Life passing by people in their 30s

Sunny Disposition

Construction is way safer that it was 40 years ago, there used to be some very dangerous sites. It has changed hugely though.

Whether it's healthier than an office job is somewhat more complex. It definitely provides you with a lot more exercise, and gets you out of doors, and the hours are quite regular. The other side is heavier work can take a toll on the body as you get into the 50s. Of course there are a lot of issues like depression and stress with the office work.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289644#Comment_121289644

How many courses in DIY have you done? Surely there are night courses and short ones available where you could learn if you don't currently have the ability to do these handymen jobs yourself? Given your description of your great work-life balance then surely you would find time to do it?

Only last night I was checking out whether there were any night courses in welding or metal fabrication near me. Not because I want to work in that area but because I have occasion when I need to do those things and would like to be a bit better at it. I wouldn't have time to do them for a year or more but they are on my list.

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289683#Comment_121289683

Wheres the irony?

Do you think because I've a good career outside a trade that its ironic I'm saying a trade is a good career choice?

That might be ironic if nobody in a trade had good careers. But we both know that's not true. I know three people better off than me and they're trades people.

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289704#Comment_121289704

Yeah I'm pretty handy at DIY amd I've a few mates who are trades people who give me advice if I need it.

No idea what any of that hast to dowoth your previous posts.

But gowan, enjoy your night.

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289677#Comment_121289677

Why don't the government remove supports then? They aren't providing supports for charitable reasons. Landlords (I am not one) do not rent their properties out for free. The government has an obligation to house people who cannot house themselves (through HAP or social housing). There isn't an obligation on landlords to provide the housing for free.

If you removed the supports, rents for those who could pay would drop. The people who couldn't pay wouldn't be renting, they would be in emergency hotel accommodation or something.

It makes no difference to me if government removes the supports, I would prefer to see property prices reduce in fact.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289719#Comment_121289719

The irony is in you saying that you would be happy to be currently doing a trade. Not only that, you exhort the benefits of being able to do jobs around the house etc. It is a great carer, but when put to you, you don't want to do it because you already have a great career.

Admittedly, the video of the roundup guy is a bit facetious, but the underlying premise is similar - it's fine for others, and I will tell you I would definitely do it, but pour it into a glass in front of me and I'll quickly do an about-180-turn

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289729#Comment_121289729

So where is this magic additional DIY benefit you would have gotten if you had done a trade?

Turns out you didn't need it after all.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289699#Comment_121289699

Here in the UK, it costs well over fifty grand for a three-year degree so the appeal of trades may be stronger here. I'm not sure how it is in Ireland but I can see the advantages here. There's good reasons to eschew trades just as there is to avoid running up nearly a hundred grand worth of debt for a degree. Everyone's different but it would probably be a good idea to highlight to children as an alternative path.

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289738#Comment_121289738

You don't understand irony at all.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289734#Comment_121289734

I think they should remove them. Obviously they can't - in any practical sense - just remove them on Monday. But the system should not be built around pouring money into the private sector and outbidding private buyers and renters using a "bottomless" public purse. (Bottomless in that it isn't coming out of the pockets of the people signing off on it so they act like it is)

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289743#Comment_121289743

Me doing a bit if DIY and rewiring/replumbing my house are very different.

I can't cert my Gas/Electrics even if was stupid enough to attempt it.

You're clearly lost.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289749#Comment_121289749

There are many types of irony. I understand them and I didn't even do an Arts degree. Perhaps it might have helped you to have done one after all.............

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289754#Comment_121289754

Do you not know that there are different trades? Or are you advocating that people get multiple qualifications so that they can do all their own DIY?

How often does your own house need rewiring and replumbing? Would it really be worth doing both trades so that you can do both yourself? Hardly.

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289752#Comment_121289752

So, what you were saying around pouring money into landlords/property owners pockets was nonsense. The state is paying for a service. There is nothing stopping them from building property themselves. I think it is perverse that they are competing with 1st time buyers to house people who have never contributed anything. I am not sure if the state getting directly involved with building will increase the supply in any way, it doesn't have a great reputation for delivering services.

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289768#Comment_121289768

I was talking about renovating the shell I bought... Anyway.

I don't even know what point you're trying to make. Do you not think trades are a good career?

Do you think society can survive without them? I'd put them in the same bracket as healthworkers tbh. Absolutely vital to functioning societies.

Potatoeman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288689#Comment_121288689

I got the renting is dead money thing too, I came out of college as the arse fell out of the tech industry and the boom was kicking off. It’s hard to listen to people that got a handy number by sheer timing and luck.

Now your parents calling renting dead money is a way to motivate you to get a property. I got that too and it’s hard to hear when prices are jumping 10k a week. The thing is most people don’t save. You are supposed to save 10% of everything you make but let’s be honest most of us don’t. I cut everything down for two years to save a deposit, got into fitness and maybe had a few cheap cans at the weekend to get my deposit during the crash.

