Luas cross city line

07Lapierre · 08-12-2017 10:39pm #1

Cycled into town this evening to see what all the fuss is about the Luas tracks around Dame Street.

First impression is that they are certainly challenging for anyone not used to tram tracks. I cycled up O Connell Street towards Parnell Street and I found turning right off Parnell Street onto Parnell Square West the most challenging as you have to cope with the traffic, the tram tracks and the cobbles!

It was also a new experience turning left at the bottom of Dawson Street and heading down to Dame street! That's been a one way Street in the opposite direction for as long as I can remember!

It will be interesting to see how long it takes for people to get used to the new Street layout.

Weepsie · 08-12-2017 10:59pm

At least 1 incident in the first week.

ED E · 09-12-2017 4:28pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

turning right off Parnell Street onto Parnell Square West the most challenging

Fúckin lethal.

Props to the coach driver who gave me rakes of space on college green today.

Kaisr Sose · 09-12-2017 4:38pm

You would think they know by now how slippy cobbles can be – yet the obsession continues!

“They look so nice, and give a olde world asthethic to modern infastructure”

ozzy jr · 09-12-2017 5:26pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

I found turning right off Parnell Street onto Parnell Square West the most challenging as you have to cope with the traffic, the tram tracks and the cobbles!

I have the Strava KOM along Parnell Square West, so with the track and cobbles there now, I don't think it will ever be beaten

magicbastarder · 09-12-2017 5:30pm

this is the topic of the DCC meeting on monday.

Luas Cross City and Cycling
Monday, December 11, 2017
8pm, Central Hotel, Exchequer Street

The Luas Cross City is a boon for Dublin city, but what does it mean for people who cycle along or across this route? Cycling and on-street tram tracks is a safety issue all over the world. In general, cyclists learn fast, and realise that they must take greater care around the tracks, and ideally cross them at as close to a right angle as possible, while at the same time be aware of surrounding traffic.

Dublin Cycling Campaign have received numerous stories and reports of cycling crashes / incidents over the past months, some of them quite serious. Our December public meeting will discuss the impact for cyclists and whether changes are needed to make the route safer for cyclists.

Muahahaha · 09-12-2017 5:47pm

DCC are going to have to put rubber in the tracks. But it will take a number of bad injuries and maybe even worse before they actually realise it.

magicbastarder · 09-12-2017 5:58pm

btw, DCC in my post meant dublin cycling campaign; i assume you're referring to dublin city council?
i'm not sure how easy it is to retrofit the tracks with that rubber, but i doubt it would be DCC's responsibility, they don't operate the luas.

ED E · 09-12-2017 6:05pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

DCC are going to have to put rubber in the tracks. But it will take a number of bad injuries and maybe even worse before they actually realise it.

That stuff was tested and found to not last very long. Would need regular replacing and Transdev will in their arse pay to do it every fortnight.

OleRodrigo · 09-12-2017 6:13pm

Makes more sense for cyclists step up and improve their roadcraft, like they do in other cities with tram systems.

Nothing like going on your ear to improve your muscle memory.

magicbastarder · 09-12-2017 6:28pm

i've no muscles in my ear.

Weepsie · 09-12-2017 7:32pm

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Makes more sense for cyclists step up and improve their roadcraft, like they do in other cities with tram systems.

Nothing like going on your ear to improve your muscle memory.

No, makes sense to have planned it far better from the outset, but you know this.

It's a great success, but it's also a massively mismanaged project in many respects from inception to present day

Mercian Pro · 09-12-2017 8:50pm

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Makes more sense for cyclists step up and improve their roadcraft, like they do in other cities with tram systems.

Nothing like going on your ear to improve your muscle memory.

Like in Manchester and Edinburgh where cyclists have been killed after falling on tram tracks? Do you really think they would still be alive if they had perfected the bunny-hop?

Cycling in cities should be safe for everyone, not just a small minority who think roadcraft will save them.

07Lapierre · 09-12-2017 9:00pm

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Makes more sense for cyclists step up and improve their roadcraft, like they do in other cities with tram systems.

Nothing like going on your ear to improve your muscle memory.

Makes you wonder how there are so many car crashes nowadays.....you'd think everyone would have learned to drive by now :rolleyes:

07Lapierre · 09-12-2017 9:04pm

ED E wrote: »

Fúckin lethal.

Props to the coach driver who gave me rakes of space on college green today.

I think the safest way to cycle from College Green to Parnell Square is to cycle right smack in the middle of the lane. When you need to cross the tracks, slow down (and make sure the cars behind you have slowed), then make the turn at as near to 90 degrees as possible.

magicbastarder · 09-12-2017 9:07pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

Makes you wonder how there are so many car crashes nowadays.....you'd think everyone would have learned to drive by now :rolleyes:

well, the crashes would help people be better drivers.

OleRodrigo · 09-12-2017 9:44pm

All the mindless hysteria on the internet wont change the fact that Dublin city centre is safe to cycle in ( if you're a competent, responsible, civic minded cyclist ) and the Luas extension is great addition to all walks of life here.

You can whinge all you like but those are the facts.

As I live off Parnell Square, I pass that junction at least once a day, in all weathers. Taking the lane early and crossing at a good angle and keeping left on the square works best for all conditions.

