Smart to offer 2Mb Broadband for €35 with no line rental?

The Recliner

I currently don't have a land line (there is a conection in the apartment) as I don't want to be paying line rental on a land line and a mobile.

Does anyone know if I get a land line connected with Eircom could I switch whenever this becomes available, is there a 12 month contract with Eorcom that sort of thing.

Woden

my house phone fails on smart telecom there, but i type to you from my eircom broadband connection. any idea whats up with that? dublin 7 area btw.

tried people's numbers in blanchardstown which also failed and then one in drumcondra which said it would be available on march/april

Blaster99

I just tried a few different numbers: Bray fails. Ballinteer works. Sandyford fails. Windy Arbour works, Blackrock works, Tallaght works, Dublin 2 fails, Foxrock fails, Crumlin works, Cornelscourt fails, Blanchardstown (I think) fails.

So it's pretty patchy even in Dublin.

causal

This is weird:
I tried the two numbers from 2 different places in Dublin with Smart and Eircom:

A Blackrock number - passed for Eircom, failed for Smart.
A Knocklyon number - failed for Eircom, passed for Smart.

Huh, how can that be

causAl

causal

Blaster99 wrote:

I just tried a few different numbers: Bray fails. Ballinteer works. Sandyford fails. Windy Arbour works, Blackrock works, Tallaght works, Dublin 2 fails, Foxrock fails, Crumlin works, Cornelscourt fails, Blanchardstown (I think) fails.

So it's pretty patchy even in Dublin.

More like random, spontaneous and unpredictable :rolleyes:
What part of Blackrock?
The one I tried failed with Smart (passed with Eircom!) - but iirc the Blackrock number is in the Foxrock exchange.
The location is just past Stradbrook on the the Deansgrange road.

causAl

SkepticOne

The Recliner wrote:

Does anyone know if I get a land line connected with Eircom could I switch whenever this becomes available, is there a 12 month contract with Eorcom that sort of thing.

Should be possible. LLU provides for the handing over of an Eircom line to the other company which then rents it from Eircom. Most LLU services will use a line already in place although it is possible for the other company to order a line specially for LLU.

WezzyB

You can switch over as soon as you get your eircom account number, I took me about 2 weeks to get my account number when I signed up last year.

Getting a landline is free at the moment from eircom, if there is a line already into the house, I think this offer ends soon.

SkepticOne

causal wrote:

This is weird:
I tried the two numbers from 2 different places in Dublin with Smart and Eircom:

A Blackrock number - passed for Eircom, failed for Smart.
A Knocklyon number - failed for Eircom, passed for Smart.

Huh, how can that be

causAl

My guess is that the Blackrock number is not planned for upgrade with Smart (they are not putting their equipment in that exchange).

The Knocklyon number fails Eircom due to distance, line quality or whatever but passes for Smart because Smart only tells you that the exchange is on their plan. It is not (I'm guessing) a real line test result, but a reading from a database of planned upgrades.

Blaster99

I think you may find that Smart will install their product wherever they can instead of relying on bogus line test results.

I tried two numbers in Blackrock. One near the village, another one along Newtown Park Ave or whatever it's called. Both work in the sense that it said "July/August".

LoBo

Interesting

Well UTV BB offer is out of contract in april/may. This gives enough time for others to react w/ better pricing / download speeds, or at the very least for smart to prove they aren't vapourware.

Looking forward to it

Hornet

Somebody asked "What's the catch?". Well, the catch is that potentially or probably after 100 000 connected users, you will pay EUR 35 PLUS line rental. When you order you have no idea if you will be among the 100k or not. I haven't read any Terms & COnditions, but I guess you sign over your phone traffic immediately when you order and I doubt that there is a cancellation right in case you won't be among the first 100k!

Why is Smart running this program?

They need to raise money urgently, but it seems they won't get anymore free money, instead the money available is debt-financed. However, they are very much in the red and it will probably take a long long time (if ever) before they reach break-even. So it seems the (private) lenders are careful and won't just plough in more money to disappear for good. The SUnday Business Post printed an article on the 23/01/05 that explained

"Smart Telecom is raising about EUR 20 million from private investors to fund the roll-out of its broadband offering [...].
It is understood that Smart is setting up a special purpose vehicle to raise debt finance from wealthy investors. The company is offering an interest rate of between 8-10% on the funds they lend to the vehicle.
[...]
Smart will have the right to draw down the funds in proportion to the number of broadband customers it signs up. For example, if it signs up a broadband customer generating revenue fo EUR 1000 per annum, it will be able to draw down EUR 500 from the fund."

