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Rugby world cup post mortem

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    #362
    Vinnie222
    Registered Users Posts: 905 ✭✭✭Vinnie222


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245358#Comment_121245358

    Difference is Sexton had a clause in his contract to be released for Irish training .Zebo hadn't



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    #363
    Lost Ormond
    Registered Users Posts: 3,885 ✭✭✭Lost Ormond


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245665#Comment_121245665

    We are getting more players at underage and more options

    What change would you suggest be made at underage level?

    What would you do at provinces to help those who might slip through the system?



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    #364
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245528#Comment_121245528

    Yes, we will find out now at last.

    Johnny got his last hurrah with the full 80 minutes, but at what cost one wonders? We’ll never find that out.



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    #365
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245695#Comment_121245695

    That was the only difference was it? I’m sure something like that could have been arranged with Zebo but he wasn’t Johnny.



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    #366
    Vinnie222
    Registered Users Posts: 905 ✭✭✭Vinnie222


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245782#Comment_121245782

    Like what ? If a player is not going to be released from his club to train for the national side, you hardly expect him to represent his country .



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    #367
    OldRio
    Registered Users Posts: 5,985 ✭✭✭OldRio


    Good God. Did Sexton run over your dog?

    We get it. You don't like him.



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    #368
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245832#Comment_121245832

    That wasn't the reasoning though. The IRFU policy was to not select any player who took a contract from a French club or any club outside of the 4 Irish provinces. With the notable exception of Johnny Sexton of course. You're shifting the goalposts here.



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    #369
    MattressRick
    Registered Users Posts: 758 ✭✭✭MattressRick


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121244070#Comment_121244070

    I didn't say New Zealand or South Africa don't try to win matches between world cups.

    I said we pour more into those autumn internationals than they do. It's been shown back over the last ten or so years where we've never chosen a few players for experimental purposes, it only happens in the easier match against the likes of Fiji for example.

    We celebrate those wins like we've won a trophy. The World Cup should be the focus, blood players in massive matches like those autumn internationals and big six nations matches.



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    #370
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245528#Comment_121245528

    By the way your comments re Crowley and how it "fell apart" late on v Scotland are highly disingenuous. There were a load of substitutions made which meant Scotland ran in a couple of score when the game was over. Johnny is gone (not before his time) you can stop fighting on his behalf now.



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    #371
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245843#Comment_121245843

    No, he was just left on for the full 80 minutes while out on his feet. He got his last hurrah but we're out.



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    #372
    mascher8933
    Registered Users Posts: 14 ✭mascher8933


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245885#Comment_121245885

    Its kind of sad, how much hate you are trying to throw on Sexton.


    It seems that you are the lone wolf on this and rightly so



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    #373
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245919#Comment_121245919

    Silly comment. I don't hate him and he had a great career, I just think he was left in place too long and along with other factors I think it cost the team in a very close game the other night.



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    #374
    mascher8933
    Registered Users Posts: 14 ✭mascher8933


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245939#Comment_121245939

    You were attacking his time in France and the treatment he got too, you are not just going on about last nights game.

    The last few minutes needed experience and the coaches made that call. Crowley was poor when he came on against Scotland. The majority would have taken Sexton for those last few minutes.



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    #375
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,418 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245358#Comment_121245358

    It wasn't about Sexton. Hmmm, Farrell says to himself " Sexton is 38, I must select him, despite numerous other 10's being vastly better. It's about the other 10's, who couldn't get past Sexton.

    Sexton would still be the best out half if he didn't retire.



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    #376
    ironingbored
    Registered Users Posts: 2,107 ✭✭✭ironingbored


    We really needed a ferocious start (like France last night) to lay down a marker.

    In all three games last year in NZ, we got off to a flyer. Had we scored a try inside the first 5 mins after tearing into them, then psychologically we'd have won half the battle. Hopefully, NZ players going "here we go again!". Instead, we ambled into the game and let them build up a 13 point lead. Was this down to fatigue, gameplan, NZ aggression.

    In 2019, the gap was 32 points at the end with a 34-0 score line until we scored a try in the 69'.

    In 2023, a 4 point gap having come back from the dead twice and the width of a hand which would have put us 3 pts up with 6 mins to play.

    Can't understand why we didn't maul a few more metres to make sure of the grounding.

    Who knows in 2027. With the domestic game in NZ/AUS struggling financially and RSA less invested in TRC, remains to be seen how many more world class NZ will be able to produce.

    People dismissing the 6 Nations must have short memories. We have 4 Grand Slams in 140 years! There was a time where a win (home or away) against France wasn't even contemplated as a possibility. I had posters of the '82 and '85 Triple Crown on my bedroom wall.



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    #377
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,498 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245528#Comment_121245528

    Crowley was perfectly fine when he came on vs Scotland. (He setup a try with a perfect kick). The game was over.



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    #378
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245962#Comment_121245962

    I disagree. Not recently he isn't. Crowley should have been number 1 out half in my view with Sexton backing him up perhaps.



