Would you do this to a colleague?

Are Am Eye · 11-12-2017 05:48PM

BellaBella, will you tell Corners of Hell not to address me in the office unless it relates to a professional matter, and keep it brief.

Pelvis · 11-12-2017 05:49PM

Avatar MIA wrote: »

If it's not organised or paid by work, it isn't bullying. If it is, that's different.

Of course it's bullying, it's bullying IN the workplace, not bullying BY the workplace.

Avatar MIA · 11-12-2017 05:51PM

Pelvis wrote: »

Of course it's bullying, it's bullying IN the workplace, not bullying BY the workplace.

If 19 people are going out to lunch together, and paying for it themselves with no owner involvement or payment it's not work related.

pwurple · 11-12-2017 05:51PM

As the others have pointed out, it's textbook bullying to exclude someone like that.
Do not do that, and make it clear to the others what they are suggesting as well.
Doesn't matter if you don't like someone, no need to be a dick about it.
Might need to uprev the workplace Bullying policy, or do the training again if they're at this craic.

Electric Sheep · 11-12-2017 05:52PM

Avatar MIA wrote: »

If it's not organised or paid by work, it isn't bullying. If it is, that's different.

I disagree. Do you think that schoolyard bullying is not bullying if it is not organized by the school? This is a deliberate attempt to make a coworker uncomfortable in the workplace. We may not always like our coworkers, but we should always interact in an adult professional way.

corner of hells · 11-12-2017 05:52PM

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Pelvis wrote: »

Of course it's bullying, it's bullying IN the workplace, not bullying BY the workplace.

If 19 people are going out to lunch together, and paying for it themselves with no owner involvement or payment it's not work related.

See , now you're bullying Pelvis.

Avatar MIA · 11-12-2017 05:53PM

corner of hells wrote: »

See , now you're bullying Pelvis.

He was asking for it!

eeguy · 11-12-2017 05:54PM

Electric Sheep wrote: »

I disagree. Do you think that schoolyard bullying is not bullying if it is not organized by the school? This is a deliberate attempt to make a coworker uncomfortable in the workplace. We may not always like our coworkers, but we should always interact in an adult professional way.

It's a stupid, passive aggressive, childish response.

A better response would be to stand up for yourselves and tell her where to go when she gets on your nerves.

Avatar MIA · 11-12-2017 05:55PM

Electric Sheep wrote: »

I disagree. Do you think that schoolyard bullying is not bullying if it is not organized by the school? This is a deliberate attempt to make a coworker uncomfortable in the workplace. We may not always like our coworkers, but we should always interact in an adult professional way.

By definition school yard bulling, happens in the school yard.

But, there must be legal precedent. Any that you know of?

Pelvis · 11-12-2017 05:57PM

Avatar MIA wrote: »

If 19 people are going out to lunch together, and paying for it themselves with no owner involvement or payment it's not work related.

19 workmates going for lunch on a work day on the final day of work while actively trying to exclude a single work mate for reasons relating to work is definitely work related.

pickarooney · 11-12-2017 05:57PM

Deandre Shapely Tape wrote: »

I agree. I'm definitely not going to go. A couple of others have mentioned reservations as well so hopefully, if it goes ahead there will be several people who won't be there which might mean unpopular colleague won't realise she's the only one not invited.

So it's the people who have reservations who won't go to the restaurant?

That seems clear enough

ardinn · 11-12-2017 05:58PM

If you want to go out and enjoy a lunch but this Cnut will hinder the enjoyment then leave her out - It's not childish - it's very grown up behaviour actually - if she asks why, tell her no one in the office really likes her because of several reasons.

List several reasons,

Tell her if she is in some way tolerable next year she may be invited.

It could be the best thing ever happened - She might even leave the company!!!

super_furry · 11-12-2017 05:59PM

Really awful way for adults to be carrying on. Exclusion like that is bullying, plain and simple.

If there are issues that need to be addressed, address them, but that's workplace bullying.

Electric Sheep · 11-12-2017 06:00PM

Avatar MIA wrote: »

By definition school yard bulling, happens in the school yard.

But, there must be legal precedent. Any that you know of?

It's unacceptable behavior, regardless of the legalities. Would you hire someone who deliberately makes the workplace uncomfortable for other workers? I wouldn't.

ardinn · 11-12-2017 06:02PM

super_furry wrote: »

Really awful way for adults to be carrying on. Exclusion like that is bullying, plain and simple.

If there are issues that need to be addressed, address them, but that's workplace bullying.

It's far from bullying - they are leaving work for a get together - if cnutface will be there annoying everyone is that not a form of bullying in and of itself?

Avatar MIA · 11-12-2017 06:02PM

Pelvis wrote: »

19 workmates going for lunch on a work day on the final day of work while actively trying to exclude a single work mate for reasons relating to work is definitely work related.

You left out the paid for by themselves.

So, who's at fault here? Who's going to pay compensation, if management are not involved.

Are the 19 people who did not invite one particular person all going to be brought up for bullying?

Ireland is a litigious country, and something similar must happen dozens of time each year.