So let's do the numbers: Per user they charge EUR 35 per month, this results in EUR 420 per year per user. Multiply it by 100,000 and you arrive at 42mio. If they really get approx. 50% of the expected revenue in loaned money, these 100,000 users will enable Smart to get the 20mio they need.

To get the money they don't need to CONNECT anyone, it seems! They only need to SIGN UP customers. So HOW and WHEN the exchanges will be enabled is possibly a separate story.

--Hornet

Moriarty

I've been wondering about the free line rental thang and I have a theory.

Smart are probably using shared line unbundling for this. This will cost them €0.39/month/customer for access to the data segment of each line after comreg recently reduced the pricing for line share. Now.. for the line rental piece, they may be able to deactivate the voice segment of the line (there by no line rental owed to eircom) and port all voice traffic over a VOIP solution (since they'll have their own equipment in the exchanges). The end result being customers get free line rental and cheap broadband, while smart have very low overheads payable to eircom per customer.

I dunno, it's a possibility in any case.

spongebob

Hornet wrote:

Somebody asked "What's the catch?".

No exchanges are live for one.

To get the money they don't need to CONNECT anyone, it seems! They only need to SIGN UP customers. So HOW and WHEN the exchanges will be enabled is possibly a separate story.

Quite so Hornet . The Smart Telecom BB 'Line Check' turns into a CPS honeypot as you can below See

http://www.smarttelecom.ie/products/broadband/step3.htm

"Broadband Check and Sign-up: Step 3"

...is full of T&C's including !

2.1. This Agreement shall commence on the date the Services and Equipment are provided by Smart Telecom to the Customer (the "Commencement Date") and shall be for the Initial Minimum Period.
2.2. Upon expiry of the Initial Minimum Period, the Services will continue to be provided by Smart Telecom on the terms of this Agreement unless terminated in accordance with the termination provisions set out at Clause 14.

6. CANCELLATIONS BEFORE COMMENCEMENT

6.1. Without prejudice to the termination clause 14 and the following Clause 6.2, at any time prior to the Commencement Date, the Customer is entitled to cancel the Order for any reason whatsoever on prior written notice to Smart Telecom, without charge.

14. TERMINATION FOLLOWING COMMENCEMENT

14.1. Subject to the Consumer's right of cancellation under Clause 6.2, and subject to the following clauses 14.2 and 14.3, this Agreement is terminable by either party giving the other not less than 30 working days written notice.

And Finally

Please note, this is a conditional contract, which will only come into effect once your exchange is available to Smart Telecom, and your line test is successful.

When you accept this You have entered into a CPS contract with Smart Telecom. All Smart need to do it get their kit in your exchange and you are theirs for CPS unless you cancel beforehand .

Moriarty

They can have my first born if they get into my exchange

kaizersoze

I just put in my area code without my number & got this:

Broadband Check: Review Line Check Result
Unfortunately we have not yet allocated a date to when your exchange will be live. However, you can help us bring Smart Broadband to your community. The more interest we get from your area the sooner we will bring it on to our network, so spread the word!

What a pity! Still, I want to save money on my voice calls right away, so please contact me about becoming a Smart customer anyway.
I’m just interested in Smart Broadband. Please contact me once you support my exchange.
No thanks, I don’t want to proceed at this time.

Obviosly not a line check :rolleyes:

Moriarty

I suspect the line checks will only be run once equipment is physically in the exchange - they won't want to rely on eircoms notoriously poor test as it disqualifys a lot of lines that are actually completely capable of getting broadband. Until then, any check they have on their site will be purely to check if you're on an exchange they plan to use.

causal

[QUOTE=
http://www.smarttelecom.ie/products/broadband/step3.htm

.1. This Agreement shall commence on the date the Services and Equipment are provided by Smart Telecom to the Customer (the "Commencement Date") and shall be for the Initial Minimum Period.

6. CANCELLATIONS BEFORE COMMENCEMENT

6.1. Without prejudice to the termination clause 14 and the following Clause 6.2, at any time prior to the Commencement Date, the Customer is entitled to cancel the Order for any reason whatsoever on prior written notice to Smart Telecom, without charge.
[/QUOTE]

"Equipment", means the DSL modem and cable and/or any other service provider equipment, comprising of inter alia software and hardware provided as part of the Smart Broadband Service;

My reading of that (I ain't a lawyer) is that you can cancel for any reason at any time prior to them providing the 'Services and Equipment'.

It's self install (or you can pay for them to install):
So if you decide not to go ahead you could leave it as late as the guy coming to your door to give you the modem - and then just reject it.
That way the trigger for the "Agreement" is never fired.

causAl

spongebob

CPS does not require equipment !

