Unpopular GAA opinion - MOD Note #426

dobman88 · 09-11-2017 5:51pm

This Mayo team isn't as good as people are making out. If they were as good as people say, they would have won their all Ireland by now.

MayoAreMagic · 09-11-2017 6:40pm

kilns wrote: »

The case was made that Clarke won the goalkeeper award because he made lots of saves and saved Mayo's bacon in two games and Cluxton did not get it because he didnt get as much action. Mayo played less division 1 teams than Dublin also in their run. This would indicate that one of the defences was much poorer than the other. However the "poorer" defence received 66% of the all stars up for grabs in defence. Logically it does not make sense, does it?

Mayo played more games and played Kerry twice. If Cluxton and co had done the same he'd have gotten a few more chances to make saves and his defence would have had more work to do, I don't think that can be denied.
Mayo defend man for man, so they will concede more chances, but their defenders will also stand out more. For example Barrett's turnovers in the final. If that was 2-3 guys crowding out one man, it is viewed quite different, and rightly so in my book. Individual excellence like what barrett displayed should be rewarded with individual awards.

I can spin that around for you - James McCarthy was being lauded for an all star ad mf, yet the same James McCarthy was in midfield when Mayo won pretty much every kickout for an entire half. Most of these were won by tom parsons, who didn't get an all star. He was changed to wing back and played better, but Parsons should get the all star at mf, correct? Logically it doesn't make sense, right?

Anyway, back to the opinions..

kilns · 09-11-2017 6:59pm

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

kilns wrote: »

The case was made that Clarke won the goalkeeper award because he made lots of saves and saved Mayo's bacon in two games and Cluxton did not get it because he didnt get as much action. Mayo played less division 1 teams than Dublin also in their run. This would indicate that one of the defences was much poorer than the other. However the "poorer" defence received 66% of the all stars up for grabs in defence. Logically it does not make sense, does it?

Mayo played more games and played Kerry twice. If Cluxton and co had done the same he'd have gotten a few more chances to make saves and his defence would have had more work to do, I don't think that can be denied.
Mayo defend man for man, so they will concede more chances, but their defenders will also stand out more. For example Barrett's turnovers in the final. If that was 2-3 guys crowding out one man, it is viewed quite different, and rightly so in my book. Individual excellence like what barrett displayed should be rewarded with individual awards.

I can spin that around for you - James McCarthy was being lauded for an all star ad mf, yet the same James McCarthy was in midfield when Mayo won pretty much every kickout for an entire half. Most of these were won by tom parsons, who didn't get an all star. He was changed to wing back and played better, but Parsons should get the all star at mf, correct? Logically it doesn't make sense, right?

Anyway, back to the opinions..

Ha ha you are hiliarous. Again if Mayo man for man in defence were so good how come Clarke got so much action?
An All star should be considered over a whole season and you highlight one half of football for James McCarthy but neglect to mention the rest of his season and the fact he was the best player on the pitch in the second half.

blanch152 · 09-11-2017 7:25pm

dobman88 wrote: »

This Mayo team isn't as good as people are making out. If they were as good as people say, they would have won their all Ireland by now.

I disagree, I do believe that in any other era this Mayo team would have won a couple of All-Irelands.

Unfortunately for them, they have come up against the greatest team to play the game.

MayoAreMagic · 09-11-2017 7:35pm

kilns wrote: »

Ha ha you are hiliarous. Again if Mayo man for man in defence were so good how come Clarke got so much action?
An All star should be considered over a whole season and you highlight one half of football for James McCarthy but neglect to mention the rest of his season and the fact he was the best player on the pitch in the second half.

I just explained the first part.
Re mccarthy, he had a great second half alright, but he did so from wing back... Again, how can he get an all star in midfield, going off your above logic? Similarly you are finding fault with the mayo defenders, yet barrett was the best player on the pitch in the final, in the same way you are arguing in favour of mccarthy. You are contradicting yourself completely man.

