Season 6 Episode 8 "No One" - "Book readers"

ZeitgeistGlee · 13-06-2016 07:44PM

duffman13 wrote: »

Have to say I 100% agree with this, he should be angry, bitter, commanding and decisive but he's regressed as a character. He was one of my favourite characters, maybe bastard bowl will bring back the real Jon Snow.

Yep, god damn it they took away Stannis the Mannis so at least give us a worthy successor who's grim and hard as iron to lead the Northern armies.

If Rickon is still alive he'd be Lord Stark over Sansa wouldn't he? Guess that means the worst for him because nobody is getting in D&D's way of putting Lady Stark at the head of Winterfel.

This lionisation of Cersei (pun not intended) is getting a bit daft as well, we've had multiple scenes/seasons of her generally being an awful person yet D&D seem hellbent on trying to make her a sympathetic character by trying to make everyone else around her worse. She's a bad person in the same vein as Littlefinger and nobody has any doubts about his characterisation. Hell even "her love for her children" which we had so subtly alluded to this episode is more rooted in her fear of the prophecy (in the books) than actual maternal feelings.

Gbear · 13-06-2016 08:01PM

duploelabs wrote: »

Cercei already had the pyromancers making buckets of wildfyre prior to the battle of the blackwater until Tyrion, who was the hand at the time, said they they'd be making the wildfyre for him

She knows that wildfire exists.

What she was having investigated was Aerys Targaryen's caches planted around the city as his self-destruct button - aka the reason Jaime killed him (and Rossart).

Gbear · 13-06-2016 08:05PM

EagererBeaver wrote: »

I don't understand the purpose of Blackfish retaking Riverrun. Was it all purely to allow Jamie and Brienne to meet up again?

In books, Blackfish was in Riverrun the whole time and not at red wedding. When Riverrun is surrendered, he escapes and is presumably preparing to be a bad bastard somewhere about the place. In the show, he was needlessly at the Red Wedding, recaptured Riverrun off screen and then loses it again and dies. Pointless and wasteful use of a great character.

It doesn't feel like they planned this. I think they're just backpedalling.

They stripped a load of stuff from the books in the last couple of seasons but in order to get where they want to now they had to do some backtracking and some belated covering of the missed points.

intheclouds · 13-06-2016 08:14PM

My favourite part was Bronn discussing how he would definitely give Brienne the ride.

The Arya story was really really bad. She would have been dead from the original knife wounds. Then the relentless T-1000 chase with many improbable acrobatics. Only to end with her reclaiming her identity and telling Sexy Jesus she was off home?? Wtf!

I thought the Hound pissing in the river was the nod to the readers that they've pissed all over Lady Stoneheart.

Jaime is a grand fella for a seige. Doesn't give a ****. Terrible to lose the Blackfish off screen but worse that there's no Tully army for Sansa. Had Brienne fought Jaime she would have kicked his ass. Why didn't she given that Blackfish didn't surrender?

I thought the fleet of ships was the iron fleet at first. They're gonna be totally wasted now and burnt up.

And no trial by combat?!

Average episode, last 3 have been very average.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5 · 13-06-2016 08:28PM

They must have been shítting themselves all week hearing the theories about Arya and thinking how cross people were going to be when it turned out to just be that bollocks.

Worst part of a pretty bad episode, and overall I've been loving this season. Jaime and Edmure was the only good bit, and thank god the Hound is back.

13-06-2016 08:50PM

intheclouds wrote: »

My favourite part was Bronn discussing how he would definitely give Brienne the ride.

The Arya story was really really bad. She would have been dead from the original knife wounds. Then the relentless T-1000 chase with many improbable acrobatics. Only to end with her reclaiming her identity and telling Sexy Jesus she was off home?? Wtf!

I thought the Hound pissing in the river was the nod to the readers that they've pissed all over Lady Stoneheart.

Jaime is a grand fella for a seige. Doesn't give a ****. Terrible to lose the Blackfish off screen but worse that there's no Tully army for Sansa. Had Brienne fought Jaime she would have kicked his ass. Why didn't she given that Blackfish didn't surrender?

