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Unpopular GAA opinion - MOD Note #426

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  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 10,952 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stoner


    cms88 wrote:
    Compared to the 00's when you had Kerry, Armagh, Tyrone and Cork able to and winning All-Irleands in that time. Outside of those you had the likes of Monaghan, Derry, Laois, Westmeath, and even Fermanagh, Limerick and Sligo, who could put it up to teams who on paper

    Tbh I don't really think so.

    The LFC has been poor for years now. Really Dublin went from being the best of a bad bunch with Meath to being a great team, but Laois,Westmeath, Offaly etc picked up championships when Dublin and Meath were poor. They beat poor Dublin and Meath teams, just like when Westmeath won against Meath last year, at the end of the day it was a poor Meath team. I've left Kildare out of this one as I was corrected on this before

    The current Monaghan team that's been around for the past few years (now falling away) was better than the Monaghan team of the 00s imo. They've achieved all sorts of records like beating Tyrone and winning Ulster Championships for the first time in years.

    Armagh had a peak then, they won their one and only title. They had a great team for a few years. That could be the Donegal team now.

    Back then you had Kerry and Tyrone teams with 3 and 4 titles each, Derry, Sligo, Lenister, Monaghan etc were a mile off them. Cork were not great then they had their best team in years from 2010 to 2012 and picked up an AI from it.

    I'd agree with the above. For Mayo, deservedly at the top of the table. They had close games with many of the teams you mentioned above and have been beaten by two teams you didn't mention that were poor in the 00s too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,115 ✭✭✭✭castletownman


    On Connolly, one barometer I would use to measure the idea that he is over-rated, is the fact that in his absence this year, Paul Mannion scored 0-8 from play from the left wing forward berth vs Westmeath, and O'Callaghan managed 0-12 (six from play) in the Leinster final. Now I know they were one-sided victories for Dublin, but I never recall Dermo managing even near that total in similar processions.

    And while I would say it's almost like they didn't miss him at all this year, at the same time he did play a huge part in the final minutes of the AI final.

    But overall yeah, I would say he is over-hyped. Cluxton, McCarthy, McCaffrey, Brogan x 2, Flynn all far more influential for Dublin during this golden era, and MDMA, COS and McMenaman would have strong cases ahead of him too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭cms88


    Stoner wrote: »
    Tbh I don't really think so.

    The LFC has been poor for years now. Really Dublin went from being the best of a bad bunch with Meath to being a great team, but Laois,Westmeath, Offaly etc picked up championships when Dublin and Meath were poor. They beat poor Dublin and Meath teams, just like when Westmeath won against Meath last year, at the end of the day it was a poor Meath team. I've left Kildare out of this one as I was corrected on this before

    The current Monaghan team that's been around for the past few years (now falling away) was better than the Monaghan team of the 00s imo. They've achieved all sorts of records like beating Tyrone and winning Ulster Championships for the first time in years.

    Armagh had a peak then, they won their one and only title. They had a great team for a few years. That could be the Donegal team now.

    Back then you had Kerry and Tyrone teams with 3 and 4 titles each, Derry, Sligo, Lenister, Monaghan etc were a mile off them. Cork were not great then they had their best team in years from 2010 to 2012 and picked up an AI from it.

    I'd agree with the above. For Mayo, deservedly at the top of the table. They had close games with many of the teams you mentioned above and have been beaten by two teams you didn't mention that were poor in the 00s too.

    I disagree from 2005 to 2011 they only team Cork lost to in the championship was Kerry. They were easily in the top 2/3 during that time


  • Registered Users Posts: 34,066 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    2009 was year Cork blew the AI. Should have least won 2 AI in that 2008 to 2012 period


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 10,952 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stoner


    I think they had a case in 2011 too as that Dublin team struggled with them


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,723 ✭✭✭nice_guy80


    the GPA are getting too much money from the GAA
    it seems to be run for the benefit of a few well connected county players, rather than all county players

    the tail is now wagging the dog


  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭LooseCannonUF


    I love the GAA but never liked the Hard Man attitude.

    I think the Violence I have seen at some games has been shocking. I have seen lads noses broken and heads smash. and that's just at u16 games.

    DJ Carey was overrated. Brian Whelan was overrated.

