Collating complaints against IBB.

vinks

Perhaps some of the disgrunted users on here should contact the Irish Times or Ms Shoesmith. The article amounts to free publicity for IBB and will not doubt attract even more people to the debacle that is IBB.

heh, im up for sign any petition/email that gets drafted, but i aint going to be the person to draft it. perhaps a co-ordinated spamming of the irish times ms. shoesmith might be a worthwhile effort and at least have report a better story.

Nevyn

Vinks if you were to read the start of this stickied thread you will see what id being requested to have the complaints collated.

vinks

i think we were more loosely talking about writing to the irish time and informing them on whats happening to some users.

LegacyUser

Tried ringing them - said they would sort it. Haven't been billed for three months. Have emailed three times this week and before Christmas. They delete the messages without reading them!! Unbelieveable.

I'd love to pay!

---

Original Message

---

From: xxxx
To: xxxx ; info@irishbroadband.ie
Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 12:39 AM
Subject: Re: Billing


hello???????????????????????????????????

---

Original Message

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anoble66

hi,

i have been watching this forum over the last 2 weeks, ever since having a 2mb line installed by IBB. I am in Killaloe, and its a new mast so i think its only going to get worse as they sign up more people...

i have never yet recieved a 2mb connection, in fact i have never managed to download over 180KB/s - and thats from ftp.heanet.ie which i am sure we are all familiar with by now..In general i am getting anywhere from 5-30% continous packet loss, ping round trip times to heanet.ie average at 160ms and general download speeds never exceed 60KB/s

I have been in contact with tech support ever since the service was installed and i keep getting the same response but re-worded - "your service is working within the given contention ratio" - the point is if you can never actually get 2000kbps then this is not contention...also i would argue that they should not be able to advertise a 2mb service if its never possible to achieve this speed.

Has anyone on this board actually tried sucessfully to cancel their service when they are still in the min contract period? Also for the people who have cancelled their direct debits, what was the consequences? I am thinking i am going to have to do the same.

I am happy to help out in anyway to get this company of timewasters to actually sit-up and pay attention to their customer complaints.

adam

mayhem#

anoble66 wrote:

hi,

i have been watching this forum over the last 2 weeks, ever since having a 2mb line installed by IBB. I am in Killaloe, and its a new mast so i think its only going to get worse as they sign up more people...

i have never yet recieved a 2mb connection, in fact i have never managed to download over 180KB/s - and thats from ftp.heanet.ie which i am sure we are all familiar with by now..In general i am getting anywhere from 5-30% continous packet loss, ping round trip times to heanet.ie average at 160ms and general download speeds never exceed 60KB/s

I have been in contact with tech support ever since the service was installed and i keep getting the same response but re-worded - "your service is working within the given contention ratio" - the point is if you can never actually get 2000kbps then this is not contention...also i would argue that they should not be able to advertise a 2mb service if its never possible to achieve this speed.

Has anyone on this board actually tried sucessfully to cancel their service when they are still in the min contract period? Also for the people who have cancelled their direct debits, what was the consequences? I am thinking i am going to have to do the same.

I am happy to help out in anyway to get this company of timewasters to actually sit-up and pay attention to their customer complaints.

adam

If you're in Killaloe you're better of talking to the lads from www.fwi.ie....
Or wait a few months untill we get setup there...

E.

vinks

i just rang ibb up for some information on why i didnt get an engineer call out after them assuring me that an engineer will call back, after 2 weeks of waiting, i rang them again, and they wonderfully cancelled the engineer.

it would have been nice if they had called me back afterwards to let me know. i think i shall ring their customer care and complain abit.

MrPudding

I have had problems since October, well actually before that but I only opened the case then. They are very poor at calling back or responding. Plus the fact that they do not seem to know what the problem is.

I was told that there was to be an upgrade in December that would fix my problem. I still have the problem and no one contacted me until the other day when I received a mail telling me there was an upgrade happening this month which would hopefully sort my problem.

I found out the other day that NTL should be available in my area in the next few months. I hope this is the case.

Has anyone had any luck getting a refund from them?

MrP

testicle

anoble66 wrote:

i have never yet recieved a 2mb connection, in fact i have never managed to download over 180KB/s - and thats from ftp.heanet.ie which i am sure we are all familiar with by now..In general i am getting anywhere from 5-30% continous packet loss, ping round trip times to heanet.ie average at 160ms and general download speeds never exceed 60KB/s

Hello.

