Feedback thread for Radio Forum

Big Bag of Chips

This is a feedback thread for the radio forum. All feedback will be considered, but we ask everyone posting in this thread to be respectful.

• Please provide mature, constructive, civil feedback
• Abuse of volunteer moderators or other posters will not be tolerated
• Complaints against specific posters will not be entertained. Please use the report function

Please keep it civil and maybe we can help improve the radio forum.

odyssey06

Suggest implementing the same 50 post limit as on Current Affairs to deter the re-reg trolling plaguing the forum.

thesandeman

Posters who move from thread to thread just to have an ongoing niggle at each other and ruin it for the rest of us.

Obvious rereg trolls.

odyssey06

Moderators need to be aware of posters who start trolling a thread, trying to bait other posters in a deliberate attempt to get threads shut down. This tactic has been repeated several times on the forum to shut down threads critical of Ryan Tubridy.

This trolling was imo encouraged by previous moderation instructions warning that a thread will be shut down. That is short sighted.

Prompt moderation of such trolling is required. There have been times in past when moderation was very slow to respond and imo a factor in posters "taking the bait" and firing bacķ at trolling.

If posters have expectation of prompt moderation they are less likely to "feed the troll".

Big Bag of Chips

The radio forum has been undermoderated for a while now. Having to referee playground type slagging matches between adults (?) is very tiresome and, understandably, moderators lose the will.

A number of potentially good new moderators have been approached and declined the position. I have other suggestions that were sent to me previously. I have been busy offline recently and have not followed up on getting more moderators on board but this is something that will be looked at again in the coming weeks.

Peter Dragon

+1 on the above.

Shutting the Ryan Tubridy thread down is not the solution. It is I believe the main aim of the regular re-reg and a couple of other posters. I am also against “locking” a thread - even temporarily, as it encourages the trolls to continue in their attempts to have the thread locked or closed.

I have followed the request to report posts and nothing has happened. I have been accused of being at least 2 different posters (I am neither of these) by the recurrent re-reg and other posters and whilst some of those posts have removed some still remain despite being reported. I appreciate it is difficult to police everything but reported posts should be prioritised. This is one example. Other reported posts which cross the lines of personal abuse were reported and no action taken. Equally, there is at least one other poster who has been accused of being other posters and this poster likewise has reported those posts but uniform action and removal has not occurred.

Finally, I asked a question in the thread which has been removed but i would like to understand for clarity if the rules will be implemented equally in relation to the pro-Tubridy/NKM cohort as to those who hold a differing view of said people?

Thank you.

Glaceon

My opinion probably isn't a popular one but I'll give it anyway.

I feel like this forum goes way overboard with bullying of presenters and DJs. There's a group of posters (the Liveline thread is full of them) who hate a show, yet listen to it solely to bully the presenter or callers. Yet, anyone who says the opposite is accused of working for RTE or Noel Kelly.

Discussing the content of a show is perfectly fine, but making it overly personal is not. At this point, I avoid threads about shows and really only follow the bandscan thread or historical posts.

Peter Dragon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123118064#Comment_123118064

This “hate listening” term is folly. People do not have to like (in the traditional sense) a show or a presenter to tune in. I’ve only listened to Liveline a couple of time but my lord it is an aural car crash. The host had some shall we say “peculiarities”, and some of the contributors (often led by the host) are to use a Tubridy stock phrase “bonkers”. I can see why people would listen to it for “**** and giggles”. If people choose to listen for light relief that it their prerogative. I personally find the host difficult to listen to and the show a mixture of the mundane, bizarre, grotesque snd surreal so almost exclusively avoid it……but it’s not my not your place to tell others what they can and can’t listen to. I don’t understand why people watch Fair City either, but apparently it has an audience.

It is also not against the rules that you must “like” a show to comment on it. It would be a sad world if we could only comment positively on things. Indeed it’s tantamount to censorship to restrict a thread to positive-only comments. You’re not in favour of censorship are you?

The title of the Tubridy Thread is also far more encompassing than just his radio show, hence commentary on the London Diary etc. Indeed such is the paucity of commentary on weekdays on that thread the contributors could hardly be accused of hate-listening. Most recent commentary has been about the Diary (and its rudimentary language), his Instagram, and an issue with the RDS. It appears that no-one is listening, let alone hate-listening.