I'l be the one to get back to the topic

I dont think cluxton had all that good a year this year and that clarke was actually well ahead of him

kilns · 09-11-2017 7:41pm

You explained because Mayo played more games against inferior opposition to who Dublin faced. Again if they went man to man how come their opponents scored lots of goals and forced Clarke into lots of saves. I would deem that poor defending.

If you were going into the final again and had a choice of clarke or cluxton. Hands down you would pick Cluxton

MayoAreMagic · 09-11-2017 7:46pm

kilns wrote: »

You explained because Mayo played more games against inferior opposition to who Dublin faced. Again if they went man to man how come their opponents scored lots of goals and forced Clarke into lots of saves. I would deem that poor defending.

If you were going into the final again and had a choice of clarke or cluxton. Hands down you would pick Cluxton

Why do you feel the need to reword my explanation?

If i was going into the final again id choose clarke tbh, because he had a better game. Mayo would probably have lost by a hatful had we kicked away as much as cluxton did in that first half.

Anyway, back to the topic

kilns · 09-11-2017 7:52pm

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

kilns wrote: »

You explained because Mayo played more games against inferior opposition to who Dublin faced. Again if they went man to man how come their opponents scored lots of goals and forced Clarke into lots of saves. I would deem that poor defending.

If you were going into the final again and had a choice of clarke or cluxton. Hands down you would pick Cluxton

Why do you feel the need to reword my explanation?

If i was going into the final again id choose clarke tbh, because he had a better game. Mayo would probably have lost by a hatful had we kicked away as much as cluxton did in that first half.

Anyway, back to the topic

Fact is Cluxton would not have kicked that ball over the sideline he would have found a Dublin player. Its called clutch

By the way. Going into the final what Dublin player would you pick ahead of Mayo player if you could?

Bonniedog · 09-11-2017 8:01pm

kilns wrote: »

Fact is Cluxton would not have kicked that ball over the sideline he would have found a Dublin player. Its called clutch

By the way. Going into the final what Dublin player would you pick ahead of Mayo player if you could?

Video shows three Mayo players making intelligent runs to the left and in front of Clarke but he chose to fire the ball towards the sideline where there were two Dublin players.

The Greg Norman of goalkeeping

MayoAreMagic · 09-11-2017 8:06pm

kilns wrote: »

Fact is Cluxton would not have kicked that ball over the sideline he would have found a Dublin player. Its called clutch

By the way. Going into the final what Dublin player would you pick ahead of Mayo player if you could?

But surely all the kickouts in the first half were equally as 'clutch'? I dont really rate that kind of after the fact critiquing to be honest with you. Like if mayo rattle two goals off those kicks in the first, do they now become clutch kicks?

If you look at the thing objectively you will see that there was a common thread on the day - the wind into the davin end. It held up cluxtons kickouts and gave rock trouble in the first half, and it got under clarkes kickout and gave o'connor similar issues to rock in the second half.

Re the dublin players mccarthy, fenton, kilkenny, connolly mannion.
Not realy the place for this discussion though.

Jaden · 09-11-2017 8:06pm

Unpopular Opinion?

The biggest issue with funding in the GAA, is that the organisation itself can't trust the vast majority of requesters not to piss anything they get away. Financial mismanagement is endemic to the point where it is considered the norm. This is one of, if not the primary hindrance to development of our national games.

TrueGael · 09-11-2017 8:27pm

Jaden wrote: »

Unpopular Opinion?

The biggest issue with funding in the GAA, is that the organisation itself can't trust the vast majority of requesters not to piss anything they get away. Financial mismanagement is endemic to the point where it is considered the norm. This is one of, if not the primary hindrance to development of our national games.

You're right, should just give Dublin 99% of the funding and create a Globetrotters type Juggernaut team winning the next 50 AI's , can't trust those thick culchies

Fr Tod Umptious · 09-11-2017 8:34pm

Mehapoy wrote: »

Gaelic football is a made up bastardised version of soccer and rugby, made up only to entice the rural soccer and rugby teams into gaelic games...was a pity it was ever invented as we may have had decent soccer and rugby teams...hurling is an actual games with solid roots in the country

I agree that football is a made up game to differentiate itself from soccer and rugby.

