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BIK on EVs.

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12467…19

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    #92
    Denisoftus
    Registered Users Posts: 757 ✭✭✭Denisoftus


    Not many brokers/companies insure company car, from what it looks like, can someone suggest a decent broker to deal with? When car is not a VAN or not for moving goods, a lot say no :(


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    #93
    bp_me
    Registered Users Posts: 1,648 ✭✭✭bp_me


    Denisoftus wrote: »
    How many years without insurance enough to lose your NCD? If I, lets say, come back to private with one year gap, would they still not take into account previous 5+ years NCD?

    Typically your private NCB has a two year expiration date.


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    #94
    air
    Registered Users Posts: 2,822 ✭✭✭air


    If your partner has a vehicle insured privately also you could take turns being the primary driver each year and keep both your ncbs current.


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    #95
    Denisoftus
    Registered Users Posts: 757 ✭✭✭Denisoftus


    air wrote: »
    If your partner has a vehicle insured privately also you could take turns being the primary driver each year and keep both your ncbs current.

    You are reading my mind :)


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    #96
    air
    Registered Users Posts: 2,822 ✭✭✭air


    I can't claim credit for the idea unfortunately, a friend of mine did it for years while they had only one car, he's back to 2 cars now and it worked a treat.
    He mentioned that there was a bit of explaining on the phone each year at renewal time but no major hassle.


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    #97
    slicedpanman
    Registered Users Posts: 619 ✭✭✭slicedpanman


    air wrote: »
    If your partner has a vehicle insured privately also you could take turns being the primary driver each year and keep both your ncbs current.
    I thought you had to be the legal owner of the vehicle to be the primary on the policy?


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    #98
    air
    Registered Users Posts: 2,822 ✭✭✭air


    slicedpanman wrote: »
    I thought you had to be the legal owner of the vehicle to be the primary on the policy?
    Your partner can own it also, have seen the wording on my own documents previously, but obviously check with your own company first.


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    #99
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,187 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    I think insurance is more about, the primary driver, not owner.
    Surely, if any insurance co is interested in business, this scheme is an opportunity.


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    #100
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    with insurance, there must be an " insurable interest ", You typically cannot insure a vehicle owned by another legal entity as you are not the insurable entity

    Nor in general can you have two insurances covering the same vehicle

    Hence the owner is the insured interest , who drives it is another situation entirely

    Note the issue of loss of NCD is being over stated , Most insurances will give you a discount to account for years under a company policy , yes its not an NCD but the nett effect is similar, I have transferred between the two a number of times


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    #101
    air
    Registered Users Posts: 2,822 ✭✭✭air


    BoatMad wrote: »
    with insurance, there must be an " insurable interest ", You typically cannot insure a vehicle owned by another legal entity as you are not the insurable entity

    This is true, however in practice many Irish insurers accept your spouse's ownership as an insurable interest.
    123.ie wrote:
    is registered in the Republic of Ireland in your name or in the name of your spouse. (Spouse means legally married husband/wife or legally recognised Civil/Cohabiting Partner)
    Liberty Insurance wrote:
    Yes, you can insure a vehicle registered in your own name or the name of your spouse, civil partner, parent, common law partner or a lease company. If the vehicle is registered to anyone else we cannot provide a quote.
    Aviva wrote:
    Your car is owned and mainly driven by you or your spouse/partner

    In the event that one's insurer of choice doesn't allow this, it wouldn't cost anything to transfer ownership over and back to your spouse each year. It would add previous owners to the vehicle obviously.


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    #102
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    BoatMad wrote: »
    with insurance, there must be an " insurable interest ", You typically cannot insure a vehicle owned by another legal entity as you are not the insurable entity

    I am really said to hear such an experience user repeating that 'Insurable Interest' rubbish.

    What law requires is the driver's cover for third party liability. In this case the insurable interest has nothing to do with the ownership of the vehicle driven: every person driving has insurable interest...

