Eir rural FTTH thread

__..__ · 23-09-2017 01:36PM

What router do they give you with FTTH?
Is it capable of 1000mbps wireless?

ED E · 23-09-2017 02:02PM

__..__ wrote: »

What router do they give you with FTTH?
Is it capable of 1000mbps wireless?

No. Only 60Ghz can give you wiGig and its been abandoned.

ED E · 23-09-2017 02:06PM

Avada wrote: »

It's possible alright.

Personally I'd like rid of them. I worked for one of the providers in customer service. Cleaning up their messes was soul destroying.

The problem is telesales are hamstrung by the truth:
"Why join you"
"We give a better service"
"Is it faster"
"No"
"Is it cheaper?"
"Same price"
*hangs up*

Unfortunately lying dirtbags at the door do make sales and a certain percentage don't complain. Once one provider does it all need to to keep up the arms race.

sean72 · 23-09-2017 02:36PM

Guys thanks for all the info on this thread. I have unfortunately though found out that although part of the FTTH roll out what I and I would imagine many throughout the country will find out is that what I am going to get is FTTC as I live within 1km of the exchange and my internet will come to the house via my existing copper line. Meaning I will receive a max of 100 mb/s, or around 50-70 as I live 460m from the exchange.

Can I ask if anyone know what are the packages available to customer like me with Eir. As the bottom package of FTTH is up to 150 mb/s surely this can't be offered to customers on FTTC as 150 as far as I understand is not possible. Are there other packages?

Marlow · 23-09-2017 02:39PM

__..__ wrote: »

What router do they give you with FTTH?
Is it capable of 1000mbps wireless?

ED E wrote: »

No. Only 60Ghz can give you wiGig and its been abandoned.

On top of that, even if the router was capable of WiGig, most wireless devices in phones, tablets and laptops would still not be capable to utilize that.

I have managed to squeeze a Samsung S5 to 400 mbit/s on a SIRO Gigabit connection though

(Nevermind the status of the phone being 4G. The test was done on a Samsung S5, using a Fritz!Box 7560 on a SIRO based 1000/200 connection.)

On the Ethernet side, that router will provide Gbit/s no problem.

/M

23-09-2017 02:47PM

sean72 wrote: »

Guys thanks for all the info on this thread. I have unfortunately though found out that although part of the FTTH roll out what I and I would imagine many throughout the country will find out is that what I am going to get is FTTC as I live within 1km of the exchange and my internet will come to the house via my existing copper line. Meaning I will receive a max of 100 mb/s, or around 50-70 as I live 460m from the exchange.

I suspect that FTTC is only an interim step in getting many onto high speed internet as fast as possible. Maybe when the rollout of rural FTTH is completed, they will then start the plan to "retire" copper entirely, then they will replace the copper links between the cabinets and the urban properties. That is likely to be about 10 years down the line.

I'm sure more knowledgeable posters here will be able to provide a better guestemate.

sean72 · 23-09-2017 02:55PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I suspect that FTTC is only an interim step in getting many onto high speed internet as fast as possible. Maybe when the rollout of rural FTTH is completed, they will then start the plan to "retire" copper entirely, then they will replace the copper links between the cabinets and the urban properties. That is likely to be about 10 years down the line.

I'm sure more knowledgeable posters here will be able to provide a better guestemate.

Well the most frustrating thing is that the fibre line is physically passing by all the houses within the 1km radius ..... to a few one off houses dotted around. Your right I'm sure over time....but its taken so long to get here :mad:

The Cush · 23-09-2017 03:26PM

sean72 wrote: »

Can I ask if anyone know what are the packages available to customer like me with Eir. As the bottom package of FTTH is up to 150 mb/s surely this can't be offered to customers on FTTC as 150 as far as I understand is not possible. Are there other packages?

You will see the current pricing for their eir Fibre or Unlimited FTTC packages in these pricing docs.

https://www.eir.ie/opencms/export/sites/default/.content/pdf/pricing/Part3.1.pdf
https://www.eir.ie/opencms/export/sites/default/.content/pdf/pricing/pt4.1.10.pdf

vintagevrs · 23-09-2017 03:30PM

sean72 wrote: »

Guys thanks for all the info on this thread. I have unfortunately though found out that although part of the FTTH roll out what I and I would imagine many throughout the country will find out is that what I am going to get is FTTC as I live within 1km of the exchange and my internet will come to the house via my existing copper line. Meaning I will receive a max of 100 mb/s, or around 50-70 as I live 460m from the exchange.

Can I ask if anyone know what are the packages available to customer like me with Eir. As the bottom package of FTTH is up to 150 mb/s surely this can't be offered to customers on FTTC as 150 as far as I understand is not possible. Are there other packages?