I thought the fleet of ships was the iron fleet at first. They're gonna be totally wasted now and burnt up.

And no trial by combat?!

Average episode, last 3 have been very average.

sexy jesus ha ha ha

ZeitgeistGlee · 13-06-2016 09:07PM

I was just thinking seeing as Jaime isn't a member of the Kingsguard anymore does that make him de facto Lord of Casterly Rock now in the TV series?

Tigger · 13-06-2016 09:28PM

OneOfThem Stumbled wrote: »

Don't you see? Well, it was so complex it can be forgiven, but seriously: open your eyes!

Arya's plan for the last two seasons was simply to cut off the Waif's face. Deliberately failing in her mission to kill the thin man? That was to be expelled. Then getting back into the House of Black and White? To goad the Waif. Then all the fighting whilst blind? See? Then failing to kill the actress, knowing that it would be a death sentence? Yup. She examined the face of the old woman, so she knew exactly that the waif was the waif when she came to kill Arya. All the pomposity of the way she booked a room to Westeros was to lure the Waif out. She knew that the real reason the actress was on a hit-list was because she was... a witch. Only death can pay for life, and who's life was that to be? The waif, of course! She also knew that the waif was going to stab her specifically in the stomach, she had overheard the waif muttering "must stab Arya in the gut" in her sleep. By the time the witch actress had finished healing her, Arya was 100% recovered, she was only feigning being frail. She deliberately stayed with the witch cum actress, knowing the waif would easily find her there, just in order to be lure her to the room with sting in it. If Arya had been carrying sting the Waif may not have been as easy a target, nor would a messy fight have left her with an unblemished face to cut off. It was all expertly written, all masterfully telegraphed. It was not a sub-plot spanning two seasons that was an entire waste of time.

i disagree :eek:

Tigger · 13-06-2016 09:28PM

bluewolf wrote: »

sexy jesus ha ha ha

sexy jsesu is what reddit calls him

intheclouds · 13-06-2016 09:34PM

Tigger wrote: »

sexy jsesu is what reddit calls him

He was such a great character before, lately he is just drab man in a big empty building.

Jofspring · 13-06-2016 10:39PM

Ok episode,

Hound - excellent as always.

Arya - I can't believe they spent two seasons on the faceless men for her in the end to just say, "I'm Arya Stark of Winterfell" and just saunter off. We really do give D&D too much credit sometimes.

BWB - So is that it with Lemoncloak and the lads? As in we are just supposed to forget about it and move on. Oh the lads decided to go off on their own for no reason and slaughter a whole bunch of people so now we have hung them and thats them done, move along now. No explanation, nothing.

Blackfish - So dissapointing that he left that way considering he was one of the best characters we have had in a while.

Tyrion - They have destroyed his character this year.

Danaerys - I actually started laughing when she walked in. It was like something from a cheap movie.

Jamie - Decent scenes but to just leave it as him arrive into the castle and be told the blackfish was dead was a complete let down. They lifted their first meeting from the books and it was excellent but it seems they didn't think they could match it with another meeting so just left it off.

The Mountain - class, ripping that guys head off. With the lack of trial by combat it now seems like a big battle with him could be a complete tease.

letowski · 13-06-2016 10:51PM

Maybe I'm missing something, but wasn't Cersei always aware of the storage of wildfire, going back to season 2 though. When Tyrion visited the pyromancer, he told him that wildfire would be made for himself and not Cersei going forward. Why would she be only finding out now, if she knew Kings Landing had it?

Witcher · 13-06-2016 10:54PM

letowski wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing something, but wasn't Cersei always aware of the storage of wildfire, going back to season 2 though. When Tyrion visited the pyromancer, he told him that wildfire would be made for himself and not Cersei going forward. Why would she be only finding out now, if she knew Kings Landing had it?

It's Aerys' cache of wildfire that she has learned about.

Fletch87 · 13-06-2016 10:57PM

I nearly expected Brienne and Pod to come paddling down the river when the Hound was taking a pi$$. Maybe the Blackfish will float down to take the place of LSH.

