Immigration to Ireland - policies, challenges, and solutions *Read OP before posting*

Faugheen

The problem with discussions like this is that so many look at it from a black and white perspective, when the issues around it are far more complex than that.

For example, 'safe' countries. In the eyes of many on here, if the country is not at war then you shouldn't be claiming asylum. That is just wrong. There are many reasons that some asylum seekers don't feel safe in such countries.

The passport and travel documents one has dozens of layers to it. Vulnerable people being given false documents with the earth, moon and stars being promised to them, some people leaving their country because it's a crime for them to just be who they are. In this case, there isn't a hope in hell I would bring any identification because why would I trust any government when my own one have shown that they just want to make me a criminal for, say, being gay? Many people are only used to seeing some of the corrupt regimes in their native countries and believe this is what it's like everywhere. If I had that mindset, there's no way I'd have anything that identified who I was.

On the above, is everyone destroying their documents in this category? Absolutely not. It's very naive to think that there aren't some people who are chancing their arm. Likewise it's equally naive to think everyone is chancing their arm.

Finally, social cohesion. Again, not black and white. These are people coming from different cultures and under various regimes (some backwards, some barbaric). It's going to take time for them to adapt. However, anyone trotting out the 'social cohesion' line who is also in favour of those protests outside of asylum centres is a hypocrite. How can you claim social cohesion is a problem and then be in favour of allowing migrants to see a group of people outside their accommodation telling them to get out and blocking deliveries of bed linen and food? Why would anyone feel welcome when that's what they're subjected to through no fault of their own?

I honestly don't know what the solution is. It's clear the pressure on the services will only get worse however, at full employment, we'd be biting off our noses to spite our faces if we just closed up borders because 'Ireland is full' (it's not, but that's another debate).

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667781#Comment_120667781

What? I have no idea what you're trying to ask here. Someone said you cannot get on a plane without a passport, I said I did last Monday, got on a plane in Heathrow, did not show a passport until I got to immigration control at Dublin airport.

Not sure what all the rest of the post is for?

I'm not sure what the relevance where I was born is for?

sonar44

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667455#Comment_120667455

As there's no war in the UK, that's obviously not a valid place to arrive from to claim asylum.

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667823#Comment_120667823

As I've pointed out, the country doesn't need to be at war for someone to claim asylum.

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667685#Comment_120667685

Just tell them ya lost it and say ya want a free house and money. Be grand. In all seriousness controls need to be in place

sonar44

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667842#Comment_120667842

When is the last time someone had an asylum claim upheld for any reason that originated in the UK?

JP Liz V1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667293#Comment_120667293

If you are fleeing torture and persecution wouldn't you settle, seek asylum in the first country you arrive in, given where is Ireland is geographically I don't think we would be first

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667870#Comment_120667870

Ah I had a feeling you would move the goalposts to this being about the UK.

It's not about the UK, it's about countries being 'at war'. A country does not have to be at war for someone to claim asylum.

Just addressing the misinformation in your OP, that's all.

atticu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667819#Comment_120667819

First poster says: if you arrive in Ireland without a passport and try to claim International Protection, you should be deported.

Second Poster: You can’t board a plane without a passport. (This means a plane leaving from outside a common travel zone). (But you know this).

You: I got off a plane without a passport. (You traveled from Ireland to the UK, this is a common travel zone. That means that it is like travelling within your own country and you do not need a passport). (But you know this).

So, how did you get into Ireland originally?

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667933#Comment_120667933

I think you need to reread the thread

sonar44

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667923#Comment_120667923

I'm not moving any goalposts. There's a poster here claiming his passport wasn't required flying from London to Dublin as though this justifies people in Dublin airport without passports looking to claim asylum, I am responding by saying the UK is not a refugee producing country, so this is not germane to the conversation.

atticu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667819#Comment_120667819

Quick follow up question:

When you realised that you did not have to show your passport, did you apply for International Protection.

If you did not, why not?

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667823#Comment_120667823

Just because a plane arrives here from the UK, doesn't mean that everyone onboard is from the UK, or that their journey originated there.

Irish Aris

A bit off topic, sorry about that.

Just curious: is that thing that you can board from London to Dublin without a passport only applicable for Irish citizens?

I have a Greek passport and been living here for nearly 12 years now and have travelled many times Dublin-London-Dublin and always have to show a passport when boarding. Only advantage is arriving to London and walking straight out.

sonar44

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667958#Comment_120667958

It doesn't mean that it isn't carrying people out to target and abuse our asylum system either.

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667954#Comment_120667954

No, you said the UK wasn't 'at war'.

I'll repeat it for you again. I'm not talking about the UK. I am talking generally. If someone wants to claim asylum, the country they are coming from does not have to be 'at war'.

A country being 'at war' is not the only criteria for someone to seek international protection.

We can go around and around in circles about the UK if you want but I quite frankly am not interested. The only bit of your post that interests me is the false notion that a country (any country, in the world, so not the UK in isolation) has to be 'at war' for someone to claim asylum and that is what I responded to.