Try this....

https://www.eir.ie/broadband-only/

The Cush · 23-09-2017 03:39PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I suspect that FTTC is only an interim step in getting many onto high speed internet as fast as possible. Maybe when the rollout of rural FTTH is completed, they will then start the plan to "retire" copper entirely, then they will replace the copper links between the cabinets and the urban properties. That is likely to be about 10 years down the line.

Depends on how long it takes Comreg to get the necessary regulatory requirements in place to allow them remove the copper lines, this requires the agreement of the other users of the copper lines like Vodafone, Digiweb etc.

Then, how long the will the transition be, rural areas should be all wired for fibre by 2022/23 with urban areas to follow, 8-10 years is probably a good guess for the end of copper.

Marlow · 23-09-2017 03:52PM

The Cush wrote: »

Depends on how long it takes Comreg to get the necessary regulatory requirements in place to allow them remove the copper lines, this requires the agreement of the other users of the copper lines like Vodafone, Digiweb etc.

Then, how long the will the transition be, rural areas should be all wired for fibre by 2022/23 with urban areas to follow, 8-10 years is probably a good guess for the end of copper.

And by that time, SIRO for example will have the entire fiber infrastructure in place, Eir will have lost most of that business and it won't be feasable to invest that money. Obviously Eirs (foreign) investors are not interested to pump too much money back.

/M

rob808 · 23-09-2017 04:01PM

Marlow wrote: »

And by that time, SIRO for example will have the entire fiber infrastructure in place, Eir will have lost most of that business and it won't be feasable to invest that money. Obviously Eirs (foreign) investors are not interested to pump too much money back.

/M

I don't know about that looking at how slow siro urban rollout looking at the moment. There not going to hit there target of finishing by the end of 2018.

The Cush · 23-09-2017 04:04PM

Marlow wrote: »

And by that time, SIRO for example will have the entire fiber infrastructure in place, Eir will have lost most of that business and it won't be feasable to invest that money. Obviously Eirs (foreign) investors are not interested to pump too much money back.

Of course eir doesn't have to wait until the rollout of rural fibre completes to begin the rollout in urban areas, I guess this will be decided when the NBP contracts are awarded.

Marlow · 23-09-2017 04:07PM

rob808 wrote: »

I don't know about that looking at how slow siro urban rollout looking at the moment. There not going to hit there target of finishing by the end of 2018.

And you think Eir is hitting their target ? I've heard something of approx 44 actual installations a week ... nationwide .. when it comes to Eir and OpenEIR FTTH.

Was supported to be over 400 a week.

From what I'm looking at, SIRO is making a better job of it at the moment.

/M

Westnet: Paul · 23-09-2017 04:16PM

ED E wrote: »

Unfortunately lying dirtbags at the door do make sales and a certain percentage don't complain. Once one provider does it all need to to keep up the arms race.

No, we don't. Some of us take a longer view and realise that once you've alienated a potential customer by lying to them on the first contact, it's almost impossible to regain that trust.

Maybe some of the bigger providers figure that it's a worthwhile tradeoff, but we don't. We accept that we'll lose some initial sales to unscrupulous tactics, but hopefully we'll be able to win back some disillusioned customers at a later date.

As I've often said: we have nothing to fear from competition, as long as it's on a level playing field.

tsue921i8wljb3 · 23-09-2017 04:17PM

Marlow wrote: »

And you think Eir is hitting their target ? I've heard something of approx 44 actual installations a week ... nationwide .. when it comes to Eir and OpenEIR FTTH.

Was supported to be over 400 a week.

From what I'm looking at, SIRO is making a better job of it at the moment.

/M

They have made a commercial decision to overbuild in urban areas predominantly served by FTTC and Virgin's HFC. They seem to have been completely outfoxed by eir's decision to connect 300,000 rural premises, leaving their NBP in doubt. If they wish to continue in the process they will most likely have to use eir's network to reach intervention areas.

They have done nothing (perhaps bar existing) to further the spread of high speed broadband to rural areas.

Marlow · 23-09-2017 04:27PM

Allison Puny Appetite wrote: »

They have made a commercial decision to overbuild in urban areas predominantly served by FTTC and Virgin's HFC. They seem to have been completely outfoxed by eir's decision to connect 300,000 rural premises, leaving their NBP in doubt. If they wish to continue in the process they will most likely have to use eir's network to reach intervention areas.

They have done nothing (perhaps bar existing) to further the spread of high speed broadband to rural areas.

I think you confuse things here. SIRO is not a provider. They provide a wholesale platform to other providers, like for example Vodafone. They do not sell to the retail customer directly .. ever. Each and every provider on the SIRO platform has the same access and they differ based on their products and their backbone to the areas, that SIRO provides the last mile into.