    Sure - one shouldn't be able to establish a policy for damages to a vehicle he/she does not own. But there is no technical problem in allowing any person insuring themselves to drive any particular car (and such cover is indeed offered on the market - commonly known as 'driving other cars' extension, but it is only packaged with different covers).


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    #103
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    grogi wrote: »
    I am really said to hear such an experience user repeating that 'Insurable Interest' rubbish.

    What law requires is the driver's cover for third party liability. In this case the insurable interest has nothing to do with the ownership of the vehicle driven: every person driving has insurable interest...

    Sure - one shouldn't be able to establish a policy for damages to a vehicle he/she does not own. But there is no technical problem in allowing any person insuring themselves to drive any particular car (and such cover is indeed offered on the market - commonly known as 'driving other cars' extension, but it is only packaged with different covers).

    I never said anything about the law, I said that the issue of insurable interest is generally applied

    Driving other cars, you will notice is restricted and limited , it does not invalidate what I said

    My experience with dozens of company cars and private cars, is you will not get insurance in the same of the driver rather then then owner, even if then the policy is extended to cover other drivers

    BUT , my experience is that while you will loose your NCB , you will still get a discount on the premium recognising your company car years. personally when I transferred from company to provate the effective rate for me went down as company car insurance is expensive


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    #104
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    Originally Posted by Liberty Insurance
    Yes, you can insure a vehicle registered in your own name or the name of your spouse, civil partner, parent, common law partner or a lease company. If the vehicle is registered to anyone else we cannot provide a quote.
    yes but this provision is never extended to cars opened by a company

    People suggesting they can own a company car and insure it in their own name ( or their spouses name ) are dreaming


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    #105
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    BoatMad wrote: »
    I never said anything about the law, I said that the issue of insurable interest is generally applied

    Driver always has insurable interest. Insurance companies prefer not to insure drivers without their own cars for their own reasons - but it has nothing to do with insurable interest. Please stop repeating it, because it is not correct.


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    #106
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    grogi wrote: »
    Driver always has insurable interest. Insurance companies prefer not to insure drivers without their own cars for their own reasons - but it has nothing to do with insurable interest. Please stop repeating it, because it is not correct.

    it is a basic requirement for all types of insurance that the person who buys a policy must have an insurable interest in the subject of the insurance.

    Insurable interest is one of the foundations of insurance because, in its absence, insurance would be no different from gambling and (even if legal) would not constitute a binding agreement.

    To the insurance company, an insurable interest is the basic reason for issuing a legal insurance cover, whilst – to an insured (or beneficiary) it gives the legal right to enforce an insurance claim.

    An insurable interest means that the policy holder (or the beneficiary) must stand to suffer a direct, measurable financial loss if the event (against which the insurance cover was bought) does occur.


    Insurance companies in Ireland apply the Insurable interest situation in motor insurance , even in the case of third party insurance , which arguably does not fall in the category of insurable interest


    The fact remains after all this , you will not be quoted in Ireland as a private individual for cover on a company car


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    #107
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    BoatMad wrote: »
    it is a basic requirement for all types of insurance that the person who buys a policy must have an insurable interest in the subject of the insurance. /.../

    How many times do I need to repeat it? Driver always has insurable interest, regardless whose car she or he drives. If the driver crashes and makes any damage or causes injury, he or she is liable. So she or he would have suffered a substantial financial expense to cover those liabilities. In other words loss. Thus have insurable interest.

    Please quit repeating that it is insurable interest (or lack of such) that prevents people from getting insured to drive someone else car. Because it is not.


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    #108
    Denisoftus
    Registered Users Posts: 757 ✭✭✭Denisoftus


    What insurance companies people use to insure a company car, not VAN or taxi? This proven to be problematic.


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    #109
    air
    Registered Users Posts: 2,822 ✭✭✭air


    Just to be clear I posted those links purely to show that many companies allow spouses to insure cars registered in one another's names.
    This in the context of maintaining 2 NCBs on a single shared vehicle by alternating the policy holder annually.
    Note that while researching this I noted that many of the companies also have no issue if the vehicle is registered to a lease company.
    Perhaps if your own company leases the car and the usage remains social domestic as before it may be viable to take out private motor insurance on it via this route.


