Dairy chit chat II

George Sunsnow · 27-08-2017 10:39AM

Just as a data point
On my road the dairy farmers are,give or take 24,37,60,50,60,34,60,35,27,30 and early 60's
The two in their 20's ,one is a new entrant,the other is in partnership with his mother

The age profile is actually not that bad
Everyone has a willing successor

whelan2 · 27-08-2017 10:48AM

George Sunsnow wrote: »

Just as a data point
On my road the dairy farmers are,give or take 24,37,60,50,60,34,60,35,27,30 and early 60's
The two in their 20's ,one is a new entrant,the other is in partnership with his mother

The age profile is actually not that bad
Everyone has a willing successor

Not many dairy farmers around me. In 3mile radius theres 5of us. 2lads would be over fifty then myself and 2lads around the same age as me. There's also the monks in collon who have a dairy herd. The only monk working on the farm is well into his eighties now. At least 8 dairy farmers have stopped milking in the last ten years.

mf240 · 27-08-2017 10:51AM

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

We're already at this stage here. Age profile of dairy farmers is around 60, with the average size of herd circa 70 - 80 cows and nobody willing to take on the drudgery. Coupled with pretty stiff environmental regs and a shortage of labour...
A report from a branch of dept. of Ag. that investigates the sustainability and future of dairy farming recently published, indicates that herd size post quota will now have to be in excess of 200 cows. That's probably the equivalent of about 400 Irish xbreds...which was also predicted by Teagasc a few years back.
I'd offload the dairy here but I can't find one single punter, even though it has a strong ebidta and is well supported with land etc. I've a neighbor who's an excellent cow man interested in forming a partnership but I'd have to expand the facilities and herd yet again. I lodged over €40k into an escrow a/c so as to apply for planning permission (yes!!) to expand. Dairy herds are treated the same as pigs or poultry as environmental risks.
The processors are well aware of this. They've a scheme to encourage young farmers to produce by offering them a guaranteed 35cpl for their first five years of production, and the only takers are the young farmers that were already continuing their fathers herd. Not one new entrant.

I honestly don't blame the younger generation for abandoning the drudgery of dairying. It'd kill me to see a son/daughter going at it for their working life when there's a squillion easier ways of earning a crust.

No amount of hardship will turn off a lad that really likes cows. And let's face it it's the only thing that will make a lad milk cows. It's certainly not going to be the easy money .

George Sunsnow · 27-08-2017 10:52AM

4 of the above supply strathroy,including the new entrant the rest Glanbia
The strathroy truck passes all of their gates going into the 4
There's a larger strathroy truck down the road about 2 miles parked up into which it pumps

whelan2 · 27-08-2017 10:54AM

mf240 wrote: »

No amount of hardship will turn off a lad that really likes cows. And let's face it it's the only thing that will make a lad milk cows. It's certainly not going to be the easy money .

That's exactly what my lad says. I often say are you sure you want to farm, he always replies that he loves farming. Long may it last

George Sunsnow · 27-08-2017 10:57AM

whelan2 wrote: »

Not many dairy farmers around me. In 3mile radius theres 5of us. 2lads would be over fifty then myself and 2lads around the same age as me. There's also the monks in collon who have a dairy herd. The only monk working on the farm is well into his eighties now. At least 8 dairy farmers have stopped milking in the last ten years.

Here if I took a 6 mile radius,there's at least 20 or more and circa 4 to 4500 cows and I'm sure I've missed some :eek:

cute geoge · 27-08-2017 11:10AM

George Sunsnow wrote: »

Here if I took a 6 mile radius,there's at least 20 or more and circa 4 to 4500 cows and I'm sure I've missed some :eek:

I dont know where the most intensive dairy area in the country but if you went 6 miles from here in every direction you would at least cross 100 dairy farmers so at least 7 to 8000 cows

Gawddawggonnit · 27-08-2017 11:29AM

cute geoge wrote: »

I think you have hit the nail on the head with the above post especially the statement that you would not want to see any of your children commit to a life of drudgery .
Expanding herd size from 80 cows is really debatable .On the one hand you decrease the drudgery with having to get extra paid labour but probably also decrease the profitability by the time labour and infrastructure costs are taking into account

Extra labour doesn't necessarily mean less work for the farmer...

Gawddawggonnit · 27-08-2017 11:33AM

mf240 wrote: »

No amount of hardship will turn off a lad that really likes cows. And let's face it it's the only thing that will make a lad milk cows. It's certainly not going to be the easy money .

