2024 Irish EV Sales

djan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122080913#Comment_122080913

Looking at the numbers and going off your calculations I'd argue you are just proving my point that the infrastructure is lacking and will need a massive upgrade across the board all the way to last mile street/house connections.

While renewables are great and all, they are not reliable when compared to fossil or nuclear electric plants. There are nearly 2.5 million cars in Ireland at an average age of 9 years. You mention of potential to add capacity to get up to 200,000 EVs while not accounting for increase in demand for electricity in critical periods of winter cold temperatures and our push to heat pumps. The system may work for the time being but if the push to EV's really gains traction we will be screwed unless its a really sunny and windy day.

It's a lot easier to buy an EV than plan, develop and build electricity infrastructure and alternate sources as the latter take years if not decades to do.

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122081427#Comment_122081427

Its like a BMW driver asking for VRT to be increased on everything except BMWs. He thinks its a great idea.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122081327#Comment_122081327

The market here isn't underperforming due a lack of plug and charge.

The manufacturers failings around issues of supply chain of parts, repairability warranty, software do feed the fud and consumer confidence though.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122081697#Comment_122081697

Well it depends if they (the powers that be) want to encourage people to change to BMWs or not.

It's not BMW drivers wanting change.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122081611#Comment_122081611

I'm not sure how you read what was posted, that you quoted, and then come to the conclusion there's some sort of immediate crisis with the infrastructure.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122081697#Comment_122081697

A BMW driver asking for a tax on using indicators. He thinks it's a great idea

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122082293#Comment_122082293

certainly isn't letting facts get in the way of his hypothetical argument

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122081461#Comment_122081461

Plug and Charge already works in Europe on BMW/MINI, VAG, Mercedes and Ford vehicles. Hyundai have started it with the Ioniq 6.

Which models and which networks? Just Ionity?

Tesla supports it on SuC, obviously, but it's not ISO15188 AFAIK.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122081805#Comment_122081805

The market here isn't underperforming due a lack of plug and charge.

I didn't say that. I said the only thing manufacturers could do to increase uptake is implementing plug and charge, it should be the default.

The manufacturers failings around issues of supply chain of parts, repairability warranty, software do feed the fud and consumer confidence though.

Strong disagree. None of this influences uptake significantly. Most people don't care about software quality. Warranty is already standard 7/8 years. Repairability is perfectly fine. The supply chain of parts isn't different from ICE, less parts are needed.

It's all about gov policy, and in derivation also affordability. Affordability is also strongly influenced by policy until price parity is reached.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122084740#Comment_122084740

People hear about those bugs, lack of parts, repairability, fud feeds of it. That's effects consumer confidence and thus sales.

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122084706#Comment_122084706

As far as I know Ionity is the only network currently supporting Plug&Charge in Ireland. ESB have limited support for AutoCharge but that isn't compatible with VAG vehicles as it's based on the charge controller identifier which isn't guaranteed to be unique per vehicle.

Tesla's propriety system for vehicle identification on superchargers isn't Plug&Charge, and I'm not aware of any moves to support the standard on the supercharger network. I'd love for Tesla to operate as an eMSP and allow me to use Plug&Charge networks on my Model Y.

It's not as simple as listing models as it can also depend on software versions, it's something you should check with the manufacturer, but the ones I listed all have current cars for sale that support the standard.

sk8board

no major changes in EV sales Year to date with April included:

Jan-Apr

Pure BEV sales were -41% in April vs April 2023, (1000 v 1800).

heres BEV sales year on year, Jan-Apr:

The Seal, MG4 and M3 the biggest gainers in 2024 to date.

MightyMunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122085652#Comment_122085652

Will be interesting to see how the ID4 sales do when the new model arrives in a few months. If there's a bounce it could drag the whole EV sector back close to 2023s record levels.

2024 is 20% above 2022 levels, on track for the 2nd best year ever for BEV sales in Ireland

sk8board

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122085731#Comment_122085731

it’s hard to know. Like all data, it can be interpreted in many ways. There is a clear “deceleration in the rate of acceleration”, as the economists would say :)

7 of every 8 buyers are choosing something else - and if you exclude fleet and company EVs from the numbers (where BIK is a huge factor in the attractiveness of EVs), the reality is that the proportion of fully private sales that are BEV is considerably lower still.

The future is electric, that’s actually beyond argument at this point - but clearly the amount of the national fleet that will be electric is going to be lower than expected and EU policy will have to adapt to that, as will manufacturers and infrastructure.

Are we unique in the EU with this drop in EV marketshare?