You can easily call your parents out for buying a cheap council house that is not an option for you too. Just keep in mind these criticisms are to motivate you. I got the fear when I was in a house share renting and one of the guys was 50. That gives you perspective of where you do not want to be. That’s where the renting is dead money comes from, I rented for fifteen years. It was a waste as I wasn’t going to live abroad and if you do make sure you have an exit plan with savings. What will you do if rents double over there? Are you willing to settle over there, what happens if you get a partner and a child then break up? There are many potholes to that too. I know people that moved abroad in their twenties only to comeback in their thirties with not much saved and friends moved on and settled so that’s not all roses. What will happen if you have a major illness abroad too? You really need to think things through. There is no shame in living at home to save for a deposit and don’t rule out an apartment, you can pay the mortgage off quickly and then buy a holiday home that is remote and have the best of both worlds too.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289551#Comment_121289551

You’ve just proved what I’ve said previously - travel aimlessly for years not great - travel with purpose and grow you’re skills whilst travelling - much wiser

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289799#Comment_121289799

I don't know why you can't understand all of the bits together when you appear to be able to understand each one in isolation

1) Billions of public money pumped into the market. This results in higher rents and property values

2) If those billions were removed, then rents would decrease and property values would decrease

3) Rents are paid to landlords. So if rents were lower then landlords would receive less money

Where do you think that the billions in HAP etc end up if you don't think it ends up in landlords pockets?

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289874#Comment_121289874

Removing the subsidy reduces demand, which results in reduced property prices and reduced rents, yes, of course. The only problem now is that those in receipt of the subsidies currently are living where?

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289873#Comment_121289873

I think you are conflating someone going abroad on foot of a job offer (which I did myself) with those emigrating because they had no opportunities here and had to land in the likes of Australia or Canada and trying to build themselves up from a base of zero. And your line of thinking encompasses a massive survivorship bias

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289894#Comment_121289894

If there were no subsidies in the morning, there would still be the same amount of existing houses.

People argue that higher prices mean more incentive to build etc. But that doesn't really follow though. There is quite a large elasticity. A high proportion of higher prices for new builds just flow back into higher land values and into speculators.

It's quite simple - if a builder needs, for arguments sake, 200k to build a unit to cover his costs and margin, and I have a site that will hold 5 units, but I know that he can sell those units for 400k each, then I'm going to be referencing 1m for me for the land. If the value of those units goes up to 500k each, I'm going to be referencing 1.5m for the land. Why wouldn't I? I own the land. Nobody can build on it unless I sell it to them.

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289923#Comment_121289923

There would still be the same amount of houses but demand would be reduces because those relying on HAP to house themselves would not be in the market anymore. So, those able to afford the current rent-30% or whatever would be paying less. Those who relied on HAP would be homeless I guess?

There are a lot of components to the cost of housing, with land being one of them. Others would be the various levies the state adds, the labour cost of workers in low supply etc.

BrianD3

Trades are a great option for people (i.e. most of us) who don't have the CAO points to pursue one of the top professions with high barriers to entry i.e Medicine, Dentistry etc. Compared to lower end professional, admin and bullsh*t jobs/degrees, trades have many advantages. Sectoral agreements and statutory minimum rates of pay for employees (currently 21.49 per hour) get paid for hours worked and overtime, get paid a small wage while training, work available in every part of the country, great potential for self employment and making €€€€€€, can choose to emigrate and follow construction booms around the world., learn practical skills that allow you to DIY jobs in your own house instead of handing over after tax income to someone else.

A 20 something arts or science graduate who "travels" to Australia to fart around "finding themselves" disadvantages themselves when it comes to their career and acquiring capital. While a 20 something tradesman who goes to the same place can easily come back considerably richer than when he left.

The disadvantage of trades is of course when recessions hit but even when the massive bust happened here, IME good tradesmen and tradesmen who were not very dependent on new house building were not out of work. I heard complaints from some about how they were "down to only 600 a week" while also complaining about "fcukin public servants and their pensions". A few years later, everything was rosy again and I shudder to think how much some of them are earning now. The lad who services my boiler doesn't charge me much by tradesman standards yet can afford to only work from October to February and seems to be very prosperous. People who are renting and have the landlord pay tradesmen when problems arise often don't have a clue how much it costs or how much in demand these lads are. I had to laugh at a thread here last year when clowns said they would refuse to engage a tradesman if he expressed racist views in their house - yeah and that principled stand won't last long when you are sitting in a freezing house with water pissing out of the boiler.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289895#Comment_121289895

I think you’re over thinking what I said- I was essentially referring to the modern desire for most students to spend time travelling post college - some “travelled” and did little else- some travelled and developed their new careers at the same time - they’re the ones who gave themselves a significant advantage over others

seamusk84

But then in that case: what exactly will there be for us re jobs?

Are we going to get to a point in the future where there will essentially be no jobs?

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289628#Comment_121289628

Rent caos and everything that followed directly led to the cost of rents and the price of property we have now.

Ignore it at your peril. Sure they have been ignoring it since they brough in rent caps. And they have reaped what they sowed. Its not like there wasnt plenty of evidence of the effects of rent caps to look at to see how bad an idea it was. But the turkeys voted and now it Christmas.

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289719#Comment_121289719

All of my friends who did trades are better off than me. They are better off than all of our friends who didnt do trades actually.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289361#Comment_121289361

It's not 3rd level degrees, it's useless and pointless 3rd level degrees.

Agree on trades.

Former Former Former

The growing consensus is that young people are less likely to see the value in putting in hard graft at a job than before.

I'm not sure that is compatible with getting up at 6am, six days a week to work in a trade.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121290858#Comment_121290858

It isn't for many and I agree. Your employer doesn't care about you so why should you break yourself for them? Time is the most precious resource we have and wasting it is tragic IMO.