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    #110
    Denisoftus
    Registered Users Posts: 757 ✭✭✭Denisoftus


    Leasing a car by own your company, oh man, this is a very grey area. I was wondering, if there have been any real cases?


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    #111
    lafors
    Registered Users Posts: 4,316 ✭✭✭lafors


    Jaysus this thread was hard to read...I thought I ended up in an insurance forum at one stage!

    Any back to BIK on EVs

    A few simpler questions first.
    Company will lease car for the employee from a fleet company up to the value of monthly amount (i.e. monthly lease cost).
    The fleet company are giving a price of full list price, no deductions for grants etc.
    Do the fleet company get reduction on price from any of the currently available grants?
    This will help decide on cars available to employee.

    Next,
    From budget this year there is mention of 0% BIK on EVs.
    As I can't find anything on the revenues site bar an infographic which says "Benefit-in-kind 0% for at least 3 years",
    Does this actually mean 0%? Like not 0% on a certain amount?

    Lastly,
    The Home Charger Installation Grant, is this definitely available to the employee as they don't own the car?
    Again it's an added cost if they had to pay themselves.


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    #112
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,095 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    lafors wrote: »
    Company will lease car for the employee from a fleet company up to the value of monthly amount (i.e. monthly lease cost).
    The fleet company are giving a price of full list price, no deductions for grants etc.
    Do the fleet company get reduction on price from any of the currently available grants?
    This will help decide on cars available to employee.

    Cant see why the fleet company couldnt/wouldnt get the grants too. I don't believe its restricted to private individuals.
    lafors wrote: »
    Next,
    From budget this year there is mention of 0% BIK on EVs.
    As I can't find anything on the revenues site bar an infographic which says "Benefit-in-kind 0% for at least 3 years",
    Does this actually mean 0%? Like not 0% on a certain amount?

    Its 0%, full stop.

    lafors wrote: »
    Lastly,
    The Home Charger Installation Grant, is this definitely available to the employee as they don't own the car?
    Again it's an added cost if they had to pay themselves.

    The fine print of the home charger grant is not yet announced so no one can answer that question for you yet.

    My guess, since it will also allow 2nd hand cars, is that it will be tied to your address and not to the car, so you would get it, not the fleet company.


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    #113
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Was on to a garage earlier about an EV. They quoted the full price, mentioning the 5k grant. I said I wanted to buy it through a company and they said the grant was 3.8k for businesses. Anyone heard of that before?


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    #114
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Update: found this link showing commercial purchases.


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    #115
    Denisoftus
    Registered Users Posts: 757 ✭✭✭Denisoftus


    Correct, its 3.8k for company purchases, so adjust for it.


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    #116
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    BIK rate is a pretty good incentive so I shouldn't complain. Didn't realise though so may indeed need to do the numbers again...

    Anyone get any further with first-time company insurance? I contacted a broker who were to get me quotes from KennCo and another company but can't get an answer from them (the insurers, not the brokers).


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    #117
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I'm probably pushing my luck here but...is there VAT on new cars (I've never bought one before!) and can it be reclaimed if purchased by a company?

    In this case, the vehicle is for use by a director of the company but not essential to the business i.e. it's not a delivery van or part of sales fleet


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    #118
    Denisoftus
    Registered Users Posts: 757 ✭✭✭Denisoftus


    No, you cannot claim VAT on the type of a car, and purpose of use.


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    #119
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Ah I figured :)
    Was just chancing my arm in case I'm missing something obvious.

    Probably still worth doing if I can get an insurance quote - which is proving way more difficult than expected.


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    #120
    DM1983
    Registered Users Posts: 219 ✭✭DM1983


    Hi guys, 3 things I would like confirmed if possible.

    1) Definition for evs for the 0% bik is based on motive power so i3 Rex should be fine I think?

    2) Buying a second hand car should be fine too I think?

    3) The car can be bought now but not made available for use until January 2018?


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    #121
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,187 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Needs to be pure EV, No little petrol engine.


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