I think you are mixing up kb ans kB. A 2MB connection will give download speeds 1/8 of 2MB which is 256kb/s

vinks

MrPudding wrote:

I have had problems since October, well actually before that but I only opened the case then. They are very poor at calling back or responding. Plus the fact that they do not seem to know what the problem is.

I was told that there was to be an upgrade in December that would fix my problem. I still have the problem and no one contacted me until the other day when I received a mail telling me there was an upgrade happening this month which would hopefully sort my problem.

oddly enough thats roughly the time span that i have had problems with ibb as well, its been broken since september and was okayish, now its just borked real bad.

LegacyUser

Me too - took 3 months to get an engineer out to fix it in December. It lasted 2 days and now its worse than ever.

48 euro a month for a connection that is slower than dialup modem. I could a hell of a lot more reliable service from my phoneline at the moment. All I want to do is FTP a couple of imagines to someone's website, update my virus definitions (been timing out for 3 days now) and apply Microsoft patches.

IBB should be ashamed of themselves. Still waiting for a call back from their billing dept.

anoble66

interesting read...maybe it could help when trying to get out of paying for the remaining term of the contract - according to this its classed as an "unfair term" read in full at http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/ZZSI27Y1995.html

would be interested in anyone elses opinions on the below..


EUROPEAN COMMUNITIES (UNFAIR TERMS IN CONSUMER CONTRACTS) REGULATIONS, 1995.

SCHEDULE 2


Guidelines for Application of the Test of Good Faith


In making an assessment of good faith, particular regard shall be had to


— the strength of the bargaining positions of the parties,


— whether the consumer had an inducement to agree to the term,


— whether the goods or services were sold or supplied to the special order of the consumer, and


— the extent to which the seller or supplier has dealt fairly and equitably with the consumer whose legitimate interests he has to take into account.


SCHEDULE 3


Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts


1. Terms which have the object or effect of:


( a ) excluding or limiting the legal liability of a seller or supplier in the event of the death of a consumer or personal injury to the latter resulting from an act or omission of that seller or supplier;


( b ) inappropriately excluding or limiting the legal rights of the consumer vis-a-vis the seller or supplier or another party in the event of total or partial non-performance or inadequate performance by the seller or supplier of any of the contractual obligations, including the option of offsetting a debt owed to the seller or supplier against any claim which the consumer may have against him;


( c ) making an agreement binding on the consumer whereas provision of services by the seller or supplier is subject to a condition whose realization depends on his own will alone;


( d ) permitting the seller or supplier to retain sums paid by the consumer where the latter decides not to conclude or perform the contract, without providing for the consumer to receive compensation of an equivalent amount from the seller or supplier where the latter is the party cancelling the contract;


( e ) requiring any consumer who fails to fulfil his obligation to pay a disproportionately high sum in compensation;


( f ) authorizing the seller or supplier to dissolve the contract on a discretionary basis where the same facility is not granted to the consumer, or permitting the seller or supplier to retain the sums paid for services not yet supplied by him where it is the seller or supplier himself who dissolves the contract;


( g ) enabling the seller or supplier to terminate a contract of indeterminate duration without reasonable notice except where there are serious grounds for doing so;


( h ) automatically extending a contract of fixed duration where the consumer does not indicate otherwise, when the deadline fixed for the consumer to express this desire not to extend the contract is unreasonably early;


( i ) irrevocably binding the consumer to terms with which he had no real opportunity of becoming acquainted before the conclusion of the contract;


( j ) enabling the seller or supplier to alter the terms of the contract unilaterally without a valid reason which is specified in the contract;


( k ) enabling the seller or supplier to alter unilaterally without a valid reason any characteristics of the product or service to be provided;


( l ) providing for the price of goods to be determined at the time of delivery or allowing a seller of goods or supplier of services to increase their price without in both cases giving the consumer the corresponding right to cancel the contract if the final price is too high in relation to the price agreed when the contract was concluded;


( m ) giving the seller or supplier the right to determine whether the goods or services supplied are in conformity with the contract, or giving him the exclusive right to interpret any term of the contract;


( n ) limiting the seller's or supplier's obligation to respect commitments undertaken by his agents or making his commitments subject to compliance with a particular formality;


( o ) obliging the consumer to fulfil all his obligations where the seller or supplier does not perform his;


