High Noon with George Hook.

rightgirl · 12-09-2017 11:42PM

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Scandalous if GH is forced from his job and shocking that there are so many snowflakes in Newstalk that are 'offended'. Really is lowest common denominator stuff, and a bad situation for free and intelligent discussion in this country.

The only silver lining, and in a way I would like if it happened, would be that if here were dismissed, he could come out openly and discuss the whole mess. The country could have a proper debate on mob mentality and political correctness gone absolutely off the charts, to the detriment of free expression and debate. He could state that his 'apology' was a stock one that he was hounded into in an attempt to hang on to his job, but that in reality it was nonsense, he believes what he says, is entitled to say it, and other should be adult enough to be able to hear it without going off the deep end.

I despair for this country sometimes. Really.

apt username

hullaballoo · 12-09-2017 11:47PM

There's no right to free speech in this country.

This is not the USA.

The Rape of Lucretia · 12-09-2017 11:52PM

hullaballoo wrote: »

There's no right to free speech in this country.

This is not the USA.

Nor a right for those who simply dont like what someone says, to force punishment on them for saying it.

constitutionus · 12-09-2017 11:57PM

hullaballoo wrote: »

There's no right to free speech in this country.

This is not the USA.

actually

Freedom of speech is protected by Article 40.6.1 of the Irish constitution. However the article qualifies this right, providing that it may not be used to undermine "public order or morality or the authority of the State". Furthermore, the constitution explicitly requires that the publication of "blasphemous, seditious, or indecent matter" be a criminal offence, leading the government to pass a new blasphemy law on 8 July 2009.

hamburgham · 13-09-2017 12:01AM

"mark my words Ivan will be next the chief sniveller will make sure of it"

Especially if it's true that Ivan didn't want him on his new show. Think how resentful he must be especially when he considers himself to be a professional journalist and Ivan has just turned his hand to it.

Btw , Ivan's delivery has improved beyond recognition.

Newstalk would gain a lot of respect if they dared to come out in support of George distancing themselves from his opinions whatever they might be but standing by his right to voice them and making some comment about the danger of going down a road where there are only prescribed agreed opinions.

hullaballoo · 13-09-2017 12:01AM

constitutionus wrote: »

actually

Take it from me that my knowledge of constitutional law is better than that of Wikipedia

There is no right to freedom of speech in Ireland.

rightgirl · 13-09-2017 12:02AM

hullaballoo wrote: »

Take it from me that my knowledge of constitutional law is better than that of Wikipedia

There is no right to freedom of speech in Ireland.

as chris machiavelli has proved

The Rape of Lucretia · 13-09-2017 12:06AM

hamburgham wrote: »

Newstalk would gain a lot of respect if they dared to come out in support of George distancing themselves from his opinions whatever they might be

'Distancing' themselves from his opinion would be a terrible move, making themselves part of the problem as much as their objecting staff. They simply have no business commenting on GH's comment in the first place. The station cannot have a position. They are simply the medium. Again, it would be just pandering to the snowflakes and some equally offence prone advertisers and their fears of them, if they were to come out with more pat downplaying of his opinions just to bow to the vocal objectors.

RustyNut · 13-09-2017 12:20AM

Obvious Otter wrote: »

We don't have standards. We're at the mercy of snowflake faux outrage and the pc mob who want to sterilise debate on all issues.

If anything it shows the insecurity of these people. Why should society pander to their every need? George Hook didn't blame the victim.

hullaballoo wrote: »

Take it from me that my knowledge of constitutional law is better than that of Wikipedia

There is no right to freedom of speech in Ireland.

Indeed, If I was to say that allah or buddha or jesus was only a bollox with the intention of causing offence that would be a crime would it not?

ballsymchugh · 13-09-2017 01:26AM

where did Chris O'Donoghue make his feelings known initially? i can only find the tweet thanking people for their support.

as for potential replacements, although i'm not sure when/if that may happen, as newstalk have a poor record when it comes to listening to junior staff, but jonathan healy has just started his own communications company so very doubtful to be him. a load of senior enough journalists have left in the past few weeks, like shona murray so the crew that are left can't be too senior (i think!)
i wonder will anyone come out in support of him? has anyone in the staff accepted his apology and knows him enough to move on? will be interesting to know what ciara kelly and maggie doyle have to say about this letter going around.

edit: found the tweet...
https://twitter.com/chrisrdonoghue/status/906256531670302722

PeterTheNinth · 13-09-2017 07:37AM

I was expecting to drive in this morning, switch on the radio, and find that Hook was gone. If that many people are against him, albeit for their own populist reasons rather than any moral reasons, then it's hard to see how he will stay.