Will Beric still hope to complete his mission from Ned in season one to kill the Mountain? If so, there is a glimmer of hope for Clegane bowl!

One of the poorer episodes but a lot of loose ends tied up for a great final two episodes.

Nermal · 13-06-2016 11:01PM

Good: Jaime's recall of 'the things we do for love'.

Bad: T1000 chase scene

Excellent: eyesight on Jaime & Brienne, recognising one another in the dark from miles away and getting in a sentimental wave...

GerB40 · 13-06-2016 11:07PM

letowski wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing something, but wasn't Cersei always aware of the storage of wildfire, going back to season 2 though. When Tyrion visited the pyromancer, he told him that wildfire would be made for himself and not Cersei going forward. Why would she be only finding out now, if she knew Kings Landing had it?

I think the rumour she was talking about was the mad king's stash that's hidden under every significant part of kings landing. In other words, enough to turn King's Landing into Summer Hall and Harrenhall. What I hope to see is cersie creating the biggest fire the south has ever seen and Jaime finally redeeming himself by turning his back on his family (who'll probably all be dead) and charging up north to fulfil his oath to Catalyn and fúck the Boltons up. But that sounds too good for Game of Thrones...

rawn · 13-06-2016 11:09PM

GerB40 wrote: »

I think the rumour she was talking about was the mad king's stash that's hidden under every significant part of kings landing. In other words, enough to turn King's Landing into Summer Hall and Harrenhall. What I hope to see is cersie creating the biggest fire the south has ever seen and Jaime finally redeeming himself by turning his back on his family (who'll probably all be dead) and charging up north to fulfil his oath to Catalyn and fúck the Boltons up. But that sounds too good for Game of Thrones...

Maybe history will repeat itself, except instead of Aerys and the pyromancer it will be Cersei and Qyburn

Son0vagun · 13-06-2016 11:21PM

And I don't think Jamie will be there to stop her, as he will be in the north honouring his oath to Catelyn Stark. What other reason could the whole Riverlands story have?

wp_rathead · 13-06-2016 11:24PM

letowski wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing something, but wasn't Cersei always aware of the storage of wildfire, going back to season 2 though. When Tyrion visited the pyromancer, he told him that wildfire would be made for himself and not Cersei going forward. Why would she be only finding out now, if she knew Kings Landing had it?

She knew about the Wildfyre, but don't think she knew about the Wildfyre that Aerys had his pyromancers place throughout Kingslanding as a means to "Burn Them All"

ZeitgeistGlee wrote: »

I was just thinking seeing as Jaime isn't a member of the Kingsguard anymore does that make him de facto Lord of Casterly Rock now in the TV series?

Ya I'm guessing that actually, hasn't really been mentioned at all really- funnily Cersei and Jaime can go and live there if they so desired which is what they always wanted

intheclouds wrote: »

Jaime is a grand fella for a seige. Doesn't give a ****. Terrible to lose the Blackfish off screen but worse that there's no Tully army for Sansa. Had Brienne fought Jaime she would have kicked his ass. Why didn't she given that Blackfish didn't surrender?

I thought the fleet of ships was the iron fleet at first. They're gonna be totally wasted now and burnt up.

And no trial by combat?!

Brienne said honor dictated that she would have to fight for Tully's if Lannisters attacked as they were Sansa's kin- the Tully's laid down their arms so she had no reason to fight

The "no cleganbowl" looks like a shame but here's hoping the brothers meet again at some point

I'm guessing Yara and Theon gonna attack the Slavers, but surely Drogon could just burn them himself

rawn · 13-06-2016 11:28PM

wp_rathead wrote: »

She knew about the Wildfyre, but don't think she knew about the Wildfyre that Aerys had his pyromancers place throughout Kingslanding as a means to "Burn Them All"

Ya I'm guessing that actually, hasn't really been mentioned at all really- funnily Cersei and Jaime can go and live there if they so desired which is what they always wanted

Brienne said honor dictated that she would have to fight for Tully's if Lannisters attacked as they were Sansa's kin- the Tully's laid down their arms so she had no reason to fight

The "no cleganbowl" looks like a shame but here's hoping the brothers meet again at some point

I'm guessing Yara and Theon gonna attack the Slavers, but surely Drogon could just burn them himself

It will happen. It's the only thing they can do with the Mountain character, especially if Cersai is on her way out (one way or another).

freyners · 13-06-2016 11:42PM

I don't think drogon is going to burn the fleet as we have a lot about how they need 1000 ships. Some messing with the greyjoys seems more likely imo

joe123 · 13-06-2016 11:53PM

Really enjoyed last weeks episode. This week....holy hell what a bag of ****e.