Regarding your comment of bullying, firstly I don’t believe it’s so. These are public figures who have either historically or are currently being remunerated by the taxpayer and are open to comments - positive and negative.

Secondly, if the clients of certain agents didn’t continually do and say things that opened them up to ridicule (like staging photographs, turning their Instagram/life into one long corporate shilling exercise, making out off touch proclamations and so on) then there would be little to criticise them for….save for their presenting skills, or lack thereof.

Glaceon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123118159#Comment_123118159

I never said you couldn't be critical of a show. But things like making fun of Joe Duffy's accent are ridiculous. I really don't like Sarah McInerney's bullish interview style but I don't listen to Drivetime just to whinge about it. I've much better things to do with my time.

Discuss the content. If that makes me in favour of censorship, then so be it.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123118313#Comment_123118313

It's a radio programme. The accent is part of the content delivery. Its a hallmark of the show.

Is boards going to ban 'hate watching' type comments on say the TV forum?

The suggestion would be absurd and would be a damning indictment on a site that cant handle such commentary about highly paid media figures in the public eye.

There has been a massive drop off in posts on the site since Vanilla move. Feels like even quieter due to recent page jumping bugs. But sure clamp down on a popular thread... that makes zero sense.

Big Bag of Chips

@Peter Dragon it has been said that the forum has been undermoderated for a while. So that is why reported posts might not have been actioned. This will be addressed and hopefully the forum will get back to a full compliment of active moderators.

Also this thread is not to be used by posters to take pot shots at each other.

It is also not to be used to criticise presenters or agents!

It is a feedback thread for the forum in general.

Please keep to the topic of proving constructive feedback or posters will pick up warnings and forum bans.

EmmetSpiceland

One thing that I, personally, think would help would be the enforcing of the forum charter concerning ‘going overboard with criticism of presenters and guests’. I, actually, think this could be worded a little better but even as is it could help.

The idea that, as some would imply, there is any pro-Tubridy “bias” in the Tubridy thread is, simply, risible. There are, pretty much, no pro-Tubridy posters left. Even calling them pro-Tubridy is a stretch, it’s just people who think the obsession with, and attacks on, the guy are way over the top.

That thread was, pretty much, hijacked recently enough by 1, maybe 2, posters who came out of nowhere and went on to dominate the thread and were able to dictate the tone. Anyone not agreeing was met with accusations of trolling, trying to get the thread locked, trying to censor, of attacking and run out.

This, then, led to bizarre “conspiracies” that posters were being paid, or were employed by Noel Kelly. The thread, also, became a place to attack anyone who was represented by his agency.

Maybe a general Tubridy thread could be set up in the “After Hours” forum? The one in here goes so far beyond his radio show, a show which no one seems to listen to, except by the ones who are going overboard with their criticisms.

Outside of that, maybe the ‘Off the Ball’ thread could be looked at? Gets incredibly misogynistic in there at times.

odyssey06

If mod capacity is in such short supply, then the current rules should be looked at to assess if essential eg

"going overboard with criticism of presenters and guests"

What would be the harm if it did? Is there some significant cohort of posters deterred from posting in eg the Liveline thread because it sometimes goes overboard with criticism? Dubious.

If you took out the criticisms from the Tubridy thread it would have very little content. Would that benefit the Radio forum? I dont see how but perhaps there is a back story to that rule in the charter which led to its introduction.

Moving it to another forum would likely see the same rereg trolling happen there instead. The Tubridy thread in CA was closed and unlike CA, After Hours doesnt have limits on who can post.

Peter Dragon

Thanking a vile and disgusting post from the recurrent re-reg should get a warning or a ban if replying to one gets a warning.

I was warned today for simply pointing out the irony of the re-reg describing 3 posters posting style as poisonous and including their usual slurs of being oddballs, depressed, loners etc. as well as calling one poster the c word. Some posters think it’s ok to thank these posts - this behaviour should be sanctioned.