One of the oldest clubs in the country is Laune Rangers in Killorglin Co. Kerry.

Football was brought to Killorglin by two Dublin school teachers.
The best athletes in the town at the time played rugby but converted to football.

It does not bother me if Gaelic games have lessened our ability to compete internationally at other sports, just because a sport is local does not mean it is a lesser sport.

Rugby, soccer and cricket are popular internationally because the British were the most influential nation on earth at the time they were becoming codeified

ArielAtom · 09-11-2017 8:50pm

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

kilns wrote: »

Ha ha you are hiliarous. Again if Mayo man for man in defence were so good how come Clarke got so much action?
An All star should be considered over a whole season and you highlight one half of football for James McCarthy but neglect to mention the rest of his season and the fact he was the best player on the pitch in the second half.

I just explained the first part.
Re mccarthy, he had a great second half alright, but he did so from wing back... Again, how can he get an all star in midfield, going off your above logic? Similarly you are finding fault with the mayo defenders, yet barrett was the best player on the pitch in the final, in the same way you are arguing in favour of mccarthy. You are contradicting yourself completely man.

I'l be the one to get back to the topic

I dont think cluxton had all that good a year this year and that clarke was actually well ahead of him

As someone who gets it wrong occasionally, where did Barrett play, was it corner back or centre half back? I can't remember

Jaden · 09-11-2017 9:26pm

TrueGael wrote: »

You're right, should just give Dublin 99% of the funding and create a Globetrotters type Juggernaut team winning the next 50 AI's , can't trust those thick culchies

No mention made of location or level of the endemic issue, yet you have made it a Dublin Vs Culchie thing (your words).

100% Troll with a chip on his shoulder confirmed.

cms88 · 09-11-2017 10:18pm

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I agree that football is a made up game to differentiate itself from soccer and rugby.

One of the oldest clubs in the country is Laune Rangers in Killorglin Co. Kerry.

Football was brought to Killorglin by two Dublin school teachers.
The best athletes in the town at the time played rugby but converted to football.

It does not bother me if Gaelic games have lessened our ability to compete internationally at other sports, just because a sport is local does not mean it is a lesser sport.

Rugby, soccer and cricket are popular internationally because the British were the most influential nation on earth at the time they were becoming codeified

Surely every sport is ''made up'' no? Then again most hurling fans probably think hurling just appeared

Diabhal Beag · 09-11-2017 10:22pm

The sideline cut over the bar should still be worth two points. It's a fantastic skill and I believe we'd see less wides from a sideline if it was given more value. There's no better point than a sideline over the bar.

Fr Tod Umptious · 09-11-2017 10:28pm

cms88 wrote: »

Surely every sport is ''made up'' no? Then again most hurling fans probably think hurling just appeared

That is of course true, but in relation to football I have heard that the game was "invented" as a Irish football game.

What infulence "caid" had on it's early rules and playing style I don't know, and I'd love to find some sources about that.

Bonniedog · 09-11-2017 10:28pm

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I agree that football is a made up game to differentiate itself from soccer and rugby.

Yes, but it is not you see.

Codified rugby and the wendyball only date to the 1870s. Didn't exist here outside of Brit garrisons until 1880s, after the GAA was formed. Gaelic football is based on much older game, cáid.

That game was strong in Kerry, north county Dublin, Meath ...... didn't lick it off the stones!

There are lots of sources about the origin of the game. Only ones who claim it to be bastardization of wendyball are bitter oul FAI heads who cant cope with failure :-)

blanch152 · 09-11-2017 11:16pm

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Why do you feel the need to reword my explanation?

If i was going into the final again id choose clarke tbh, because he had a better game. Mayo would probably have lost by a hatful had we kicked away as much as cluxton did in that first half.

Anyway, back to the topic

This shows how little you understand how the All-Ireland was actually won.

Cluxton's kick-out success over the whole game was higher than Clarke's. Throughout the game, Clarke handed over possession to Dublin, making sure that Mayo could never get a run on them.

When it came to the crucial kick-out in injury time, Clarke choked and kicked it over the sideline when there were five Mayo men free with one Dublin marker between them. Cluxton was coolness personified when Dublin played keepball.