Hmmm...parents are also a very influential factor.

If little Mary/Michael showed a big interest in becoming a rock star, would the Mammies/Daddies here encourage them?

mf240 · 27-08-2017 11:36AM

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Hmmm...parents are also a very influential factor.

If little Mary/Michael showed a big interest in becoming a rock star, would the Mammies/Daddies here encourage them?

You can be a rock star when you have those cows milked ya little bollcks:D:D

George Sunsnow · 27-08-2017 11:50AM

cute geoge wrote: »

I dont know where the most intensive dairy area in the country but if you went 6 miles from here in every direction you would at least cross 100 dairy farmers so at least 7 to 8000 cows

Yeah I'd guess you'd get close to that here,I'm only counting the ones I can think of that I know personally,there's obviously many many more
1000's of deer too unfortunately
There's a lot of intensity left in milk and a lot of willing successors

George Sunsnow · 27-08-2017 11:57AM

If you can average over a 10 yr period a €50 k profit,that's a 1000 a week including say 2 to 3 days on and off part time help as you need it,(averaging out good and bad years) from 80 cows,why would you want to double that? Or treble

Why all the extra hardship
Fair enough if you were always at 2 or 300 cows but why grow?
The only reason I can think of is if your siblings want to farm the extra cows on extra units

That's my opinion

Gawddawggonnit · 27-08-2017 12:08PM

George Sunsnow wrote: »

If you can average over a 10 yr period a €50 k profit,that's a 1000 a week including say 2 to 3 days on and off part time help as you need it,(averaging out good and bad years) from 80 cows,why would you want to double that? Or treble

Why all the extra hardship
Fair enough if you were always at 2 or 300 cows but why grow?
The only reason I can think of is if your siblings want to farm the extra cows on extra units

That's my opinion

The farms that are "substantially bigger" than the average Irish herd size will be the farms to profit from the removal of quotas...not me saying that, Teagasc said that.
Keepgrowing mentioned about farmers making a living by depreciating their business...already happening in smaller tillage farms (<500 acres?) and likewise beef?

George Sunsnow · 27-08-2017 12:19PM

I think though you'll get varied opinions on the worth of teagasc opinions
There was a long thread on foreclosures here including a high profile one in Cork happening AFTER the end of quota's

The part time boy · 27-08-2017 12:38PM

George Sunsnow wrote: »

Just as a data point
On my road the dairy farmers are,give or take 24,37,60,50,60,34,60,35,27,30 and early 60's
The two in their 20's ,one is a new entrant,the other is in partnership with his mother

The age profile is actually not that bad
Everyone has a willing successor

Same here around here. There 3 dairy farmers with all of them in 30's . Two other part time beef famers 30 and 20. One other beef lad in his 60 but has a son intresed only if he let him get involved !

greenfield21 · 27-08-2017 12:42PM

All young dairy lads should have Head down arse up. Don't listen to the naysayers. Let's flood the market with chape milk powder.

Sam Kade · 27-08-2017 12:42PM

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Hmmm...parents are also a very influential factor.

If little Mary/Michael showed a big interest in becoming a rock star, would the Mammies/Daddies here encourage them?

Not many rock stars nowadays what they should do is write crap whiny songs and sing them like that back street busker Sheeran.

whelan2 · 27-08-2017 02:28PM

Had a cow down in paddock there with milkfever. My own fault too much grass on calving paddock. Anyway can the bottle go in to the vein too quick? Heated 2bottles. First one went in way too quick. Only gave half the second one in the vein. Rest under the skin. She's up now.

Buford T. Justice XIX · 27-08-2017 02:38PM

I bought a few acres of 2nd cut silage after the first cut being well back and the first load after being delivered just now. I won't be able to get my own till later in the week after the corn is cut. I may have to rethink letting a bit of bulk into the crop in future and going for an earlier second cut and after grass coming in early too.

And taking tires off the pit is soooooo much handier with a teleporter. I wonder if I'm still young enough for Santa:P

simx · 27-08-2017 08:31PM

whelan2 wrote: »

But on the other side alot of farmers wont be selling their best heifers either....

Oh no, I know that, only way is breed from what ya know yourself

charolais0153 · 27-08-2017 09:20PM

simx wrote: »

Oh no, I know that, only way is breed from what ya know yourself

Theres 2 sides to the coin . So.e pwople thinl that there stock is the best and theres no stock that they vould buy thatd be as good as them

kevthegaff · 27-08-2017 09:22PM

What's yer electricity bills? Mine is around 600 a month, 250 house, 350 farm, is that about right?

whelan2 · 27-08-2017 09:25PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

What's yer electricity bills? Mine is around 600 a month, 250 house, 350 farm, is that about right?

