Greece)

    2. Without a passport or nationality you cannot deport someone and these boys know it.

    3. Once a nationality is suspected, they then contact the embassy, who in turn try to identify the birth place and heritage etc. This process is very slow and it is known within the EU that Morocco, Tunisia and Egypt very often refuse repatriation or assistance in the identification of suspects.


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    #1392
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    After he was caught with no documentation. Try and keep up.

    Link to that please.


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    #1393
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 8,055 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    splinter65 wrote: »
    I don’t want them to do anything about “other countries”.
    I want them to stop dodging questions about human rights in countries where the immigrants they want us to accommodate in vast number here hail from, and how their culture might impact on our more tolerant inclusive society.
    That’s what I want.

    So people who flee bad places should be kept out because they come from a bad place.


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    #1394
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Tell me how wrote: »
    Let me guess, you're not a rascist, you're just worried about the safety of innocent people.

    For the bajillionth time, cultural nationalism is not racism. Relatively speaking, to someone born and raised in a liberal Western culture, a conservative North African or Middle Eastern culture does appear backwards. It is not racist to say this. Just as it wouldn't be racist for an American to look at Ireland re abortion laws and the recent memories of magdalene laundries and industrial schools to say that Irish culture is a bit backwards compared to American culture, in this regard.

    Like it or not, people born and raised in a socially liberal culture will always have disdain for cultures which are socially conservative and do not convey as much individual personal freedom as one's own culture does. That's just the way it is, and it isn't racist. Culture and race are separate entities. Ireland has changed in recent decades, but in the mid 20th century would it have been racist for foreigners to look at Ireland's attitude towards women and sexuality, and conclude that our culture was toxic in all sorts of ways? Of course it wouldn't, because compared to our current standards of personal freedom, it was toxic.

    Saudi Arabia for instance is backwards compared to your average Western country. Womens' rights are a joke and the punishments for crimes are absolutely savage and brutal, involving deliberately inflicted and permanent physical disability. That isn't about race, but about learned cultural norms.


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    #1395
    Asus X540L
    Registered Users Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭Asus X540L


    What are the odds that a Japanese man is the victim of a random stabbing by a muslim immigrant in Dundalk?

    That poor poor man. My thoughts go out to him and family.

    Always loved the Japanese, a ridiculously decent and respectful people.


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    #1396
    wakka12
    Registered Users Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    Asus X540L wrote: »
    What are the odds that a Japanese man is the victim of a random stabbing by a muslim immigrant in Dundalk?

    That poor poor man. My thoughts go out to him and family.

    Always loved the Japanese, a ridiculously decent and respectful people.

    Not that low..Ireland has a lot of foreign people..and the two other people attacked were irish


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    #1397
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Odhinn wrote: »
    So people who flee bad places should be kept out because they come from a bad place.

    People fleeing bad places need to be given the opportunity to flee to a place that is conducive to their mindset, or accept that the place they are fleeing to has a different attitude to freedoms then the place they are fleeing from.
    What is so wrong with giving asylum seekers the information that they need BEFORE they waste their time, so they can make an informed desicion about where they want to go?
    You do agree that a host country shouldn’t have to change its accepted mores to accommodate the sensibilities of visitors?


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    #1398
    JPCN1
    Registered Users Posts: 888 ✭✭✭JPCN1


    splinter65 wrote: »
    The socialist politicians (P Murphy R Coppinger C Daly etc) are very pro immigration but ignore the violent homophobia and horrific misogyny that’s acceptable in most of the countries that the immigrants originate from.

    They also think that money grows on trees, bless them.


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    #1399
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    Walk like and egyptian


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    #1400
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    JPCN1 wrote: »
    They also think that money grows on trees, bless them.

    They know it doesn’t grow on trees.
    What they think should happen is that those who go to work for a living should be taxed down to the point where their take home pay is the same as someone in JSA, so that those on JSA can have the same standard of living as someone who goes to work.


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    #1401
    JPCN1
    Registered Users Posts: 888 ✭✭✭JPCN1


    splinter65 wrote: »
    People fleeing bad places need to be given the opportunity to flee to a place that is conducive to their mindset, or accept that the place they are fleeing to has a different attitude to freedoms then the place they are fleeing from.
    What is so wrong with giving asylum seekers the information that they need BEFORE they waste their time, so they can make an informed desicion about where they want to go?
    You do agree that a host country shouldn’t have to change its accepted mores to accommodate the sensibilities of visitors?

    Asylum seekers seem to have plenty of information hence the reason they gravitate towards economies with very generous welfare systems.


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    #1402
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    JPCN1 wrote: »
    Asylum seekers seem to have plenty of information hence the reason they gravitate towards economies with very generous welfare systems.

    Ive no real problem with that.
    We are very wealthy, comparably.
    I think a lot of people coming from mainly Muslim countries have no concept of how liberal and sexually permissive our society is for example.
    I think that if they knew that everyone here is free to live the life they want to free from censure, that they might pick somewhere else.