Peter Dragon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123118428#Comment_123118428

+1 on the highly paid media figures comment - paid for from the public purse in most cases btw, be they historically or presently.

If we can’t discuss them, are for example the sports threads going to have a ban on discussing the manager of a sporting team on a bad run or a player who plays badly in a series of matches? Or will the political threads be closed because someone disagrees with a politician’s behaviour? It’s a frankly ridiculous suggestion.

TheBMG

there’s an overall tone of negativity and rage on many of the threads (usually featuring ‘celebs’ that makes it sound more like tattle.life than boards.ie.

Not suggesting that anyone has to be endlessly positive but there’s far more interesting conversations on the page that don’t go down that route; mainly because the mouth foamers aren’t interested in discussing the future of DAB in Ireland because they can’t bring up Ryan Tubridy.

Is there something to be said for moving some of the Tubbs/RTE ‘celeb’ stuff over to the showbiz pages? The regular posters on those threads only seem to use the radio forum for those particular topics.

Oscar_Madison

I don’t listen to Liveline and don’t contribute to that thread.

Here’s a few thoughts that may/may not help:

As a history lesson, my first memory of this Gogglebox style commentary on boards was for Big Brother back around 2008/9 I think - it was a way for people to comment as they watched and it worked well at the time - though some of the participants got a right basting along the way it has to be said. Maybe we went too far at times - it was in the spirit of what you’d say in your own siting room if watching with friends. But it was a great fun thread.

There was also regular posting nights for The UK Apprentice for the first couple of series- again posters didn’t hold back in their views on the participants 😀

The next significant active thread was the Late Late Show with Ryan Tubridy - I was quite active through the years on this thread. Ryan’s interview style was legendary appalling - and that’s what brought posters back week after week. Commentary was a mix of Ryan’s “style” and around the guests, mainly “celebrities” who tended to be wonderful and appalling in equal measure.

Ryan was also infamous for his misery slots- towards the end of his time on the show, every single interview started to feel like a misery slot😀

However there were some “unwritten” rules for the majority of the time I posted on TLLS threads- for the misery slots, vast majority of regular posters bowed out and said goodnight- there was no fun in commenting on an interview about someone’s cancer, or a bereavement or what not- and that wasn’t what we wanted the show to be - occasionally yes, but not every bloody week at 10.45pm. And we were there mainly to watch the show and post our thoughts and also to lambaste Ryan for his appalling interview technique or lack thereof- he was employed by public money and got a hell of a lot of it - it was our way of saying as tax payers and licence holders-this isn’t good enough.

If a few posters did comment disparagingly about say someone with cancer, the vast majority of the time, the “crowd” turned on that poster - moderation was also very good in the early days but really, the majority of posters stuck to the unwritten rules-for the late late toy show I rarely posted as did some others, as commenting on kids is just creepy.

My point is- TLLS threads tended to work, at least in the early years, because there was some restraint and sense of fairness shown- “ordinary” guests weren’t overly criticised- that was reserved for “celebrities” but especially those who just made a fool of themselves- and there were many of those. And of course Ryan’s interview technique - but comments rarely strayed into his personal life.

I think the tone of the liveline thread is probably more a free for all and probably reflects the early days of live thread posting for say the likes of Big Brother.

Maybe if some agreement can be reached around the tone and nature of comments it might help- the challenge of the Liveline show is that “guests” are usually just ordinary people- we didn’t tend to comment a whole lot on “ordinary” people on TLLS threads or at least there was a bunch of us who didn’t.

PS: I forgot The Brendan O’Connor show- a very popular thread because overall he, and his show were quality - so good in fact, RTÉ took it off the air possibly as it simply showed up just how bad Ryan was on TLLS / you could never have called the BOC thread toxic - it was good fun and just people commenting on the show and the guests

Peter Dragon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123119092#Comment_123119092

In my defence I have proposed a wider NK + Clients discussion thread.

I don’t think it’s helpful to use descriptors like “mouth foamers” btw.

Big Bag of Chips

Lads... It's very simple.

This isn't a bitching thread! Stop bitching. Make suggestions that might help the forum.

