Lock, Stock and Chitchat a Seacht

Pidae.m · 01-06-2017 10:24PM

My brother is a teacher & it's a disgrace how little he is paid. The amount of free grinds , supervising, training teams after school & some weekends.organising trips to the Gaeltacht etc etc. But as he always says.... it's the path I chose.

kollegeknight wrote: »

Hardly jammy, I studied and worked hard to get to where I am. Nothing stops anyone from following the same career path.
I'm a young public sector, I pay for a lot of those assets myself. And you wouldn't work with some of the young lads I teach in situations I've been in. I don't think you've ever had to deal with a large cohort of exam students sitting exams while their classmate was being buried after dying by suicide a few days earlier.

Although I am very aware of the long holidays and greatful of them also, but after the school year I put down, they couldn't arrive at a better time.

Base price · 01-06-2017 10:27PM

I said wrote: »

What's the junior cert I did the group cert,inter cert and leaving cert.

Woops. I meant Inter Cert which was the junior certification in my days however I've moved with the times :-))

Username John · 01-06-2017 10:27PM

Base price wrote: »

During my schooling I had excellent, understanding, sympathetic teachers who were able to deal with and inspire my rebellious younger self. My favourite was my science teacher - initially junior cert & laterally biology & chemistry for the leaving cert. She used to sit with me in the school library at lunchtime on Wednesdays (5&6 yr) to assuage my ever growing demand for knowledge. Only for her and my sister's ( who held a science degree) input I would not have gained A honours in the leaving cert.
Unfortunately my Dad died from cancer (brain tumour) within months after my leaving cert results and his death changed the financial dynamics without our home.
I have always encouraged my sons when they were in school along with working with of their teachers. Unfortunately not all teachers are singing from the same hymn sheets

ah, the junior cert

It had just replaced the inter when I was in school...

A part of me thinks I cared more about the junior cert, cos I was too young to know otherwise

By the time the leaving came around, things had half gone to ****

Limestone Cowboy · 01-06-2017 10:30PM

Pidae.m wrote: »

My brother is a teacher & it's a disgrace how little he is paid. The amount of free grinds , supervising, training teams after school & some weekends.organising trips to the Gaeltacht etc etc. But as he always says.... it's the path I chose.

Girlfriends sister and her fella are both primary teachers. Plenty on here giving out about farming but I'd rather it any day to what they are doing. Their wage is harmless aswell.

pedigree 6 · 01-06-2017 10:37PM

pedigree 6 wrote: »

???

I apologize I said.
I take a bit of josting myself and am used to it so I might be a bit too free in josting others.
I hope you didn't think I was being too hard at your expense.

Sorry.

charolais0153 · 01-06-2017 10:38PM

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

Girlfriends sister and her fella are both primary teachers. Plenty on here giving out about farming but I'd rather it any day to what they are doing. Their wage is harmless aswell.

Their getting 100% of the wage for 75% of the year, if they become exam attendants and correct exams then there getting even more money. Compare teaching to nursing and youlll s3e its a while different ball game
Didn't see primary, I was referring to secondary

Base price · 01-06-2017 11:28PM

I saw a swift in the air this evening over my Mams place.

_Brian · 02-06-2017 06:28AM

charolais0153 wrote: »

Their getting 100% of the wage for 75% of the year, if they become exam attendants and correct exams then there getting even more money. Compare teaching to nursing and youlll s3e its a while different ball game
Didn't see primary, I was referring to secondary

I think secondary teaching is indeed quite a decent number, and good luck to them. We all spent time at school and saw the set up, and for our own reasons decided not to go into teaching. Particularly established teachers have a decent wage and with three months holidays makes it nice.
I think you find allot of jealousy regarding their conditions, but we all made our choices. I just couldn't face constant classes of snotty fluckers like I was. Talking to my daughter who is on secondary the teachers still put up with allot of crap and disruptive behaviour.

kollegeknight · 02-06-2017 07:38AM

charolais0153 wrote: »

Their getting 100% of the wage for 75% of the year, if they become exam attendants and correct exams then there getting even more money. Compare teaching to nursing and youlll s3e its a while different ball game
Didn't see primary, I was referring to secondary

Depends where you are working. I've 4 members of a certain community who are constantly battling with a few bold brats- it's like a prison warden job some days.

Those lads from that certain community have so many external people involved to get them through the JC, that you find yourself working during holidays and weekends to get them over the line.

In that same group, 60% of the students have a letter beside their name for either learning or behavioural issues.