OfflerCrocGod

Moriarty wrote:

They can have my first born if they get into my exchange

Bloody Right I don't care about changing my CPS.

snappieT

Looks like i'll be in before anyone else here:

Congratulations, Broadband is available to you! It will be available in March/April.

LLU inside two months is a bit unrealistic for a North Dublin suburb

daramullally

I get "Congratulations, Broadband is available to you! It will be available in July/August. Would you like to avail of this amazing offer? "

If I select the option to sign up today, I assume that the CPS transfer only happens if and when the broadband is available in my area. Is that the case?

Dara

Steve S

My line is also supposedly to be enabled in March/April. I'm off Clanbrassil Street.

Sparky

WezzyB wrote:

You can switch over as soon as you get your eircom account number, I took me about 2 weeks to get my account number when I signed up last year.

Getting a landline is free at the moment from eircom, if there is a line already into the house, I think this offer ends soon.

Thats Funny, I have had to pay €130 for my line last week, and i am still waiting for my account number, i rang up asking for it and a CS rep. said that the account has'nt been activated, even though i can make a receive calls, wierd,

WezzyB

snapscan1212p wrote:

Looks like i'll be in before anyone else here:


LLU inside two months is a bit unrealistic for a North Dublin suburb

I ordered before you! I got the same date for rollout, currently I'm connected to the Phibsborough exchange, hopefully they can deliver!


Sparky's_snips:
The free connection thing is only for people who have a line going in already and that it was previously cancelled, normally this re-connection fee is something around €30 and 1st time connections are €130, like what you paid.

eircomtribunal

Moriarty wrote:

I've been wondering about the free line rental thang and I have a theory.

Smart are probably using shared line unbundling for this. This will cost them €0.39/month/customer for access to the data segment of each line after comreg recently reduced the pricing for line share. Now.. for the line rental piece, they may be able to deactivate the voice segment of the line (there by no line rental owed to eircom) and port all voice traffic over a VOIP solution (since they'll have their own equipment in the exchanges). The end result being customers get free line rental and cheap broadband, while smart have very low overheads payable to eircom per customer.

I dunno, it's a possibility in any case.

The shared line rental price reduction to € 0.39 is only in consultation mode so far. (But Comreg seldom change what they propose in the consultation)

I think it is more than highly unlikely that the shared LLU could be used to provide for "naked" dsl for one, and additionally be used for VoIP. Eircom would then have to provide a line without getting any line rental (besides the € 0.39).

An interesting point to the many questions about line failure, line distance from exchange etc.:
While the incumbent has only to provide voice quality on the line - and not more, it is totally different with LLU: Here Eircom has to remove hindrances in the line on the request of the Local Loop Unbundler. (Well, there is a get-out clause mentioning technical feasibility or so, but the onus is on the incumbent to provide a clean line.) It would be easy for ComReg to strengthen this clause, if necessary. There are no excuses from a technical side not to upgrade practically all lines for broadband use.

While SMART will restrict its LLU roll-out to the most profitable and easy to service exchanges the effect is totally different to Eircom having done and still doing this. Eircom will, for the first time, have a serious competitor for a lot of customers. It will have to try and counteract, and will have to lower its prices and improve its speed, cap etc for all its broadband customers.

There could well be truth in what SMART's Oisin Fanning is quoted in ENN today:"We are shortly commencing delivery of higher speed, low cost residential broadband in an offering that will, I believe, revolutionise the Irish broadband market,"

P.

SeaSide

what he said

causal

eircomtribunal wrote:

There could well be truth in what SMART's Oisin Fanning is quoted in ENN today:"We are shortly commencing delivery of higher speed, low cost residential broadband in an offering that will, I believe, revolutionise the Irish broadband market,"

I certinaly hope so, it could be the shot in the arm the Irish BB market needs.
It'll certainly worry all the other providers - a competitive market is good for consumers.
Also, I'm sure the bidders for ntl are watching this with great interest too.

causAl

Raskolnikov

Wow, such an offering would definitely force IOL and Eircom into action.

TimTim

causal wrote:

This is weird:
I tried the two numbers from 2 different places in Dublin with Smart and Eircom:

A Blackrock number - passed for Eircom, failed for Smart.
A Knocklyon number - failed for Eircom, passed for Smart.

Huh, how can that be

causAl

Well I'm living in Knocklyon and last time I checked my number passed on Eircon's and just checking Smarts site my line passed there too. Maybe your just unlucky.

Chalk

passes for me , says it available now....

*packs up eircom trial kit....