    2 words: F*CK OFF


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,993 ✭✭✭Sheep breeder


    Watched a lot of Brian Whelehan, certainly the best half back of his era, undoubtedly the most talented hurler I have ever seen and scored 1-6 in an all Ireland final to boot!

    Would love to know who you considered a better half back in his era?

    Think Tommy Walsh has probably eclipsed him but he was a super hurler, hence the widespread recognition.

    Had the luck to attend that all ireland as a neutral and to see Brian that day was a joy in the canal end and he was sick that day, that Offaly team had some super hurlers and massive team players.

    Tonight on tg4 ja fallon was on and what a skillful player he was in his prime and how he could drop shoulder to go by a man was a joy to behold.

    The great thing about the gaa at club level is the loyalty to the jersey let it begin senior or junior B and the pride of the village. Compared to the soccer where the player changes around clubs each year.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭liam7831


    Ah their a great bunch of lads


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    Wouldn't mind seeing a trial run of a Connacht Seinor hurling team in the championship . All counties in the province excluding Galway obviously.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,014 ✭✭✭Hulk Hands


    65's and 45's should be made indirect. It's an insane punishment for the defending team that a deflected wide ball often results in a point. Over 80% of 65's are scored at IC level. What's the point of a defender making a brave block of a point, only to see it result in a near certain point when it deflects over the end line?

    Same could be argued for sidelines, as sad as it'd be to see those great scores go in both codes. A sideline shouldn't be an advantage to anyone, it should be a ways of getting the ball back into play. The 2 point sideline rule brought in in hurling is the most ludicrous one the GAA ever invented.

    The Black Card has increased the rate of goals in Football by a reasonable margin, so can certainly be seen as a positive. I think the simple way forward is just make the very cynical drag downs from behind straight red cards and remove the confusion.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,014 ✭✭✭Hulk Hands


    2009 was year Cork blew the AI. Should have least won 2 AI in that 2008 to 2012 period

    Hammering of Tyrone that semi final of 09 was the most impressive performance of the noughties imo


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,723 ✭✭✭nice_guy80


    Wouldn't mind seeing a trial run of a Connacht Seinor hurling team in the championship . All counties in the province excluding Galway obviously.

    yeah. only 22 clubs outside Galway. I think


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭liam7831


    They should Introduce a corner kick instead of 45s


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭cms88


    nice_guy80 wrote: »
    the GPA are getting too much money from the GAA
    it seems to be run for the benefit of a few well connected county players, rather than all county players

    the tail is now wagging the dog

    For anyone outside an small number of players etc this wouldn't be a very unpopular view


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,590 ✭✭✭CurryFlavoured


    liam7831 wrote: »
    They should Introduce a corner kick instead of 45s

    I don't have a problem with 45s, because they're a very difficult skill and not that many players can kick them consistently. I feel like 65s are scored more regularly in hurling.


  • Registered Users Posts: 34,066 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    2 words F*CK OFF

    That was 3


  • Registered Users Posts: 34,066 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    80% of 65s are scored at IC level? how true is that?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Umpires should be refs who have been approved. Same as sideline. Some of them have no business being near inter county games. Hawkeye has proven that much/


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,923 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    That was 3

    I counted 4


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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Umpires should be refs who have been approved. Same as sideline. Some of them have no business being near inter county games. Hawkeye has proven that much/

    Keep them under 60 and have mandatory eyesight testing before approving them for IC service.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,723 ✭✭✭nice_guy80


    Most people don't realise how hard it is to get four umpires for a game. any game

    even the umpires on all Ireland final day arw volunteers.
    they get a free dinner. that is all

    how you going to get four referees to do it?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    nice_guy80 wrote: »
    Most people don't realise how hard it is to get four umpires for a game. any game

    even the umpires on all Ireland final day arw volunteers.
    they get a free dinner. that is all

    how you going to get four referees to do it?


    Pay them or something! Not good enough that everyone else involved including the ref and linesmen are properly trained and monitored and you can have someone's half blind cousin deciding on scores and penalties and 45s and 65s.

    I've umpired myself and know it is difficult enough job, especially if you have limited space behind the goal, but some of the decisions I have seen have been laughable. Once had umpire ask me whether I thought a ball had been wide or a 45! Perhaps it is time whole thing was hawkeyed. For big games anyway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭LooseCannonUF


    That was 3

    2 words after I had stated 2 words:


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭MayoAreMagic


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Pay them or something! Not good enough that everyone else involved including the ref and linesmen are properly trained and monitored and you can have someone's half blind cousin deciding on scores and penalties and 45s and 65s.