( p ) giving the seller or supplier the possibility of transferring his rights and obligations under the contract, where this may serve to reduce the guarantees for the consumer, without the latter's agreement;


( q ) excluding or hindering the consumer's right to take legal action or exercise any other legal remedy, particularly by requiring the consumer to take disputes exclusively to arbitration not covered by legal provisions, unduly restricting the evidence available to him or imposing on him a burden of proof which, according to the applicable law, should lie with another party to the contract.

stepbar

Just a quick post to let you know about my experience with IBB. I have been a customer with them since Dec 04. I finally disconnected my connection today after they told me that it would take 4-5 days to send me out a replacement modem (In the hope that that MITE improve things, I should have read this msg board first....)!!!!!!!!! To start I was prepared to give them a chance but after a while I began to get sick of them ignoring my emails & having to wait for over 1/2 hr for some one to answer the phone in CS.

Any how, rang them up last Sunday and demanded they send me out 1 (Crap service since last August....), & was told should receive it by Tuesday. Rang up today, told 4-5 working days. Final straw. Canceled there and then. As well as that I demanded that they refund me back to the time I first contacted them to complain about the pathetic level of service (i.e. I actually contacted the Managing Director, Paul Doody - (for everyone’s info his email is xxxx.xxxxx@irishbroadband.ie, work that out for yourself its not too unlike his name ..... ), last August).

I wonder has anybody successfully sued IBB, because I am seriously thinking of taking a claim through the Small claims court or the like if they don’t refund me what I am looking for (I might even claim for more "damages"....). Has anyone any suggestions as to the route I should take or any helpful information that they could give me?

Cheers.

dan99989

I hear you about the crap service - however, i have noticed a stark improvement on the Bray mast of late. Anyone else experiencing better speeds in Bray?

Oh and dont think you can post yer mans email address on this thread...think i remember reading somewhere that wasnt allowed.. Better edit it out to be sure though...

LegacyUser

Hi Stepbar,

I emailed a LOT more people than Paul Doody over the last few days.
I was having issues since last September which caused havoc - I actually lost out on a contract over it. Eventually, they sent someone out in December and he sorted it. Over the last 2 weeks things went steadily downwards.

I emailed support with read receipts on the emails and low and behold there was people reading them and deleting them - but not one of those people replied. Eventually after emailing several people I got a phone call from a guy - not the nicest - didn't seem to understand the frustration of a customer waiting this long to have an issue sorted out. Did not seem to understand that I have a full time job and cannot hang on a phoneline waiting for IBB to pick it up. I just don't have time for it. When I pay for a service I expect it to continue working. Okay, I hick up or a small problem is fine - but these issues continuously happen.

Example of a good company:
NTL - I signed up, their engineer came out and did what he had to do. I have had digital ever since. A direct debit comes out of my bank account each month. No hassels, it works.

Example of not good service:
IBB - Guys come out and install mast on house. I have constant problems and issues with it.
Hassels, works irregularly. Costs more than other companies for the same service.

Told him I want to escalate it further - went to the cinema and when I came back it was 2.2MB and 1.68MB. It was obviously their issue after all!! There is no way that was contention.

It also took 3 months for their billing dept to contact me. 3 months of asking! Again, I included that grievance in the email.

BTW - last weekend I got my hands on one of those ripwave modems - 60.8 kbs was the speed I got. Sounds like a problem with the equipment as opposed to IBB. I heard reports that it is the modems that are at fault.

Good luck with it
B

1013

bubby wrote:

BTW - last weekend I got my hands on one of those ripwave modems - 60.8 kbs was the speed I got. Sounds like a problem with the equipment as opposed to IBB. I heard reports that it is the modems that are at fault.

B

I'd say your speeds on ripwave are about average. Ripwave is about the same as dial up speeds which IBB say is within the contention limits. Presumably as long as your speed isn't below 12.8, you're still within their limit. It's not very good really, especially as their ads are stating "...superfast broadband internet access...."

They clearly don't have access to a dictionary - or maybe they do, and just don't understand the BIG words. Anything with more than one syllable seems to be a difficulty.

Surely there is a trade descriptions issue here?

IBB must be a truly awful company to work for. Faulty products that don't deliver as advertised, many many people complaining, poor training (if any..) as is obvious from the lack of customer service, and a tech dept who are unable to provide tech support.