I guess the irony would be if they got rid of Hook (one of their popular presenters), and they fill it with another one of their squares from the production line, then the station will probably go down the pan altogether.

PeterTheNinth · 13-09-2017 07:42AM

If Hook does get fired, then Ciara Kelly needs to take a long hard look at herself. Hook was a big part of getting her on the radio, which lead to all the subsequent shows that she got. I wouldn't expect her to support what he said, but she could have said "Look he was completely wrong, but he is a decent guy". She probably played out in her head how that might look to the baying liberal mob if she had said something in mitigation, and how it would play out with all of the other squares that run Newstalk. If George has only friends like her, then who needs enemies?

To me is seems that she put her career ahead of doing the right thing and standing up for a man that has been a good friend to her, and a great help to her career. Maybe she figures she'll get the job if George goes?

PeterTheNinth · 13-09-2017 07:47AM

Fair play to Pat Kenny for not joining the mob. This certainly wont make him popular, but it's the right thing to do.

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/radio/pat-kenny-defends-decent-man-george-hook-over-controversial-rape-comments-36127451.html

"The comments are not reflective of him. He is a decent man with children and was musing over a topic.

"He has entertained people for 13 years and it would be sad that people would take his mis-speaking on the radio as the real representation of George the man," he added.
Mr Kenny also stressed that he was "not in any way trying to espouse the point of view that [Hook] articulated".

^ That is exactly the sort of statement that I was expecting from his supposed friend Ciara Kelly. Instead of sticking her scalpal in his back.

jooksavage · 13-09-2017 07:54AM

PeterTheNinth wrote: »

Fair play to Pat Kenny for not joining the mob. This certainly wont make him popular, but it's the right thing to do.

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/radio/pat-kenny-defends-decent-man-george-hook-over-controversial-rape-comments-36127451.html

^ That is exactly the sort of statement that I was expecting from his supposed friend Ciara Kelly. Instead of sticking her scalpal in his back.

She's a doctor for God's sake. My brother-in-law is too and said that one of the hardest parts of his job is dealing with victims of physical and sexual violence. There's not a doctor in the country would condone what Hook said but she should park her professional ethics so Hook can squeeze another year out of his broadcasting career?

RebelButtMunch · 13-09-2017 07:59AM

RustyNut wrote: »

Indeed, If I was to say that allah or buddha or jesus was only a bollox with the intention of causing offence that would be a crime would it not?

Only the Jesus bit would be a crime

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law_in_the_Republic_of_Ireland

PeterTheNinth · 13-09-2017 08:02AM

jooksavage wrote: »

There's not a doctor in the country would condone what Hook said but she should park her professional ethics so Hook can squeeze another year out of his broadcasting career?

I said that she should distance herself from the remark, but not from the person who has been a good friend to her. And Ciara Kelly left her professional ethics at the door when she took part in a TV show that paraded overweight people in Lycra for the viewing entertainment of the audience.

DeadHand · 13-09-2017 08:03AM

PeterTheNinth wrote: »

Fair play to Pat Kenny for not joining the mob. This certainly wont make him popular, but it's the right thing to do.

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/radio/pat-kenny-defends-decent-man-george-hook-over-controversial-rape-comments-36127451.html[/url

Some common sense finally breaks through the deafening clamour of hysteria and manic virtue signalling.

Pat's gone way up in my estimation.

PeterTheNinth · 13-09-2017 08:05AM

Interesting to see how this plays out in NT though. Pat Kenny really has gone against the grain with this. Would have been far easier for him to say nothing at all. Maybe he has that Edmund Burke quote up above his bed.

But there's gona be two distinct camps at the station now, should make the staff room interesting at least.

bloodless_coup · 13-09-2017 08:06AM

"TRIGGER WARNING"...

Beechwoodspark · 13-09-2017 08:06AM

Fair play to Pat.

DeanAustin · 13-09-2017 08:12AM

PeterTheNinth wrote: »

Interesting to see how this plays out in NT though. Pat Kenny really has gone against the grain with this. Would have been far easier for him to say nothing at all. Maybe he has that Edmund Burke quote up above his bed.

But there's gona be two distinct camps at the station now, should make the staff room interesting at least.

Surely people are allowed to have differing opinions on things and it shouldn't cause all out war?

I admire Kenny for his stance but he's well enough established to speak like this. Some others, at the start of their careers, could be scared to do likewise and you can see why with the hysterics from certain quarters.

jooksavage · 13-09-2017 08:15AM

PeterTheNinth wrote: »

I said that she should distance herself from the remark, but not from the person who has been a good friend to her. And Ciara Kelly left her professional ethics at the door when she took part in a TV show that paraded overweight people in Lycra for the viewing entertainment of the audience.