    I've umpired myself and know it is difficult enough job, especially if you have limited space behind the goal, but some of the decisions I have seen have been laughable. Once had umpire ask me whether I thought a ball had been wide or a 45! Perhaps it is time whole thing was hawkeyed. For big games anyway.

    Exactly. 83 odd thousand people paying 60-80 euro into the thing and they cant send a few quid in the direction of the umpires? The gaa really and truly make hay on the back on that amateur ethos stuff.
    The only tough calls they have now, are looked after by hawkeye anyway.



    On the topic of Diarmuid Connolly. Id agree that he is probably over-rated to a degree. He is one of these guys who is capable of instances of great skill, which some people tend to confuse with being a great player in general. Kicking a bomb of a point with both feet is great, but it isn't the same as say a guy controlling a game, or the ultimate test of a guy making the players around him look better - which is what the gooch was capable of doing.
    Kilkenny is a bigger player for Dublin than Connolly and has been for a few years.
    Aidan O'Shea is probably similar is some ways. He will do something that other players cant do, but someone like Kevin McLoughlin does more in general. Id love to see an assists count brought into gaa. Guys like McLoughlin would be off the charts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    I've given MAM a like. must lie down .....

    Good point about assists. Mcloughlin, Kilkenny and DC be well up there. Some of most effective players in NBA like Green don't really score much. Gaelic football has become quite like it in some ways. Thing about DC though is that he is capable of doing unpredictable, like the point in the final when Dublin were under pressure. No offence to AOS but he has never pulled Mayo out of a hole in that way.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭MayoAreMagic


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    I've given MAM a like. must lie down .....

    To be honest, therein lies the problem. Too much of who am I responding too goes on, rather than what am I responding to. I don't actually care who I'm responding to, I just respond to what is said.

    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Good point about assists. Mcloughlin, Kilkenny and DC be well up there. Some of most effective players in NBA like Green don't really score much. Gaelic football has become quite like it in some ways. Thing about DC though is that he is capable of doing unpredictable, like the point in the final when Dublin were under pressure. No offence to AOS but he has never pulled Mayo out of a hole in that way.

    You are probably taking the comparison too literally, I'm not saying they are identical players. Plus you are probably putting too much faith in kicking points. Michael Fitzsimons pulled Dublin out a few holes in his time, but I've yet to see him kick a point.

    O'Shea has actually been to the fore often for mayo to be honest with you. He was to the fore against Derry, when few others were. He was to the fore when Donegal were about to relegate us in the league this year. He was to the fore against Kerry in the replay, after getting a serious slating in the first game. He was actually to the fore for most of the AI final too. People focus on the negative with O'Shea because they don't like the guy, mainly because he fancies himself a bit and he gets a lot of media coverage. Is he any different to Bernard Brogan on that front? Not really.
    You could argue that the same can be said of Connolly, but then nobody is saying o'shea is the best player of his generation/in the game/etc etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    I don't dislike AOS. Never met him so why would I? But as player with similar role as Connolly, the latter has made massive difference in big games, including practically winning AI for Vinnies singlehanded a few years ago.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭MayoAreMagic


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    I don't dislike AOS. Never met him so why would I? But as player with similar role as Connolly, the latter has made massive difference in big games, including practically winning AI for Vinnies singlehanded a few years ago.

    They don't have similar roles at all though. O'Shea grafts around the middle, turning over ball, winning it in the air, turning guys around, he will pop up with the odd score, but truth be told he is like a high-pressing no.6 than a no.11.
    Connolly plays pretty much completely as an orthodox forward, albeit with a very good work rate.

    As for vincents, they have a very strong team, on their day though could put it up to some county teams. This single-handed all Ireland stuff is far fetched. Also, where was he at the weekend when they needed him? Id consider his performance in a loss to a complete outsider a far bigger indicator than a win in a game they were expected to win.

    On the subject of vincents, and unpopular opinions, I think poor auld enda varley doesn't get half the credit he deserves for his performances for them.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    No one in Dublin doubts how valuable Varley is to Vins, Great player.

    Rathnew are never "complete outsiders." Wicklow clubs have very good record in club and it was always going to be a tough test.


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