Every school in the country has to deal with near suicides, large scale bullying and teenage hormones.
Look up the blue whale game. That's what we were dealing with a fortnight ago, trying to explain to young lads that nobody could empty every bank account associated with their friends and families and delete their identity if they didn't do away with themselves.

I said · 02-06-2017 07:58AM

pedigree 6 wrote: »

I apologize I said.
I take a bit of josting myself and am used to it so I might be a bit too free in josting others.
I hope you didn't think I was being too hard at your expense.

Sorry.

Thank you for that.
I got the same education as everyone else the three Rs reading,riting and rithmetic.

Username John · 02-06-2017 08:38AM

charolais0153 wrote: »

Their getting 100% of the wage for 75% of the year, if they become exam attendants and correct exams then there getting even more money. Compare teaching to nursing and youlll s3e its a while different ball game
Didn't see primary, I was referring to secondary

Most people in the private sector are getting 100% of the wage for ~88% of the year - about 250 weekdays and 220 actual working days...
(if you take out bank holidays, and 20 days hols a year)

Primary schools must be open 183 days / year - ~70% of the year
Secondary schools open 167 days / year ~75% of the year
See here

So you could argue, yeah - its a great job, for the holidays alone...

It wouldn't be for me, would hate to do it...

But the big question is, if you think its such a good job, why aren't you a teacher?

whelan2 · 02-06-2017 08:42AM

kollegeknight wrote: »

Depends where you are working. I've 4 members of a certain community who are constantly battling with a few bold brats- it's like a prison warden job some days.

Those lads from that certain community have so many external people involved to get them through the JC, that you find yourself working during holidays and weekends to get them over the line.

In that same group, 60% of the students have a letter beside their name for either learning or behavioural issues.

Every school in the country has to deal with near suicides, large scale bullying and teenage hormones.
Look up the blue whale game. That's what we were dealing with a fortnight ago, trying to explain to young lads that nobody could empty every bank account associated with their friends and families and delete their identity if they didn't do away with themselves.

The whole internet thing is crazy. So different to when were in school. It's frightening really. Alot of kids dont realise things they post now will still be online in years to come. Something written down can be read and reread and misinterpreted many ways. Even the bullying in primary school is on a different level now. Had a scary incident last week with youngest lad were the bully put an x on my young lads wrist to say he wouldn't be bullying him for a week or so. I was raging. Where did the bully get this idea at 9 years of age. School had never heard of it before. My lad felt relieved as he was to be free of the bully for a week!

lakill Farm · 02-06-2017 09:02AM

Herself is primary teacher in a country school.

the teaching is the easy bit as far as I can make it out.

its the associated stuff that makes the job challenging. I know every career has its challenges , but when your dealing with young kids its life changing

Username John wrote: »

Most people in the private sector are getting 100% of the wage for ~88% of the year - about 250 weekdays and 220 actual working days...
(if you take out bank holidays, and 20 days hols a year)

Primary schools must be open 183 days / year - ~70% of the year
Secondary schools open 167 days / year ~75% of the year
See here

So you could argue, yeah - its a great job, for the holidays alone...

It wouldn't be for me, would hate to do it...

But the big question is, if you think its such a good job, why aren't you a teacher?

_Brian · 02-06-2017 09:14AM

lakill Farm wrote: »

Herself is primary teacher in a country school.

the teaching is the easy bit as far as I can make it out.

its the associated stuff that makes the job challenging. I know every career has its challenges , but when your dealing with young kids its life changing

This is the crux of the issue..

People looking in at a job and thinking "thats a handy number" and they have good conditions so somehow it becomes a "disgrace" what teachers get paid and all the holidays they get.. Its the old Irish begrudgery really, yea we might wrap it up in calls for fairness and value for money, but thats whats really behind it..
I've two kids in school, one primary and one secondary and I think the standard of education they are getting is top class. Yea there are a few teachers that are a bit below the game but they are a small minority and the general standard of teaching and interest in student outcomes is very good.