MrMusician18

The collapse in sales is going to do strange things to the used market going forward. Assuming people who buy EVs that are 2 years old want to stay in an EV, they are going to be chasing a shrinking pool of cars. Maybe we will see newer cars stabilise in price while older cars struggle to find their third owners.

tom1ie

personally I reckon I’ll get another year- two max out of my 2011 insignia, and then I’ll be in the market for a replacement second hand car.
I regularly do 350kms- 400kms round trip journeys a couple of times a week.

My budget would be about 15k max.

There are plenty of ICE motorway cruisers that would tick all the boxes, but there are very few EV cars that would be capable of this for this budget.

IMO this is the big problem with mass EV adoption.

DrPsychia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122085939#Comment_122085939

Some examples here

Germany: -15.2% Q1 2024 compared to same period 2023 Source
Sweden: -21.46% Q1 2024 compared to same period 2023 Source
Austria: -3.94% Q1 2024 compared to same period 2023 Source

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086200#Comment_122086200

I disagree, and would argue that we've now moved to the next phase, where now any use case can be catered for by the new market, and only the used market has limited options.

sh81722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086200#Comment_122086200

For users like you who do 35000-40000 km a year on road trips alone moving to an EV may still be a while away in the price range you list.

Do you do other shorter trips also or is it just these long trips? Your 2011 Insignia must have something like 500000 plus kilometres now and another 100k in couple of years. Respect!

ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086200#Comment_122086200

Have you thought about fuel savings? Look at it this way. If you were doing 700 to 800km per week you'd save somewhere around €3k per year at current fuel prices. This is based on driving a 2022 or newer Tesla Model 3 (RWD), charging it at night (my night tariff is 18 cents). It would require a 10 minute stop at a SUC on the return trip. Over 4 years that's a €12k saving based on today's prices. The saving will likely be even greater given the current price trajectory of fossil fuel.

The EV would only need a service every two years (sub €200) regardless of mileage whereas the ICE would need to be serviced twice a year at €250 a pop.

Road tax is €120 for the EV versus multiples more for the ICE.

A 2022 M3 can be picked up for circa 30k (perhaps less) and although outside your budget with the above savings taken into account it's certainly something to think about.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086364#Comment_122086364

Fair enough but show me an example of an EV that can tick the boxes in the depths of winter at motorway speeds, and if you can I would genuinely consider it.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086367#Comment_122086367

Insignia has 330k kms on it but I haven’t had it from new.
I would do shorter trips also that an EV would be grand for.
I would be able to get an EV charger at the house but I wouldn’t have destination charging nearly all the time as the destinations are mostly rural sites.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086388#Comment_122086388

The Tesla costing 30k is twice my budget and would require a loan which would cost circa 650pm to repay.
The repayments would wipe out the fuel savings.
Budget is 15k unfortunately.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086390#Comment_122086390

For your budget? None. That's why I said none of the used market would do.

New, there are plenty. My own car, a model 3 LFP has 300km of motorway range - I know as I have a 250km round trip on the motorway most weekends. They are just under 30k for the earliest used ones and just under 40k new.(the new one has 10% more range too).

If you're doing high miles and write the car off to zero value, buying the model 3 would be cheaper than paying for fuel and 15k upfront cost, on a non EV.

Now, if you just dont want an EV, that's fair enough and I respect that! (I have a couple of non EVs too!)

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086429#Comment_122086429

Ah grand I thought you were saying you disagree with me as there were examples of what I’m looking for.
Apologies.

ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086406#Comment_122086406

Well it depends on whether the existing 15k you have is borrowed or not. Assuming not then borrowing the other 15k from the credit union over 4 years will cost €366 (8.25% APR 🤕) per month, less with AIB green loan.

1200km a week is what I do sometimes which would cost me circa €50 (85% home charging). I currently shell out close to €140 on fuel.

As soon as I'm able to I'll be jumping into a 2022 M3.

FTR...these are my workings based on my usage, tariff, car etc...

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086390#Comment_122086390

I'd say the Hyundai Kona 64kWh would come close and there are a few on sale right now around your budget.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086475#Comment_122086475

In the depths of winter at motorway speeds though? (120kph)

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122085141#Comment_122085141

I don't know what the FUD people hear, probably they hear FUD😀 I'm not aware of any issues with parts…

Manufacturers can't do much to increase uptake apart from getting more efficient and competitive. But they are let's say lukewarm. There are exceptions like Volvo or JLR that are going full electric but those are small or niche brands.

Why are China and Norway so successful in EV uptake? Because of gov policy not because of manufacturers doing a or b.

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086600#Comment_122086600

A 350k to 400k round trip would be pushing it, but it's hardly the end of the world to pull in for a fifteen minute splash and dash on the way home.