Just after changing yesterday. Bord gas energy. Saving €1000 / year over my sse airtricity plan. Go to bonkers.ie. Although they said energia ws the best they have a cap on units used. Bord gais give a 24% discount on their fees. You are paying way too much. Have you a night meter. Around €35O/month here house and farm included

kevthegaff · 27-08-2017 09:57PM

whelan2 wrote:

Just after changing yesterday. Bord gas energy. Saving â‚¬1000 / year over my sse airtricity plan. Go to bonkers.ie. Although they said energia ws the best they have a cap on units used. Bord gais give a 24% discount on their fees. You are paying way too much. Have you a night meter. Around â‚¬35O/month here house and farm included

No night meter with Bord Gais

whelan2 · 27-08-2017 09:59PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

No night meter with Bord Gais

Do you have an annual contract?

Timmaay · 27-08-2017 10:20PM

whelan2 wrote: »

Just after changing yesterday. Bord gas energy. Saving €1000 / year over my sse airtricity plan. Go to bonkers.ie. Although they said energia ws the best they have a cap on units used. Bord gais give a 24% discount on their fees. You are paying way too much. Have you a night meter. Around €35O/month here house and farm included

Reading your post inspired me to check bonkers also, it's bang on a year since I last moved. It's suggesting energia for me, with bordgas next, I don't see anything about the cap on units? 500e saving for the year, not bad for barely 5mins work! We use 15000kwh a yr here (60:40 split between day and night units), our combined house/farm bill has been 350e last few months, but averages out at 200e across the year. Our well supply which provides all the water here not included in the above, as it supplies a neighbour also so separate meter/bill.

Floki · 27-08-2017 11:08PM

This year has been an epiphany for me.

Geology should be taught in ag courses. I got 2 tons of calcium lime from a particular quarry spread per acre on all the fields last year bar one field.
This field was showing the same pH as other fields now (according to my handheld meter) but everytime the cows grazed this only field that got none of this lime the milk yield would drop even though this field grew more grass than the fields that got lime and it was in perfect order for grazing.
This last time the cows grazed this field the milk yield dropped 300 litres.
Now that they're off it the yield has gone back up 200 litres but it's killing yield everytime it's grazed.
This was reseeded 3 years ago with abergain, aberchoice and tyrella. Now it could be the tyrella doing this but this field is getting 2 tons of calcium lime from the same quarry in a weeks time. So to hell with pH.

I haven't dosed the calves yet this year either as not a cough or anything from them and they're grazing ground that got the 2 tons too.

Going to get basalt dust spread on ploughed ground for reseeding after I pick the stones and harrow it a bit and then harrow in.

Waffletraktor · 27-08-2017 11:32PM

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

I honestly don't blame the younger generation for abandoning the drudgery of dairying. It'd kill me to see a son/daughter going at it for their working life when there's a squillion easier ways of earning a crust.

By the time your put in a home with a bad back from decades of bouncing on a tractor seat, she'll be able to log in and check how her robots are doing planting crops and weeding. Have a drone doing passes to monitor for crop density/disease/n requirements and weeds.
The 17 plate combine will already drive better than 2/3rds of operators, it just needs to know what's going into it before it enters the feeder house to be better. Overlay a green area index/crop density scan into it's mapping and some realtime weather monitoring it'll be better than 90% just needing a chunk of meat to avoid the fallen branch or change a knife section.

Waffletraktor · 27-08-2017 11:35PM

Floki wrote: »

Going to get basalt dust spread on ploughed ground for reseeding after I pick the stones and harrow it a bit and then harrow in.

If you end up with green milk we want pics(or was it the granite dust that's radioactive

)

Floki · 27-08-2017 11:51PM

Waffletraktor wrote: »

If you end up with green milk we want pics(or was it the granite dust that's radioactive)

Less of that now.:)

Ah no I'll let yous know if there's any difference or not in grass growth.
But just to say I was the first person ever to ask for the dust to be used on land according to the quarry owner. Its main/only use is as topping on lanes or yards.
I have a sample though I want to get tested. Bagnelstown can't test it and another place in Dublin won't. I think limerick might though.

There's people drinking that "Volvic" bottled water so it should be fine.

Dairy chit chat II

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