So what SIRO is doing makes absolutely sense. They build a platform, where there otherwise is nothing else available, as Virgin won't allow wholesale and FTTC isn't comparable to FTTH.

These providers can then choose to either add OpenEIR FTTH to cover rural areas (and move customers to the SIRO platform at a later date), to wait for SIRO to cover these areas or to connect customers by other means.

But it does mean, that Eir actually gets the rug pulled away under their feet. First by Virgin, now by SIRO based operators.

Eirs rural FTTH build-out on the other hand is random at best and the only purpose that can be seen from where they deploy is to undermine the NBP. But not actually to archieve blanket coverage in these areas.

/M

Jpmarn · 23-09-2017 04:35PM

Had a couple of Eir sales staff called to my house yesterday. I am in the Inch St. Lawernce Limerick exchange area which serves Ballyneety and Caherconlish villages. Most of the Ftth lines are marked live on the fibrerollout.ie map. The lines on my road are due to go live on the 4th October and I already have an order gone in. Went to town shortly afterwards I saw the sales van at a house which is supposed to be off the Ftth grid. The house in question is almost 300m past the last splice box and all the existing phone cables are in underground ducts between the pole and the house. When I was coming home from town almost 4hours later and coming up to 6pm I saw the van outside a neighbouring house to the one I described but a bit closer to the splice box. I presume they visited several houses in the time period I was in town. I have a friend who lives in a live area in my exchange area hand they haven't seen any sales staff from Eir.

Jpmarn · 23-09-2017 04:41PM

If there any sales staff lying through their teeth is is a sign that they are under pressure. Probably trying to earn enough commissions in order to pay their own bills.

Marlow · 23-09-2017 04:43PM

Jpmarn wrote: »

If there any sales staff lying through their teeth is is a sign that they are under pressure. Probably trying to earn enough commissions in order to pay their own bills.

A lot of the time it's also, because they've either been snoozing during training or simply didn't get enough information.

Had one example recently, where the person in question was told, that it's Gbit/s up and down (symmetric).

The cases of where this happens is mostly common, when sales is outsourced and they're paid on commission.

Another case was, where the sales person was telling, that those who get connected early will see less contention later on.

/M

__..__ · 23-09-2017 04:43PM

ED E wrote: »

No. Only 60Ghz can give you wiGig and its been abandoned.

So no point getting 1000meg then?
Why don't they offer a package that goes uo to their top router wifi speed?

ED E · 23-09-2017 04:49PM

Westnet: Paul wrote: »

No, we don't. Some of us take a longer view and realise that once you've alienated a potential customer by lying to them on the first contact, it's almost impossible to regain that trust.

Maybe some of the bigger providers figure that it's a worthwhile tradeoff, but we don't. We accept that we'll lose some initial sales to unscrupulous tactics, but hopefully we'll be able to win back some disillusioned customers at a later date.

As I've often said: we have nothing to fear from competition, as long as it's on a level playing field.

I was really referencing the big three with that comment Paul, shoulda been clearer. If ISPs were coffee shops eir & co would be a service station machine while you guys are the local independent. Different levels of service entirely.

__..__ wrote: »

So no point getting 1000meg then?
Why don't they offer a package that goes uo to their top router wifi speed?

There is no one speed. Far too many factors. Like trying to have one speed limit for every road in the entire country.

The 1000Mb product is for enthusiasts who know how to use it, very much a case of if you have to ask get the 150Mb product.

Darkglasses · 23-09-2017 04:52PM

__..__ wrote: »

So no point getting 1000meg then?
Why don't they offer a package that goes uo to their top router wifi speed?

You can plug a cat 6 ethernet cable into the router to go up to the higher speeds.

Jpmarn · 23-09-2017 04:52PM

__..__ wrote: »

So no point getting 1000meg then?
Why don't they offer a package that goes uo to their top router wifi speed?

You should be able for the full Gig using wired Ethernet to the router. I have a netgear 650 router with gigabit LAN ports. It can only do wifi at 300mps tops at 5 ghz. Unless you have a very busy house I think 150 mps would be sufficient. It is wide enough to carry at least four 4K UHD video streams in the same time.

Marlow · 23-09-2017 04:55PM

__..__ wrote: »

So no point getting 1000meg then?
Why don't they offer a package that goes uo to their top router wifi speed?

Broadband isn't about wifi. Wifi as an add-on. You can get full 1 Gbit/s on the cable.