@EmmetSpiceland your post above for example, the first paragraph and last two paragraphs are feedback and suggestions. The whole middle of the post is bitching.

We recognise there is a problem in the forum. We also know most people posting there are negative and seem to need negativity and to criticise like they need oxygen. An endless thread of you all complaining about the others negativity is not helpful, and not something the moderators will be willing to trawl through to find legitimate feedback.

So can we draw a line now? This thread is for suggestions. Not commentary.

It's not so easy to find people to moderate the forum, and personally I can't say I blame anyone who has declined the position. There's not enough money you could pay someone to compensate for the hassle they are inevitably going to get as a moderator in this forum, never mind asking someone to volunteer their time.

A little bit of respect goes a long way, for each other, for the moderators and for the subject matter. Nobody is saying a presenter can't be criticised, but some of you see it as an Olympic sport!

EmmetSpiceland

I guess it comes down to this so, either active moderators are found who can delete the libellous, or dangerously obsessive, posts before they’re up for long, or you close the forum lest it become a major issue for the rest of the site.

It’s a complete waste of time to ask the posters who post in the forum to temper their posting styles because they have shown, repeatedly, that they won’t.

The posters who think they can post whatever they want about Ryan Tubridy, Joe Duffy, Noel Kelly, Lottie Ryan and Kathryn Thomas clearly believe that it’s an inalienable human right to slaughter them every chance they get, even/especially if it’s libellous. They are saying as such in this, very, feedback thread.

They won’t police themselves, and any posters who stood up to them have been bullied off the site or sitebanned for “trolling.”

Again, it is completely futile to ask a certain cohort of posters to play nice over and over again because they reply in turn, without fail, over and over again, “no.”

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Note: Please provide feedback on how to move the forum forward in a positive direction or don't post on this thread.

Big Bag of Chips

Thank you Emmet. As mentioned we are aware of the modding issues here and that is why we are now trying to tackle the forum.

Again, provide feedback, we all know what posters have been posting. As mentioned above that line is now drawn and doesn't need to be repeated here in this thread. Suggestions on what to do to move the forum forward are what we are looking for. Not post after post of telling us about the problems in the forum. We already know the problems.

Peter Dragon

Feedback works both ways.

If a poster can call out another for what he or she feels is excessive criticism, likewise posters can and should be called out for excessive or gushing praise.

We are talking about public figures here; figures who either historically or presently are remunerated by the taxpayer and - and this is important here - who constantly and openly court publicity either through puff pieces released by their agent or through their own Instagram, social media accounts, and many other avenues.

Also, who gets to decide if something is “dangerously obsessive”? I object in the strongest possible terms to the use of the term obsessive, let alone dangerously so. It has connotations medically that imply a mental illness and I believe is being used in a derogatory manner in this thread to describe a cohort of posters. I can assure you my mental health is sound, and I’m not obsessed with any of the protagonists. To attempt to tar me and others as variously unemployed, oddballs, loners, losers, and so on with this term should not be tolerated or allowed. As a taxpayer and a licence fee payer I am entitled to comment on those that benefit from my money. I am also entitled to question RTÉ and the agent involved over their parts in the scandal and the inconsistencies in things they have said. No-one in the public eye should be above such scrutiny.

If the term is going to be allowed then can I also for example say posters are obsessed with NKM/Tubridy et al. in a manner which implies irrational and compulsive adulation, and an underlying mental illness?

The very nature of the term is also completely subjective when it comes to opinion. What poster x deems excessive may be considered mild by poster y and so on - it should certainly not be decided by another poster.

Whatever the opinion on the public figure being discussed and their behaviour, posters should not engage in labelling other posters with such terms.

In summary, my feedback is this - such terms describing posters on either side of pro or anti cohort should be sanctionable by warning or a ban. As should any likes of the vile messages posted by the recurrent re-reg.

GerryTierney

I know new accounts are (rightfully) viewed with suspicion, but I went to login with my old account (2001 era poster here!) and can't remember the password. An Eir email address doesn't help either.