The fact that my unpopular opinion that Clarke will always choke has generated such a response only proves that it hits a nerve and is therefore more true than you think.

Hammer Archer · 09-11-2017 11:39pm

OK lads let's not rehash this for the millionth time in the millionth thread. It's been done to death.
This can be an interesting thread without it descending into another argument about this year's All-Ireland final.

Bonniedog · 09-11-2017 11:56pm

But its great crack!

OK, point taken. I have never rubbed anyone's defeat in their face. I hope!

TrueGael · 10-11-2017 12:00am

Jaden wrote: »

No mention made of location or level of the endemic issue, yet you have made it a Dublin Vs Culchie thing (your words).

100% Troll with a chip on his shoulder confirmed.

Own up to your opinion you implied the thicko muck savages from the country wouldn't know what to do with the money, don't hide from what you were trying to say we thickos understand loud and clear

ProudDUB · 10-11-2017 12:29am

TrueGael wrote: »

Own up to your opinion you implied the thicko muck savages from the country wouldn't know what to do with the money, don't hide from what you were trying to say we thickos understand loud and clear

Or maybe he was thinking about reports like those commissioned by the Leinster Council in the article below.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/revealed-damning-report-exposes-glaring-inadequacies-in-gaa-spending-and-player-development-34844507.html

It doesn't exactly paint the financial governance of certain counties in a good light, when they got their hands on serious amounts of dosh.

But if that massive chip on your shoulder makes you want to turn this into something about thicko muck savages, knock yourself out.

Stoner · 10-11-2017 12:54am

Cork GAA supporters secretly like football. The game is suppressed there because two counties that they have a significant rivalry with, Kerry and The Capital win a lot of titles.

On top of that Kerry and Dublin are not successful in hurling. So my unpopular opinion is that in part, Cork people suppress football and discount it as a game because they hate being beaten by Kerry and the odd time when they play Dublin. When beaten they say sure it's all about the hurling anyway, very little mention if that in 2010 when they won the AI.
They are still good Hurlers all the same, but they've had great footballers and football teams fed from a great tradition of football that is sadly dying.

independent11 · 10-11-2017 12:56am

Stop providing support to weaker hurling counties, financial or otherwise. They’ve been weak for 100+ years and will be in 100 years time as well.

All Ireland hurling should be a Super 8 of the elite hurling counties only. Play all games in Croke Park. County hurlers should no longer play for clubs as too much conflict. Let the club championships go ahead during the summer into the All Ireland club championship and play that final as a curtain raiser to the PGA* World Series Senior Hurling Final.

* Professional Gaelic Association

pmurphy00 · 10-11-2017 1:10am

1. Too many scores from frees greatly reduce both hurling and football as a spectacle. particularly hurling as they can be scored from so far out.

2. they'll need a shot clock like basketball(maybe 2 mins) otherwise football is just a boring hand passing game played in a big field with 15 runners.

3. too much emphasis is on winning in GAA.
The kerry v mayo semi final was a very poor spectacle to drive 200 odd miles to, even allowing for a kery defeat. Eventually as the spectacle diminishes it'll effect attendances and even interest.

4. allowing the game to flow.
the game has rules, the ref should apply them to the best of his ability.
if the rules are wrong congress should change them.

5. the entire rte panel should be ovehauled

Bonniedog · 10-11-2017 1:15am

Full house at league final last year, 54,000 this year..... hardly a sign of diminishing attendances!

gammygils · 10-11-2017 1:26am

There should be a fairer system for All-Ireland ticket allocation.
They should be made available to those who support their County all season long & not to the "Croke Park only" brigade
And most definitely not to neutrals who just want a day out!

BonnieSituation · 10-11-2017 1:51am

gammygils wrote: »

There should be a fairer system for All-Ireland ticket allocation.
They should be made available to those who support their County all season long & not to the "Croke Park only" brigade
And most definitely not to neutrals who just want a day out!

https://www.seasontickets.ie/

THEY ARE!

Unpopular GAA opinion - MOD Note #426

Comments