/M

tsue921i8wljb3 · 23-09-2017 04:55PM

Marlow wrote: »

I think you confuse things here. SIRO is not a provider. They provide a wholesale platform to other providers, like for example Vodafone. They do not sell to the retail customer directly .. ever. Each and every provider on the SIRO platform has the same access and they differ based on their products and their backbone to the areas, that SIRO provides the last mile into.

So what SIRO is doing makes absolutely sense. They build a platform, where there otherwise is nothing else available, as Virgin won't allow wholesale and FTTC isn't comparable to FTTH.

These providers can then choose to either add OpenEIR FTTH to cover rural areas (and move customers to the SIRO platform at a later date), to wait for SIRO to cover these areas or to connect customers by other means.

But it does mean, that Eir actually gets the rug pulled away under their feet. First by Virgin, now by SIRO based operators.

Eirs rural FTTH build-out on the other hand is random at best and the only purpose that can be seen from where they deploy is to undermine the NBP. But not actually to archieve blanket coverage in these areas.

/M

You call eir's build random. The same could be said of SIRO, plus the fact that they are building in already serviced areas. If eir win both NBP lots they will control a vast swathe of the country for years to come. What is to stop them then pushing back into urban areas usurping SIRO?

sean72 · 23-09-2017 05:21PM

Its not just the large companies that need to look at their customer service. Until I get FTTH(FTTC actually) I am with Ripplecom a wireless broadband provider. When I went to check I was out of contract to make a move to FTTH I noticed that they were offering 10mb/s for the same price that I am paying for 8mb/s for new customers. When I asked to be move to the higher speed as a good will measure (I've been a customer for 10 years and I'm paying €84/mth) ..... yes if I took out a new 18 month contract. What did they hope to gain from this other than to definitely lose a customer. Stupidity!

Marlow · 23-09-2017 05:33PM

Allison Puny Appetite wrote: »

You call eir's build random. The same could be said of SIRO, plus the fact that they are building in already serviced areas. If eir win both NBP lots they will control a vast swathe of the country for years to come. What is to stop them then pushing back into urban areas usurping SIRO?

For them to do that, they would need to work on their pricing first. SIROs pricing to other providers (opposed to OpenEir) is the pricing that OpenEIR had last or 2 years ago until they hiked their wholesale pricing.

That means, that providers on SIRO can actually price quite competitive opposed to providers based on OpenEIR or EIR themselves.

People cling to the NBP, when it's just the 3rd (or 4th) useless government attempt at archieving nothing and wasting tax money. Why would you think, that this attempt would be successful in any way, when any previous attempt first got budget cuts, and then failed, as it was half baked or worse in the first place ?

Any provider can build out anywhere (with or without the NBP) at any given time. And the funding that the NBP provides may not necessarily make it feasable. Eir's build-out has one aim: removing areas from the NBP, so that other providers who may win the NBP don't get funding for those areas.

/M

tsue921i8wljb3 · 23-09-2017 05:44PM

Marlow wrote: »

For them to do that, they would need to work on their pricing first. SIROs pricing to other providers (opposed to OpenEir) is the pricing that OpenEIR had last or 2 years ago until they hiked their wholesale pricing.

That means, that providers on SIRO can actually price quite competitive opposed to providers based on OpenEIR or EIR themselves.

People cling to the NBP, when it's just the 3rd (or 4th) useless government attempt at archieving nothing and wasting tax money. Why would you think, that this attempt would be successful in any way, when any previous attempt first got budget cuts, and then failed, as it was half baked or worse in the first place ?

Any provider can build out anywhere (with or without the NBP) at any given time. And the funding that the NBP provides may not necessarily make it feasable. Eir's build-out has one aim: removing areas from the NBP, so that other providers who may win the NBP don't get funding for those areas.

/M

I don't think we are going to agree on this. I have a lot more faith in the NBP than you seem to. I don't foresee a situation where there would be two or more separate wholesale fibre networks built across rural Ireland but who knows what the future holds.

Peppa Cig · 23-09-2017 05:51PM

Marlow wrote: »

__..__ wrote: »

What router do they give you with FTTH?
Is it capable of 1000mbps wireless?

ED E wrote: »

No. Only 60Ghz can give you wiGig and its been abandoned.

On top of that, even if the router was capable of WiGig, most wireless devices in phones, tablets and laptops would still not be capable to utilize that.

I have managed to squeeze a Samsung S5 to 400 mbit/s on a SIRO Gigabit connection though

(Nevermind the status of the phone being 4G. The test was done on a Samsung S5, using a Fritz!Box 7560 on a SIRO based 1000/200 connection.)

On the Ethernet side, that router will provide Gbit/s no problem.

/M

Does the Friztzbox do a good job?

I guess your with Digiweb?

Eir rural FTTH thread

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