I was a daily contributor to the radio forum for very many years (hi, Declan A Walsh!), but will now visit the site about once a week for a quick read. Mostly for the bandscan thread. Let us not sugarcoat things, the radio forum was always one of the more troublesome forums on the site. It used to be extremely busy and abuse of presenters and guests always happened. It became very tiresome to read. Nasty cliques developed and any attempt at rationality or context was met with accusations you were a WUM or troll. A lot of good posters simply left.

People blame the move to vanilla for the decline, but in reality it started to happen around 2012. I think a lot of the magic on the site disappeared. After Hours was never really my cup of Joe, but it was a vibrant and often very funny forum. When you look at it now it seems to be made up mostly of threads about people you hate. Its a negative ethos that permeates the site. The radio forum is just the most extreme example of that.

Do I have any suggestions? I wouldn't be surprised if this gets deleted, but here's my two cents

• Outright abuse of presenters and guests should stop. We get it, you don't like them. It's tiresome for others to read and stops people from contributing. It's a jerk circle
• There are almost no WUMs or mild trolls left on the site. I always argued they added to the site. Echo chambers are boring. I don't think you can get them back now though. Most of them are probably 50 and working as accountants! Nasty re-reg abusive trolls were always a problem. Some lad or lassie taking a deliberately contrarian position for their own amusement was harmless.
• Maybe offer the abusive posters a private forum (are they still a thing) to do as much abusing as they want? Boards isn't part of the conversation when it comes to the Irish internet these days, but you do not want another MCD situation which would be the final nails in the coffin. I don't know if that would work, as I do think some of the thrill of it all is being able to say awful things so people can read it. Like grafitti tagging.
• Maybe just cull the most abusive posters? It worked to a certain extent in current affairs a few years back.

I wish the admins and moderators the best of luck in whatever they decide. As BBoC said, these folks are volunteers at the end of the day. It should be something they do because (most of the time) they enjoy it and feel part of the community.

TheBMG

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123119295#Comment_123119295

yeah fair point. I think it’s telling though that certain users are hyper focused on the likes of Tubbs/NKM and rarely contribute anything else to the radio forum. This is not a defence of NKM either.

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Warned: Off topic

odyssey06

Yes as noted above, the radio presenters expose themselves to ridicule with their antics, both on the air and in courting publicity and attention in the media and social media.

We have posters having the craic ridiculing objectively ridiculous conduct.
Posters actually posting in the forum, not looking down their noses at it.

What is the benefit to shutting that down?
Who is going to replace that engagement?

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Warned: There have been numerous on thread instructions. Provide constructive feedback on ways to move the forum forward or don't post.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123119865#Comment_123119865

Nobody was sitebanned for trolling simply because they disagreed with the majority, that is completely disingenuous.

We are aware there is a persistent problem with low level trolling, but rest assured, that will be dealt with.

I haven't seen any posts in this thread calling for defamatory comments to be allowed, posters are simply asking for criticism of radio presenters' performance to be part of the discussion.

EmmetSpiceland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123120335#Comment_123120335

So, if everything is fine and posters were just putting up, mild, criticisms then why is this thread even here and what was Mike on about?

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Warned: Last chance on this thread.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123121306#Comment_123121306

I think you might have misread my post, I didn't say there wasn't a problem.

No one said any of this in this thread as you claimed:

The posters who think they can post whatever they want about Ryan Tubridy, Joe Duffy, Noel Kelly, Lottie Ryan and Kathryn Thomas clearly believe that it’s an inalienable human right to slaughter them every chance they get, even/especially if it’s libellous. They are saying as such in this, very, feedback thread.

And I'm certainly not aware of the following ever having happened:

They won’t police themselves, and any posters who stood up to them have been bullied off the site or sitebanned for “trolling.”

If anyone was banned for trolling they were probably trolling, but that wouldn't be generally known, so I'm unsure how you can claim this.

Big Bag of Chips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123120056#Comment_123120056

Moderators decide the rules of the forum, and moderators decide what posts require action.

Peter Dragon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123121971#Comment_123121971

I know that. You did ask for feedback and I’ve highlighted my suggestions for same.

I’m not quite sure what I’ve done wrong here?

TheBMG

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123121982#Comment_123121982

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123120145#Comment_123120145

I was apologising but yeah ok.