It might be an interesting one to ask over in Legal Discussion as a hypothetical.

marieholmfan · 11-12-2017 06:04PM

Three directors are going.

Avatar MIA wrote: »

You left out the paid for by themselves.

So, who's at fault here? Who's going to pay compensation, if management are not involved.

Are the 19 people who did not invite one particular person all going to be brought up for bullying?

Ireland is a litigious country, and something similar must happen dozens of time each year.

It might be an interesting one to ask over in Legal Discussion as a hypothetical.

Avatar MIA · 11-12-2017 06:05PM

Deandre Shapely Tape wrote: »

This would be a lunch for all of the 'ordinary' staff ie excluding the 3 senior staff at Director level, so she would be the only one left out to all intents and purposes.

marieholmfan wrote: »

Three directors are going.

I would read that as the 3 directors not going, M'Lord.

Zulu · 11-12-2017 06:06PM

Meh, if shes a fan of passing her work to others, dress it up as "someone needs to stay behind and cover - really sorry, but you drew the short straw. I'm sure you wont mind since we've all been covering your slack for the past year you ould git-face".

It's exclusion no doubt, so there you go...

eviltimeban · 11-12-2017 06:06PM

Invite her. Think about how bad it would be in the office if she found out she didn't get asked. It would be long term pain for your short term gain.

If no one speaks to her at the lunch she might cop on to what's going on.

Maybe there's more deep seeded issues here - perhaps she is insecure, but afraid to admit it, as a lot of bullies are. Perhaps the lunch is a way of getting to know her outside of the work environment.

MilesMorales1 · 11-12-2017 06:06PM

ardinn wrote: »

It's far from bullying - they are leaving work for a get together - if cnutface will be there annoying everyone is that not a form of bullying in and of itself?

But its work associated, with people from work, and is in effect a work social event. According to the definition of workplace bullying on HSA

Bullying in the workplace has been described in various ways. The Health and Safety Authority’s definition is that it is:

"repeated inappropriate behaviour, direct or indirect, whether verbal, physical or otherwise, conducted by one or more persons against another or others, at the place of work and/or in the course of employment, which could reasonably be regarded as undermining the individual‘s right to dignity at work."

An isolated incident of the behaviour described in this definition may be an affront to dignity at work but as a once off incident is not considered to be bullying.

So no, it isn't.

SuperSean11 · 11-12-2017 06:08PM

Invite the people who you want, put one sign up in the male and the female bathrooms. Don’t talk about it and if she asks anyone about it downplay it e.g. “I don’t think anyone’s going”...
If she does go be nice and the strongest worker on her level has a quiet word with her.

Raytown Rocks · 11-12-2017 06:09PM

OP
Don't be sad if some day this week, 19 of your colleagues go to lunch and your left behind :)

freshpopcorn · 11-12-2017 06:11PM

I know somebody and their work colleges organise lunches.etc and they invite the person I know and somebody else along at the last minute. So, they can't say they weren't invited.

Brian? · 11-12-2017 06:11PM

Deandre Shapely Tape wrote: »

There's a person in work who has been pissing people off all year - basically too big for her boots, foists her work onto other people and is just generally full of herself.

We're planning to go for lunch the day we break up for Christmas and the person organising it wants to leave unpopular colleague out. Several others have agreed with this.

Personally I think that's a horrible thing to do to someone and particularly just before Christmas when we won't see each other for over a week. I know she's a pain, but it seems a really childish way to carry on. I'd rather not have the lunch at all than do something like that.

Just wondering how many of you would go along with something like this?

This can be considered silent bullying. You could land yourselves in serious hot water.

Avatar MIA · 11-12-2017 06:12PM

MilesMorales1 wrote: »

But its work associated, with people from work, and is in effect a work social event. According to the definition of workplace bullying on HSA

Most people don't get paid for their lunch break, so not work related.

However (as you pointed out), for different reasons it's not bullying under the definition anyway.

RoboRat · 11-12-2017 06:12PM

If you do it, be prepared to be hauled in front of the WRC and if management are not aware, be prepared for the backlash from them.

They could easily resign and then file for constructive dismissal and being honest, if 19 of the 20 employees were invited for lunch, you wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

Jimbob1977 · 11-12-2017 06:13PM

You should invite her

Be the bigger person (people)

Also, in the HR world, you could be perceived as bullying her

Avatar MIA · 11-12-2017 06:13PM

RoboRat wrote: »

If you do it, be prepared to be hauled in front of the WRC and if management are not aware, be prepared for the backlash from them.

They could easily resign and then file for constructive dismissal and being honest, if 19 of the 20 employees were invited for lunch, you wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

*sigh*

Are Am Eye · 11-12-2017 06:13PM

Bullying or harassment have be a sequence of events as opposed to one single thing. The danger might be that if there was already issues in the office and she was potentially going to make a complaint then not being invited to the staff christmas party would be the cherry in the cake. To anyone adjudicating such a complaint the non invite would look petty and small minded and would show this other girl in a sympathetic light.

Would you do this to a colleague?

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