There's allot of challenging antisocial behavior going on in many schools that teachers deal with quietly behind the scenes, they work very hard on the social development of children and I honestly think that teachers in particular who teach larger towns are saints, I know plenty of teachers and the stories you hear are dreadful.

rangler1 · 02-06-2017 09:16AM

lakill Farm wrote: »

Herself is primary teacher in a country school.

the teaching is the easy bit as far as I can make it out.

its the associated stuff that makes the job challenging. I know every career has its challenges , but when your dealing with young kids its life changing

Life ain't too bad if you're only working 170 days/year and some are even job sharing to hold their position.....can't imagine that working properly for students though.
Nurses will tell you about the 12 hr shift but, funnily enough, neglect to say it's only three days a week.
If there's a dispute on pay and productivity, the solution is decided by another branch of the PS and they knowing that any increase in pay or reduction in productivity decided will eventually benefit them

Username John · 02-06-2017 09:27AM

rangler1 wrote: »

Life ain't too bad if you're only working 170 days/year and some are even job sharing to hold their position.....can't imagine that working properly for students though.
Nurses will tell you about the 12 hr shift but, funnily enough, neglect to say it's only three days a week.
If there's a dispute on pay and productivity, the solution is decided by another branch of the PS and they knowing that any increase in pay or reduction in productivity decided will eventually benefit them

To be fair, they work more than the 170- days, but even still, the holidays are good, there is no denying it...
However, with job sharing, you share the job but you share the pay...

As for a nurse working 3 x 12 hour shifts - that's 36 hours, that's only 4 hours of a normal 9-5, Mon - Fri job.

I think just because farming is a 7-days a-week job, doesn't mean everyone should work 7 days a week.

Most people work 5 days a week, and most people get a reasonable wage. I wonder is it farmers who are out of step, not just with the public service, but with the private sector as well?
I don't know what the solution is, but giving out about people who went out and got qualifications and got better jobs wont do much for you...

rangler1 · 02-06-2017 09:47AM

Username John wrote: »

To be fair, they work more than the 170- days, but even still, the holidays are good, there is no denying it...
However, with job sharing, you share the job but you share the pay...

As for a nurse working 3 x 12 hour shifts - that's 36 hours, that's only 4 hours of a normal 9-5, Mon - Fri job.

I think just because farming is a 7-days a-week job, doesn't mean everyone should work 7 days a week.

Most people work 5 days a week, and most people get a reasonable wage. I wonder is it farmers who are out of step, not just with the public service, but with the private sector as well?
I don't know what the solution is, but giving out about people who went out and got qualifications and got better jobs wont do much for you...

It's the value for money is the problem, of course they're entitled to fair pay,
but I'm paying twice for health, twice for water,.....
Has it escaped your notice that for the last five years that while the PS is apologising for one scandal, they're making another.
Irish tax payers are entitled to better
Department of ag is the best of the PS and that's saying somethin

lakill Farm · 02-06-2017 09:49AM

rangler1 wrote: »

Life ain't too bad if you're only working 170 days/year and some are even job sharing to hold their position.....can't imagine that working properly for students though.
Nurses will tell you about the 12 hr shift but, funnily enough, neglect to say it's only three days a week.
If there's a dispute on pay and productivity, the solution is decided by another branch of the PS and they knowing that any increase in pay or reduction in productivity decided will eventually benefit them

don't throw to many stones. A lot of non farmers and farmers fairly bitch about all the government grants and subs that other farmers get.

Grueller · 02-06-2017 09:53AM

rangler1 wrote: »

Life ain't too bad if you're only working 170 days/year and some are even job sharing to hold their position.....can't imagine that working properly for students though.
Nurses will tell you about the 12 hr shift but, funnily enough, neglect to say it's only three days a week.
If there's a dispute on pay and productivity, the solution is decided by another branch of the PS and they knowing that any increase in pay or reduction in productivity decided will eventually benefit them

Two job sharers in our local primary. They do not affect the students at all by this as they are in resource though so kids never have a different teacher.
In secondary a job sharer teaches less class groups but do not share any class groupings, so again students not affected.

lakill Farm · 02-06-2017 09:59AM

rangler1 wrote: »

It's the value for money is the problem, of course they're entitled to fair pay,
but I'm paying twice for health, twice for water,.....
Has it escaped your notice that for the last five years that while the PS is apologising for one scandal, they're making another.
Irish tax payers are entitled to better
Department of ag is the best of the PS and that's saying somethin

So why does all other tax payers stand for the massive tax breaks a person can get for renting out agri land on a 5plus year lease.

but because someone had to rent out a house they own that may have been purchased as their private residence and not an investment, they are taxed on the rental income ad only got up to 75% of interest (80% now)

ganmo · 02-06-2017 10:37AM

lakill Farm wrote: »

So why does all other tax payers stand for the massive tax breaks a person can get for renting out agri land on a 5plus year lease.

but because someone had to rent out a house they own that may have been purchased as their private residence and not an investment, they are taxed on the rental income ad only got up to 75% of interest (80% now)

how much can ppl get tax free for the rent a room scheme?