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    #1403
    Grayson
    Registered Users Posts: 16,161 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    splinter65 wrote: »
    People fleeing bad places need to be given the opportunity to flee to a place that is conducive to their mindset, or accept that the place they are fleeing to has a different attitude to freedoms then the place they are fleeing from.
    What is so wrong with giving asylum seekers the information that they need BEFORE they waste their time, so they can make an informed desicion about where they want to go?
    You do agree that a host country shouldn’t have to change its accepted mores to accommodate the sensibilities of visitors?

    Here's the thing. Most of the people on this thread who are anti refugees would still be against them if they were all selected from applicants in refugee camps who have full background checks. Because once that was done the argument would shift to "They're completely incompatible" or "They come from a culture that wants to subjugate all of us" or "They allow child rape in islam" or some other such nonsense.

    Edit: One thing where you say a country shouldn't change. That's a kind of weird question. I don't think they should negatively restrict freedoms. Now I'm saying negatively restrict because some restrictions are good. Being a racist could be part of your culture (say deep south america) but that doesn't mean that it should be legal to verbally abuse black people. And stopping someone from abusing black people is technically restricting their freedom but it's not a bad thing to restrict.
    Likewise it may be necessary to change certain laws for refugees/immigrants. So long as it doesn't have any negative affect on the rest of society then I'm ok with it.


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    #1404
    NewbridgeIR
    Registered Users Posts: 3,772 ✭✭✭NewbridgeIR


    splinter65 wrote: »
    The socialist politicians (P Murphy R Coppinger C Daly etc) are very pro immigration but ignore the violent homophobia and horrific misogyny that’s acceptable in most of the countries that the immigrants originate from.

    Many on the left suffer from selective outrage when it comes to crime.
    They'll screech about locking up middle class white collar criminals but are strangely silent when it comes to violent crime carried out by the less privileged.


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    #1405
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    annaindundalk wrote: »
    Hmmm why don’t you just say what you’re actually really thinking?

    1990s, relatively recently, we were stone aged ourselves.
    Eliza Tall Stance wrote: »
    Standard Operating Procedure.

    Prefers the snide remarks that lad.

    Are you either very young or uneducated as to the situation in Ireland in the context of that post and the one it was in reply to? It's obvious to me that you don't.


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    #1406
    JPCN1
    Registered Users Posts: 888 ✭✭✭JPCN1


    Grayson wrote: »
    Here's the thing. Most of the people on this thread who are anti refugees would still be against them if they were all selected from applicants in refugee camps who have full background checks. Because once that was done the argument would shift to "They're completely incompatible" or "They come from a culture that wants to subjugate all of us" or "They allow child rape in islam" or some other such nonsense.

    Edit: One thing where you say a country shouldn't change. That's a kind of weird question. I don't think they should negatively restrict freedoms. Now I'm saying negatively restrict because some restrictions are good. Being a racist could be part of your culture (say deep south america) but that doesn't mean that it should be legal to verbally abuse black people. And stopping someone from abusing black people is technically restricting their freedom but it's not a bad thing to restrict.
    Likewise it may be necessary to change certain laws for refugees/immigrants. So long as it doesn't have any negative affect on the rest of society then I'm ok with it.

    Grayson, the new Dev, looks into his heart to see what we're all thinking and seems to be about to re-write the constitution to suit his viewpoint.


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    #1407
    pilly
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,005 ✭✭✭pilly


    Who the hell is Dev?


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    #1408
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users Posts: 14,365 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    pilly wrote: »
    Who the hell is Dev?

    Somebody offers an opinion on how Ireland might legislate regarding free speech and racism. Then they're answered with juvenile drivel. Kind of sums up threads like these.


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    #1409
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 17,849 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Grayson wrote: »
    Here's the thing. Most of the people on this thread who are anti refugees would still be against them if they were all selected from applicants in refugee camps who have full background checks. Because once that was done the argument would shift to "They're completely incompatible" or "They come from a culture that wants to subjugate all of us" or "They allow child rape in islam" or some other such nonsense.

    what about other non nonsense arguments like, can they read or write? what tradable skills do they have? what drain may they be to our education/welfare system. Also what background checks will there be? not a member of ISIS wont tell me much, would you accept refugees being classed as believably secular? (we will take those) versus refugees who think Sharia is better than democracy, (nah lets get you back home asap)?

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #1410
    Grayson
    Registered Users Posts: 16,161 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    pilly wrote: »
    Who the hell is Dev?

    De Valera I think.

    It's a bit of an exaggeration to suggest I'd rewrite the constitution (Although i wouldn't mind having a crack at the 8th :) )

    In the UK a sikh is exempt from wearing a motorcycle helmet. That's not a bad law. It doesn't affect the rest of us in any way.


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    #1411
    wakka12
    Registered Users Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    Grayson wrote: »
    De Valera I think.

    It's a bit of an exaggeration to suggest I'd rewrite the constitution (Although i wouldn't mind having a crack at the 8th :) )

    In the UK a sikh is exempt from wearing a motorcycle helmet. That's not a bad law. It doesn't affect the rest of us in any way.

    Except if somebody hits a sikh with their car and he falls off the motorcycle and then you've killed him as he wasn't wearing a helmet
    Laws as a rule of thumb should just be for everyone ,without exception


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