I have a vision of an array of pc's, and sitting in front of each one is a monkey wearing a headset . You can train a monkey to answer the phone, but you will never train a monkey to deliver customer service & support.

Working in a local burger joint would have to be better - at least you would be dealing with a reliable and known product .

Zena

I too have had terrible problems with IBB, they are wrecking my head and have been doing so since August - everytime I ring them it is like talking to the wall!!! I have told them I going through Small Claims court as they will not refund me my money. Like Stepbar above I wonder has anybody successfully sued IBB? If you have any advice on how to nail these assholes please let me know.:mad:

LegacyUser

Zena wrote:

I too have had terrible problems with IBB, they are wrecking my head and have been doing so since August - everytime I ring them it is like talking to the wall!!! I have told them I going through Small Claims court as they will not refund me my money. Like Stepbar above I wonder has anybody successfully sued IBB? If you have any advice on how to nail these assholes please let me know.:mad:

I know two people who are going that route. They have reports that show clearly the speeds they were getting etc, and over several months. Not sure what tool, but snapshots.

You would need to proove that IBB have not provided you with a consistent service - and word of mouth, like saying "They didn't give me the service" is probably not enough.

And I was not always against IBB, I used to be a walking advertisement for them .. until @ last September.

Proof of the pudding :
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=3211270#2

MackQ

dan99989 wrote:

I hear you about the crap service - however, i have noticed a stark improvement on the Bray mast of late. Anyone else experiencing better speeds in Bray?

No, it's worse than ever.

I'm supposed to be on their 2MB package ("...the product choice for the speed conscious Home User...") but I haven't seen anything over 500K since last July.

Kone

I am still waiting on refund from before Xmas, if I don't get it this month I will be straight onto the ODCA.

KELTICKNIGHTT

dan99989 wrote:

Merry Christmas from Irish Broadband...



IBB Bray...

WHERE DID YOU GET LINK TO CHECK YOU BB SPEED PLEASE
CHEERS

jim_b_o

Take real action. See below...

I got IrishBroadband (Breeze 2MB) installed in Sep '05. Took a few weeks between sign-up and install, but once completed I was very happy with the connection. I work from home and use it a lot and had no problems. That was until mid Nov when it failed completely. It seems to be a problem with the aerial on the roof.

I reported the problem immediately and it still isn't fixed (now over 2 months later). I've spent many hours on the phone to tech support, left messages with the Customer Services Manager and made an official complaint via their advertised mechanism. None of these things has helped. IrishBroadband scheduled three visits to fix the problem. On two of those occasions they didn't show up. On one occasion they did, but couldn't fix it because they couldn't get on the roof as it was raining.

So hit them where it hurts... I've cancelled the Direct Debit. I've also discovered that their accounts admin is as poorly organised as their maintenance department. Under the Direct Debit scheme they are required to give 14 days notice prior to applying each monthly debit to your account. This they have not done. Hence I have requested my bank to reverse all the payments that have been made (except the first which is usually authorised in a different way). I had the money back within two days. Now IrishBroadband call me, which is an improvement, although I'm still not holding my breath that they'll fix it.

Anyway, if you're having trouble with them, check the date on the invoices they email you (the date on the invoice itself, not the date you received it (strange but true)). If that date is less than 14 days before the corresponding payment went out, they've broken the terms of the Direct Debit agreement and you're entitled to a refund.

For further info check out http://www.ipso.ie/frames/IrishPaymentServicesOrganisation.htm. The document on that page entitled 'Full Scheme Rules (50 pages) Version 4.13' has all the details. Page 12 covers what I've discussed above, and the preceeding pages have other background info. Suggest you print page 12 and take it with you when you go to the bank so that they don't try and fob you off.

Vote with your €€€€s!

P.S. You'll probably technically still owe IrishBroadband the money (at least for any period you had a working service) so don't go spending it just yet. Simply be as proactive with arranging alternative payment as they are with fixing your problem. In my case I want recompense for the missed appointments and a few sweetners if they want to keep me as a customer. I still liked it when it worked but a 50% availability is criminal.

stepbar

Cheers man thats what ill be doing ASAP all six months & if they ring me I tell them where to go...

syklops

I wouldnt get too excited if I were you.

"Among other amendments the transition period is now extended to March 2006, during which time old and new rules may co-exist."

This is in the second line of the document, which suggests they are still in the transition period. Which means they are not liable for the mistake before March 2006.