Are you happy to admit to the fact that a country does not have to be at war for someone to claim asylum? Yes or no?

Yellow_Fern

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120666878#Comment_120666878

That is a myth. There is very little link. The explosion of ethnic food predates immigration. It is based on demand, not immigrants. There are basically no Polish restaurants. While I have had amazing Greek, Italian food in Asia in cities with very few Italians or Greek.

Strumms

The number of forcibly displaced and stateless people in Europe rose to 21.8 million by the end of 2022, including almost 12.4 million refugees, 1.3 million asylum-seekers, 7.2 million internally displaced people (IDPs) and 474,000 who were stateless.

that is unsustainable.

because of the state of the world… there are around 32 conflicts from full on wars, insurgencies, ethnic conflicts, the Ukrainian situation, plus global poverty etc….the EU at some point, probably won’t but should change its immigration and protection policy. What is going on now is nutsville and completely at odds with the EU being able to enable the wellbeing of its citizens, who are its paymasters…. The EU doesn’t run on fresh air or via some global UN fund, it’s EU citizens who fund it as they and we stupidly have presumed that by inventing it, paying for it, it being on our doorstep that it should and would be OUR thing, working for OUR wellbeing and successes and on our terms.

but the opposite is happening.

Ireland and the EU will become more of a target, more of a life raft, more of a safe haven and supplier of housing, cash, healthcare, success and sanctuary.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667972#Comment_120667972

Ireland and the UK have a common travel area, UK and Irish citizens don't need a passport to travel between the two countries.

Ryanair always require to you to have a passport, other airlines do not. It's not a legal requirement, but it's just as easy to have it.

Fred Cryton

This is actually very straightforward.

We need to import more legal skilled immigrants in areas like construction. We need more workers from abroad, there's no doubt about that. But we should choose who we bring in and they should have the skills we need.

We need to deport ILLEGAL migrants who are scamming the asylum system and coming from countries the EU deems safe (such as Georgia and Albania). And anyone who destroys their documentation should be sent straight back to the airport they came from.

And we need to remove the pull / magnet effect of having much higher welfare rates for asylum seekers as well as the promise of a "turn key" house. We should not be offering any more to asylum seekers than other rich Western European states. Not a dime more.

It is so juvenile for the Greens to boast we took 80,000 migrants last year. It's like hearing someone say they managed to stuff 10 burgers into their mouth. It's not an achievement, it just shows immaturity and lack of self respect for what the nation can cope with.

sonar44

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667983#Comment_120667983

What? the UK is not a refugee producing country. That's where we started. I'm not splitting hairs with someone who doesn't concede something as obvious as that.

sonar44

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667997#Comment_120667997

Youtube is amazing for foreign food recipes and cooking methods. Better again, the natives are producing the content. No reason Irish people cannot recreate any ethnic experience at a commercial or domestic level.

bokale

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667997#Comment_120667997

Where would we be without Giuseppe Cervi after a few pints!

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120668027#Comment_120668027

Asylum seekers get 38 euro a week

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667895#Comment_120667895

As pointed out before people don't necessarily apply for asylum in the first country they land in.

They can in fact apply to any country for asylum that is a signatory to the convention.

Many decide on countries that suit their own ethos or where they feel conditions for them are best. Or where they already have family or friends.

However once they apply in one country they cannot legally apply in another and can be sent back to the first..Dublin Rule

In practice Ireland doesn't send people back however.

I don't necessarily agree with this but am just replying to your question about the rules.

mikethecop

I find it hard to rationalize the process where a foreign national be it migrant refugee or whatever can commit criminal offence after offence without being deported

I mean how can some one making a call on weather to grant some one citizenship leave to stay or whatever when they have been convicted for multiple offences while awaiting the result of the process

its something i see quite regularly and have even raised it with the relevant authority to no avail. .

very frustrating

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120668075#Comment_120668075

I agree that any foreign national here should be deported if convicted of certain serious offences, immediately after serving a sentence.

Wouldn't agree with it for less serious stuff, district court convictions etc, unless there is a pattern of repeated offending.

atticu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120668052#Comment_120668052

No, International Protection Applicants get €38 per week.

People fleeing the conflict in Ukraine who are entitled to Temporary Protection get more per week if they are not working.

By the way - who or what is an asylum seeker?

Do you agree with this definition: someone who leaves their own country, often for political reasons or because of war, and who travels to another country hoping that the government will protect them and allow them to live there.

mikethecop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120668122#Comment_120668122

minor public order or rta stuff i agree unless its sustained and repeated offending

but thefts burglary fraud drug dealing even "minor" sexual assaults are district court offences ,

how about a arrestable offence one that carries up to 5 years in jail as a possible consequence , ie all of the above

lmao10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120667895#Comment_120667895

Imagine if everyone who was seeking asylum had to do it in the first country they arrived in. Actually use your brain and think about it.