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    #379
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245957#Comment_121245957

    Yes I agree, as I said earlier he could have been very useful with his experience coming on late in games when he was fresh. Like the way Conor Murray was used.



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    #380
    mascher8933
    Registered Users Posts: 14 ✭mascher8933


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245999#Comment_121245999

    Seriously??



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    #381
    mascher8933
    Registered Users Posts: 14 ✭mascher8933


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121246011#Comment_121246011

    Very different with the situation with Murray, Murray was second choice behind a player who has been better than him.


    Not the case with Sexton.



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    #382
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 68,129 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245980#Comment_121245980

    I think France might regret that 'ferocious' start.

    I think they had the tools to take SA apart if they hadn't decided on a free chaotic start. And I think it was them who set the tone of the game.

    They thought they would blow SA away and it bombed on them.



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    #383
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121246129#Comment_121246129

    I disagree. I think over the last few years Sexton like Murray should have been cast in a supportive role, or certainly it should have been the case that others (like Crowley) were promoted more so that there wasn't the same reliance on Sexton as there had been in previous years when he was younger.



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    #384
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121246120#Comment_121246120

    Yeah. They're going to have to replace Sexton now anyway, I think that should have been done on a more phased basis over the last few years.



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    #385
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,261 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245079#Comment_121245079

    The SH proposal wouldn't have killed the Six Nations. It would have opened it up so that nations like Georgia get a shot from time to time, and jeopardy is introduced for the larger nations to avoid relegation. This is healthy and necessary for the growth of the game (a similar concept would be introduced to the SH Championship). Traditional dates and the Lions tour would have been maintained. You have pitched this in an entirely disingenuous fashion - that the SH are the ones running from change, when it is them bringing potential solutions to the table that are rejected out of fear by Unions like Scotland.

    As for a single rule example or saying 'everyone should play the same season' - well weather is weather lad. The seasons (weather) alternate so the seasons (rugby) need to also. But give over telling me this is a reason the World Cup is unfair. Ireland had their holidays and preseason and were together as a group preparing for a couple of months leading up to Saturday. They kept winning and had beaten South Africa so the idea we are not on a level playing field due to the time of a year is a nonsense. They are just better than us when it counts, the SH / NH record across the history of the tournament speaks to that.



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    #386
    conquestscarer
    Registered Users Posts: 161 ✭✭conquestscarer


    Blaming Sexton is comical, clueless even. Not a single criticism of his game other than his age. The fact of the matter is we didn't speed up ruck ball the other night, our 8 forwards didn't do their job at ruck time and we had painfully slow ball. I'd be point at Van Der Flier and O'Mahony rather then Sexton because they got dominated in their matchups IMO.

    The suggestion that Prendergast should be Leinster's first choice outhalf this season is also silly. I'm his biggest fan as a player but he has to physically develop a good bit before he starts big games, need to be patient with him and build him up gently. He is pretty clearly 3rd choice at Leinster at the moment, thats a huge leap from last year where he was 6th choice. It also means he will get a good bit of gametime this season which he can learn and develop from. If he manages to push himself of either of the Byrnes this season fair play but I think some patience is needed. The amount of criticism the guy got when our u20s were smashed was ridiculous.



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    #387
    Trampas
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭Trampas


    Will France think this World Cup was a failure? Will South Africa, England, New Zealand or Argentina treat it as a failure to the 3 who don’t win?

    Farrell expecting he can win a World Cup starting mid 30’s year players every game will rarely work. Some bodies will not recovery fully in time for the next game. You need a squad and just didn’t seem we had the trust in the squad to change the starting line up to make sure players starting were fully ready to battle. That’s on Farrell and his team. Maybe just looking at the next game instead of World Cup was the reason not having that squad where he could pick a different team if needed be. Any on the borderline to make it next time I’d be having them as back up players and not starters. Need to start it now not months out



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    #388
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121246393#Comment_121246393

    I don’t think anyone blamed Sexton solely for exiting the competition. A factor in us going out that he was struggling and not replaced is what some would suggest but don’t let that stop you using the usual gaslighting (suggesting others have said something in a way they actually didn’t) tactic when arguing with something you disagree with. It undermines any other points you make.



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    #389
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 10,133 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245980#Comment_121245980

    I was very surprised that Kelleher broke off, after forcing them into giving away a penalty try the previous maul, they ought to have been staying tight and forcing the call. Thought it was a banker initially, as they were moving well towards the line



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    #390
    raclle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,360 ✭✭✭raclle


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121246886#Comment_121246886

    Just before the break off it looked like Sexton had his arm out to go wide.



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    #391
    Murph85
    Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121244913#Comment_121244913

    Its interesting. It certainly wasn't a typical bottle job, down 13 points after 20 minutes and then roll over...

    Would be very interesting for those in the camp, who have far more insight... like what the hell is uo with the scrum ? Loyalty to players, at rugby and soccer here , is there too much loyalty? Does it result in laziness at times from the first choice ?



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