Come on, there's a big difference between sitting on a panel of a douchey TV show (which at it's cringey heart at least thinks it's doing a public service - it's certainly doing no harm) and condoning/ignoring what Hook HIMSELF has conceded were unacceptable remarks.

DeanAustin · 13-09-2017 08:17AM

PeterTheNinth wrote: »

Fair play to Pat Kenny for not joining the mob. This certainly wont make him popular, but it's the right thing to do.

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/radio/pat-kenny-defends-decent-man-george-hook-over-controversial-rape-comments-36127451.html

^ That is exactly the sort of statement that I was expecting from his supposed friend Ciara Kelly. Instead of sticking her scalpal in his back.

That's unfair. In the profession Kelly works in and taking her consistent position on feminism into account, the way she's acted is very understandable. If she didn't, people would say she's compromising her principles for the sake of a personal relationship.

However, I'd have a problem if she signed that letter to remove Hook because that then means she's completely unable to have a rational discussion on some of the points Hook made.

DeadHand · 13-09-2017 08:25AM

jooksavage wrote: »

She's a doctor for God's sake. My brother-in-law is too and said that one of the hardest parts of his job is dealing with victims of physical and sexual violence. There's not a doctor in the country would condone what Hook said but she should park her professional ethics so Hook can squeeze another year out of his broadcasting career?

Hook did not condone rape. While he did not blame the rape victim deliberately, he expressed himself in a clumsy fashion that made it appear that he did. He has acknowledged this and apologised for it.

Dr. Kelly should, of course, reject and distance herself from the stupid comments just as Hook has done. But her friend to whom she owes her media career is being mauled unfairly and she is nowhere to be seen.

She doesn't need to approve of the offending comments, just confirm that Hook is a good person and genuinely contrite as Pat had the courage and decency to do. She may well have done so privately- I'd hope so. I'd also hope she was too good a person to join the twenty cowards who betrayed him for their own ends.

Since supporting her friend in his hour of need does not equal supporting rape or the offending comments he made, professional ethics does not come into it.

S. Goodspeed · 13-09-2017 08:26AM

Controversial shock jock says something controversial... I guess timing is everything, as is knowing which groups or subjects are simply off limits.

There is some truth to what he said but I think it did cross over a line into victim blaming territory, especially when talking about a specific case. The fact is though by going home with a man you don't know you are massively increasing you chances of being attacked, that obviously doesn't make it right and men like that should be locked up for a long time but this specific form of attack is largely avoidable.

DeadHand · 13-09-2017 08:30AM

jooksavage wrote: »

it's certainly doing no harm) and condoning/ignoring what Hook HIMSELF has conceded were unacceptable remarks.

She could support Hook the man without condoning/ignoring his comments just as Pat Kenny did.

Kerry_2008 · 13-09-2017 08:35AM

Everyone excepts what hook said was wrong. He was trying to express a sentiment but went about it clumsily. But, the outrage on news talk led by the pip squeak Chris Donohue is nauseating. Chris and his former sidekick on drive had their show tank because they were a pair of PC clean shirts.

I get people as outraged. But I don't think its a sackable offence. If people showed as much 'outrage' when a politician does something wrong we would be better served.

suicide_circus · 13-09-2017 08:48AM

Once George is removed from irish radio, only one homogeneous school of thought will prevail. No descent. No deviation from the approved doctrine. One bland sycophantic voice. No alternatives postulated. Keep the dead down.

The best books... are those that tell you what you know already.

jooksavage · 13-09-2017 08:50AM

DeadHand wrote: »

I'd also hope she was too good a person to join the twenty cowards who betrayed him for their own ends.

"Cowards"? "For their own ends"? You mean like professional integrity and trivialities like that? I've been in the position of putting my name to a letter requesting the removal of a colleague - it wasn't easy and I'd imagine it must be all the harder when the subject of the letter is a household name. Our letter was given the deaf ear and all the signatories ended up on the s***-list; I was heartened that Newstalk (a company owned by supposed Grand Satan DOB) appear to be taking on board the conerns of their staff.

Comments like that though won't help Hook. This kind of stuff is all over Twitter and his most unapologetic supporters are getting cited in the media making him look like a fringe lunatic - thats not going to tilt an ongoing investigation back in his favour.

mang0 · 13-09-2017 08:51AM

You know, it's almost as if the reaction of Newstalk's staff in relation to Hook is based on far more than just these latest comments.