Apart from Arya being super human.....they essentially wasted the faceless men plotline. It literally went nowhere.

Why in the hell have they killed the blackfish and off screen to boot? We are force fed the two worst characters Greyworm and his girlfriend week in week out, we finally have a great character again in the blackfish and he has an ending like that?

What was the point in the whole river run thing? What prompted edmure to go from a man of high principle looking at Jamie in disgust to not only giving up river run but handing over the blackfish. Jamie telling him he loves cersi was enough to push him that far? EDIT: you can ignore this paragraph! For some reason I thought they hung Edmure in the books at the end!

Fucjinh stupid ****e.

They have ruined Tyrion by lumping him in with those two fools talking about jokes. And that scene with Daeyners at the end was pure cringe. Her terrible acting along with the ****ness of mereeen....ughhhh

The only good thing about that episode was the BWB and The Hound.

GerB40 · 13-06-2016 11:55PM

Son0vagun wrote: »

And I don't think Jamie will be there to stop her, as he will be in the north honouring his oath to Catelyn Stark. What other reason could the whole Riverlands story have?

The moment in the books where Jaime gets the letter from Cersei during seige of Riverrun asking for help in her trial by combat and he says "Nah she can fúck herself" (it's been a while since I read it but it was along those lines) was my favourite Jaime moment. The only way D+D can really make Jaime a fan favourite again is by completing his redemption.And I can see this happening. Like you said, there's no other reason to have him in the Riverlands.

CMOTDibbler · 13-06-2016 11:59PM

joe123 wrote: »

Really enjoyed last weeks episode. This week....holy hell what a bag of ****e.

Apart from Arya being super human.....they essentially wasted the faceless men plotline. It literally went nowhere.

Why in the hell have they killed the blackfish and off screen to boot? We are force fed the two worst characters Greyworm and his girlfriend week in week out, we finally have a great character again in the blackfish and he has an ending like that?

What was the point in the whole river run thing? What prompted edmure to go from a man of high principle looking at Jamie in disgust to not only giving up river run but handing over the blackfish. Jamie telling him he loves cersi was enough to push him that far?

Fucjinh stupid ****e.

They have ruined Tyrion by lumping him in with those two fools talking about jokes. And that scene with Daeyners at the end was pure cringe. Her terrible acting along with the ****ness of mereeen....ughhhh

The only good thing about that episode was the BWB and The Hound.

I think you might be lost. This is the book readers thread. :pac:

joe123 · 14-06-2016 12:01AM

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

I think you might be lost. This is the book readers thread. :pac:

What do you mean? I know this is the book readers thread.

Edit: ah the Edmure bit your on about? I'm more pissed off with the way the blackfish was handled.

littlemac1980 · 14-06-2016 12:11AM

So I just watched this episode again.

Overall I liked it a lot.

I think my two favourite parts were:

1. Bronn distracting Pod with his feet then slapping him and say he should always assume people want to smack him, cos every one wants to smack a squire.

2. The hound begrudgly kicking away the stumps to hang the 2 guys when he really wanted to gut them, then taking yer mans boots while he was still choking to death and nonchalantly asking the BWB's if they had anything to eat.

Also really liked the mountain's little scene - I always wondered about the true effectiveness of the Sevens' maces - seems they were designed to puncture plate mail and would normally be quite effective - just no use against zombies.

One thing that did bother me though was the issue with The Blackfish not being Lord of Riverrun, and the guy saying he has to obey Edmure.