P_1 · 09-12-2017 9:57pm

Never had any issues with the tracks myself. Agree that the city center is perfectly safe to cycle in, albeit painfully slow at times owing to the volume of slow moving cars.

Weepsie · 09-12-2017 9:59pm

It doesn't mean that's it's not poorly laid out.

It's not hysteria or whinging. Many flaws were pointed out very early and either dismissed or ignored entirely.

There'll be far more who don't live right beside it, who are perhaps more casual cyclists who will be injured as a result of poor design that forces you to cross at an angle that you just shouldn't.

Ive never had an issue with them either, I just don't think its right to dismiss genuine concerns so flippantly because you're okay with it

magicbastarder · 09-12-2017 10:05pm

OleRodrigo wrote: »

As I live off Parnell Square, I pass that junction at least once a day, in all weathers. Taking the lane early and crossing at a good angle and keeping left on the square works best for all conditions.

you're a confident, experienced cyclist and you're able to deal with it; and that's great. but it's not that sort of cyclist who'll generally have trouble with it. it's the occasional dublin-bike using, or what have you, sort of cyclist, who'll more likely come a cropper - and it should have been part of the design brief to deal with that factor - and not simply stick up lazy 'cyclists dismount' signs which is an institutional way of doing a pontius pilate on the issue.

OleRodrigo · 09-12-2017 10:19pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

you're a confident, experienced cyclist and you're able to deal with it; and that's great. but it's not that sort of cyclist who'll generally have trouble with it. it's the occasional dublin-bike using, or what have you, sort of cyclist, who'll more likely come a cropper - and it should have been part of the design brief to deal with that factor - and not simply stick up lazy 'cyclists dismount' signs which is an institutional way of doing a pontius pilate on the issue.

Spare me the melodrama Magicbastarder

As the MD of Transdev said this week, in his experience, all tram projects he has worked on throughout the world, cyclists don't have a problem and soon adapt.

Whats so different about Dublin? Not much as it turns out.

You can google his remarks in the Irish Times.

Weepsie · 09-12-2017 10:25pm

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Spare me the melodrama Magicbastarder

As the MD of Transdev said this week, in his experience, all tram projects he has worked on throughout the world, cyclists don't have a problem and soon adapt.

Whats so different about Dublin? Not much as it turns out.

You can google his remarks in the Irish Times.

That's not what he said though,

What he said was cyclists were not discussed in most cities... That's very different.

And as has been pointed out, it's a lie. Edinburgh and Manchester have had issues

AndrewJRenko · 09-12-2017 10:39pm

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Spare me the melodrama Magicbastarder

As the MD of Transdev said this week, in his experience, all tram projects he has worked on throughout the world, cyclists don't have a problem and soon adapt.

Whats so different about Dublin? Not much as it turns out.

You can google his remarks in the Irish Times.

He lied.
http://irishcycle.com/2017/12/08/luas-company-comments-on-cycling-false-and-dismissive-says-campaigners/

magicbastarder · 09-12-2017 11:00pm

i live on the projected path of metro north. i'll check back in here when it's completed and i will have some empirical data to report on how i have fared with light rail lines. that said, by then my bike will probably be artificially intelligent and i will have been asleep on it when the lines were traversed.

Corca Baiscinn · 09-12-2017 11:07pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

He lied.
http://irishcycle.com/2017/12/08/luas-company-comments-on-cycling-false-and-dismissive-says-campaigners/

Or at least was misinformed. Even Amsterdam deals with cycling injuries caused by tram tracks according to something I read this morning.

Kaisr Sose · 09-12-2017 11:20pm

When laying the revised track layout at Middle Abbey /O’Connell St, they didn’t even bother to put the tarmac level /seamless with the concete the track is encased in. Instead it’s lower/bumpy which just makes it a little bit harder on cyclists. How difficult is it to get it flush?

magicbastarder · 09-12-2017 11:43pm

OleRodrigo wrote: »

As the MD of Transdev said this week, in his experience, all tram projects he has worked on throughout the world, cyclists don't have a problem and soon adapt.

i guess others got there before me, but citing the person with possibly the most interest in downplaying the concerns, is not a way of convincing me there are none.

Kaisr Sose · 09-12-2017 11:52pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

i guess others got there before me, but citing the person with possibly the most interest in downplaying the concerns, is not a way of convincing me there are none.

It’s like comical Ali in BaghdadGulf War II!

Corca Baiscinn · 09-12-2017 11:56pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

i guess others got there before me, but citing the person with possibly the most interest in downplaying the concerns, is not a way of convincing me there are none.

How right you are...In the article Mr Transdev also said that he regards taxis as Public Tansport.

Well,he would, wouldn't he as according to this link https://www.transdev.com/en/Business/transport-demand

"With a solid presence on the taxi market in the United States, Transdev is the biggest operator in Baltimore, Denver, Pittsburg, and Kansas City. In Europe, its Dutch subsidiary Connexion Taxi is the leader in the Netherlands, with 30% of the market. Transdev is also a partner of taxi companies in Sweden and France".

AndrewJRenko · 10-12-2017 11:11am

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

Or at least was misinformed.

If you put yourself out there as an industry expert, you would be expected to have the relevant information to hand.

dr.fuzzenstein · 10-12-2017 11:21am

magicbastarder wrote: »

well, the crashes would help people be better drivers.

That is like saying that it would be drier if it rained less.

Luas cross city line

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