Also as i have mentioned before on the site, be very careful pulling your Direct Debit from things, as it can affect your future credit rating. Banks like people who signed up for something for a year and paid for a year, not people who signed up for something and pulled the Direct Debit after six months. They dont care if your service was bad. If I were you I would consult a solicitor before removing your Direct Debit, and especially before telling other people to do it on Boards.

dan99989

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote:

WHERE DID YOU GET LINK TO CHECK YOU BB SPEED PLEASE
CHEERS

Its: http://www.irishisptest.com/myspeed/

anoble66

i have cancelled my contract as of yesterday. After a l2 tech looked at the signal coming from my aerial he said that it was bouncing continously, i was promised a call to arrange a site visit to fix the aerial issue...of course this never happened so i emailed the supervisor who has been dealing with my issue to cancel. She has agreed to cancel my contract because the service was never installed correctly in the 1st place. To be honest i feel like i have had a lucky escape...

best of luck to you all with this bunch, you will never have a decent connection, you only have to see the packet loss within their core to see this as well as the masive latency..

carbsy

My connection is totally unusable since before Christmas.It literally took me 10 mins to post this ffs.Everytime I call they just say that they are having problems with the R&H Hall mast.The buggers debited my a/c a day early as I had planned on cancelling it.

gordonnet

my problems are with the churchfield mast for the same period, i also had my direct debit taken 2 days early. i am planning to cancell the dd for next month now, i am without service since early january if i hear "we are working on the problem" anymore i will go mad

carbsy

Yeah gordon - they're a friggin joke.I've signed up with UTV as they have some good new DSL offers.

peterq

I've been reading posts in this thread over the past several months with some interest. There isn't a single issue raised by anybody that I haven't personally experienced - and worse!!! I signed up to IBB in Dec 04 and for a reasonable time found it a good service with transfer rates in excess of 120kBps (on the 1Mb service) and 240/250kBps after the upgrade to 2Mb). For the last 5 or 6 months I've had what is effectively a dial-up connection that occasionally morphs into ISDN. Calls to techsupp (when I finally reach them!)only elicit ludicrous excuses and entreaties to "ping, ping, PING" (as though this is some kind of ISP "abrakadabra"! They request emails with screenshots and never read them! Their "customer service manager" phones me and baldly informs me that the reason I had up-to-then received excellent service was that I had mistakenly been assigned an uncontended connection, and that they had reverted it to the 24:1 CR. When I asked if my current level of service - ie dial-up - was what I could expect in the future he said "unfortunately, yes". I run a computer business and am asked 20 to 30 times a week to recommend a broadband service. It's to my eternal shame that I have sent many scores of people into the maw of IBB - I even kept their application forms in pdf to print for people! My website carried their logo and a link to their site! NOT ANY MORE!!! I now find myself acting as a sort of "proxy" customer service agent for IBB as my own clients are ringing me to ask what's wrong with this service THAT I RECOMMENDED TO THEM!!!
In Sept 05 I had a networking engineer that does some work for me fit both HW and SW to monitor my connection. He tells me that my line is effectively a 175kbps line (average) and that the peak obtained Sept 12th-Jan 14th was 724kbps (for 18secs!!!)

Enough is enough! the only thing that keeps me from cancelling is the unlimited transfers, slow though they are ( as I type my BW monitor is showing UL @ 6.7kBps and DL @ 9.6kBps). A solicitor friend - who like myself once worked in the media - has recommended a course of action based on the great bugbear of private companies with a public persona - Bad Publicity!

Form an IBB consumer group.
Hire a good lawyer ( not a problem if the cost is split between many)
Issue writs against IBB ( very little cost involved)
Send out press releases
Appoint ( or elect) a rep to talk to the media if neccessary

Tho object of the excercise is of course NOT to end up in court! - a process that would take several years in any case - but to generate enough bad publicity to shake the b******ds out of their complacency! That dissatisfied
punters are not going to quietly go away and make room for more mugs!

They're taking YOUR money and MINE. They aren't providing anywhere near the service they promise! Why let them get away with it? Force them to publicly defend themselves and explain their position! They may not want to answer calls from you or I but will they refuse to take calls from IT-savvy hacks sniffing blood and a good yarn? Not to mention that comreg and others might just be forced to take action!

Its worth thinking about.

Sincerely sorry to bend your ears ( maybe eyes!) but I've been saving this up for many months!

P