Now my take on events was that following the Red Wedding - Geoffrey (or at least someone with Authority derived from him - perhaps Tywin) granted Riverrun to the Freys. Subsequently the Blackfish captured it. Which is why Lord Frey berated the two Frey lads for "losing" the castle.

So technically the Freys were Lords of Riverrun, but as per the Blackfish's comment to Brienne "If Jamie wants Riverrun he can bloody well take it like everyone else has to" After he captured it he was effectively Lord of Riverrun - so despite the fact that the guards of Riverrun may have had lingering loyalty to Edmure. I would have thought that the Blackfish would have been quick to point out to the guardsmen that their loyalty in so far as their duties regarding castle were to him alone as he had only just earlier made the point to Brienne.

What's more - it might be suggested that the Tully's sided with Rob Stark and thus derived their lordship through his Authority - but that isn't the case as they were Lords of Riverrun since Robert Baratheons reign (and probably before), which was ended when Geoffrey granted Riverrun to the Freys.

Also it was case if I recall correctly that after Theon overtook Winterfell - the Maester (who would be very cognisant of the laws) quickly understood his change of loyalty had switched to Theon as the then Lord of Winterfell. Therefore, it's seems the act of capture of a castle itself at least grants Lordship (whether or not legitimately recognised by the crown) effective enough to be authority over the subordinates that are your soldiers which shouldn't then give rise to one of them suggesting that some earlier Lord who had been previously removed from that position could have superior claim to the Man who captured the castle - unless one would presume that man was prepared to concede his title to the previous Lord.

It's a bit long winded an explanation - but can ye see what I'm getting at?

Tenger · 14-06-2016 12:12AM

riffmongous wrote: »

I felt pretty disappointed watching the arya chase, although I did like the ending. What bugs me the most is that for me it wasn't clear if it all happened by chance, or if arya planned the whole thing.. It felt more like the former at times which hurts the arya character a lot I feel

I feel that it was planned, while the circumstances may not have been, the destination was. That roll down the steps was too obviously clumsy, "oh look, I'm injuring and failing down steps", "oh look, I'm trailing blood against the wall as I'm barely able to stand upright"
However I do feel that getting stabbed in the first place was pretty stupid.

Nermal wrote: »

Excellent: eyesight on Jaime & Brienne, recognising one another in the dark from miles away and getting in a sentimental wave...

Excellent? Didnt Jaime berate the Freys for not setting pickets during a siege in the last episode? Who the feck takes a castle and sends their entire surrounding army INTO the castle? You should have pickets along the perimeter to prevent escapees (like the BlackFish in the books)
Yes, I know....Brienne and Pod need to escape so they can get back to Sansa for plot purposes in further episodes...but couldnt they have done so in a rainstorm at least?

joe123 wrote: »

..... What prompted edmure to go from a man of high principle looking at Jamie in disgust to not only giving up river run but handing over the blackfish. Jamie telling him he loves cersi was enough to push him that far?.........

You obviously missed the whole "I will launch your son over the walls with a catapult, I will kill every Tully just to get back to her." line.

littlemac1980 wrote: »

.....

It's a bit long winded an explanation - but can ye see what I'm getting at?

The troops have loyalty to the head of the family. Hence the Tully's have to obey Edmure over Blackfish, Edmure is the head of the family.
The Maester serves the castle/kingdom itself, not the family who command it.

littlemac1980 · 14-06-2016 12:14AM

Oh yeah but the lowest point for me was greyworm.

"That was worst joke I ever heard"

"I am soldier I hear many jokes"

"That was joke"

He's a f***ing joke.

joe123 · 14-06-2016 12:25AM

I wonder is there any chance Edmure actually helped the Blackfish escape which would follow the books. Probably not....its the hope that kills us.

wp_rathead · 14-06-2016 12:26AM

littlemac1980 wrote: »

It's a bit long winded an explanation - but can ye see what I'm getting at?

I get what you are saying but the Tully soilders would recognise Edmure as the Lord of Riverun as he is Hoster's son and was the heir
It is a lot less messy in the books as the Brynden never has to "retake it" so it was always under Tully's rule

Season 6 Episode 8 "No One" - "Book readers"

Comments