Muckit · 02-06-2017 10:49AM

ganmo wrote: »

how much can ppl get tax free for the rent a room scheme?

Isn't it around €5000? Looks like €14000

/www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/owning_a_home/home_owners/rent_a_room_scheme.html

Username John · 02-06-2017 10:50AM

rangler1 wrote: »

It's the value for money is the problem, of course they're entitled to fair pay,
but I'm paying twice for health, twice for water,.....
Has it escaped your notice that for the last five years that while the PS is apologising for one scandal, they're making another.
Irish tax payers are entitled to better
Department of ag is the best of the PS and that's saying somethin

Nope - Revenue is the best dept, by far...

kollegeknight · 02-06-2017 10:57AM

Username John wrote: »

Nope - Revenue is the best dept, by far...

Unreal department. I qualified for the help to buy scheme. Forms completed and uploaded Wednesday, solicitor contacted Thursday, money in the account on Saturday.

Same whenever I had to rectify PAYE etc, money back fast.... and taken fast.

Username John · 02-06-2017 11:01AM

rangler1 wrote: »

It's the value for money is the problem, of course they're entitled to fair pay,
but I'm paying twice for health, twice for water,.....
Has it escaped your notice that for the last five years that while the PS is apologising for one scandal, they're making another.
Irish tax payers are entitled to better
Department of ag is the best of the PS and that's saying somethin

I would have to agree on the value for money...

But, for the most part this is not at the individual level. Having said that, I do think there is an individual element to it - where people can (and do) get away with doing nothing, and they are basically put up with, cos management is powerless due to the unions...

But on the flip side of that, often, management are a bit useless themselves - as we're currently seeing in one section of the PS in the media at present...

The most annoying thing is the accountability and repercussions - there is none really. You screw up, its a scandal, you get early retirement on full pension... :mad: :mad:

lakill Farm · 02-06-2017 11:16AM

ganmo wrote: »

how much can ppl get tax free for the rent a room scheme?

€14000 in calendar year 2017.

But you cant claim that if the full house is rented out. you must be living in the house.

lakill Farm · 02-06-2017 11:19AM

Username John wrote: »

Nope - Revenue is the best dept, by far...

fairly efficient except on some tax heading refunds. But I genuinely think that's down to understaffing , mostly due to retirements.

I had a meeting with 2 on Wednesday and threw out a few names of revenue people I use to deal with and all were retired or moved. Most were senior staff with 15/20 plus years experience

naughto · 02-06-2017 12:05PM

rangler1 wrote: »

Life ain't too bad if you're only working 170 days/year and some are even job sharing to hold their position.....can't imagine that working properly for students though.
Nurses will tell you about the 12 hr shift but, funnily enough, neglect to say it's only three days a week.
If there's a dispute on pay and productivity, the solution is decided by another branch of the PS and they knowing that any increase in pay or reduction in productivity decided will eventually benefit them

I held off till now cos there's a lot of sh1te be said every one made a choice what career people wanted to do in life just cos some people choose farming and 17 hour days for f1ck all out of it unless you have 100 acres plus.

I would like to see anyone and I mean anyone do what nurses do to whoukd not do it for an hour never mind 12 straight.
Are ye forgetting the overcrowding in a&e that was in the news for weeks that's still the same it's not going away but it's not in the news so no one gives a sh1te.
It's only when people end up in hospital that they see how bad it is.

Muckit · 02-06-2017 12:12PM

And the irony is he sleeps with the 'enemy' every night! I wonder is he as vocal then!

rangler1 · 02-06-2017 12:17PM

naughto wrote: »

I held off till now cos there's a lot of sh1te be said every one made a choice what career people wanted to do in life just cos some people choose farming and 17 hour days for f1ck all out of it unless you have 100 acres plus.

I would like to see anyone and I mean anyone do what nurses do to whoukd not do it for an hour never mind 12 straight.
Are ye forgetting the overcrowding in a&e that was in the news for weeks that's still the same it's not going away but it's not in the news so no one gives a sh1te.
It's only when people end up in hospital that they see how bad it is.

Is overcrowding not a symptom of bad management, do we not all on our farms put infrastructure in place for times of peak demand,... there's sixty lambing pens here that's only used for two months, does that mean they shouldn't be bought...well that's the attitude of the HSE.

Lock, Stock and Chitchat a Seacht

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