Why wont die hard GAA fans admit football these days is muck?

pgj2015

Was watching bits from a few games over the weekend. 15 players behind the ball, balls going backwards, the mark is awful, goalkeepers playing as outfield players, the basic arts non existent like the tackling is shocking these days, the list is endless. Would it not be a lot better if it was like the old days? 1 player against another player? Roscommon's second goal v Mayo was a great move and goal but it was an unusual goal to see these days because there usually isn't any space close in to the goals to get a goal lie that these days. The footballers are probably better than 20 years ago apart from the tackling but they are wasted with the way football is played now.

Deskjockey

I watched Kerry vs Tyrone for 5 minutes yesterday and just turned it off... it was dreadful to watch.

rightmove

ye dont understand the game - that all

Mal-Adjusted

Because like it or not, possession is everything now. The days of 14 one v one tussles, catch and kick, are over. Gaa players (and fans) would never admit it, but they'd prefer to win an ugly game than lose a great one.

Treble double

Give me an example of a field sport that is great to watch as a neutral if you have no dog in the fight. I want to hear about this sport so that Gaelic Footbal can strive to attain its status.

Gaelic Football is always being bashed, ya if you are looking as a neutral at leauge games in March and expecting to be entertained you are going to be sorely disappointed.

But then again I watched some of the Dublin Mayo and Dublin Kerry knockout championship games in the last decade and they were probably some of the best games of football ever played and up there with any sport for entertainment value.

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320633#Comment_120320633

the small ball of course, everyone knows that

Treble double

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320684#Comment_120320684

Golf? because if you mean hurling you are having a laugh.

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320701#Comment_120320701

golf is terrible to watch, 95% of the time, it better to play

Hurling, like a lot of skillful attacking sports can end up lopsided, but feck it, you get some crackers

everyone knows hurling is a much better sport to watch than football

Treble double

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320730#Comment_120320730

I totally disagree, if you paid me I wouldn't watch a hurling leauge game, I'd watch an odd championship game but all I see is groups of lads poking sticks trying to get a ball out of a pile of bodies before the referee decides to throw the ball in before they do it all over again.

Or else somebody lamps a ball you may or may not be able to see from their own half over the bar, I think.it is a seriously flawed sport.

dxhound2005

Just from memory and looking back at random records, the modern game seems to produce more high scoring matches. Probably due to the fact that teams retain possession, instead of kicking long 50/50 balls. So in the overall that could hardly be judged as a negative thing.

1373

Would watch a junior club football sooner than most county teams . That said I'd happily watch dublin v kerry v mayo v Galway. They play good attacking football

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320764#Comment_120320764

that's a serious skill

plucking out of the air, hitting it over yer shoulder

the sideline cut, the list goes on

its all out attack, football is all out defense

the real problem with both sports is that neither seem to have a definition of a tackle, basically it just descends to chaos and the ref blows up

anyway, rugby is a far better sport to watch than either

Tombo2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320633#Comment_120320633

Good point

People will happily watch premier league soccer every week, but wont ever watch a game from the Dutch league or French or even League of Ireland.

I think the bigger problem in the football - as a spectacle - is that not enough teams are consistently excellent - you have Dublin, Kerry, Mayo.....and then a cohort that can be good for a year and then drop back. The pool of top teams is too narrow. In the past 12 years, you've had 8 all ireland final appearances for Dublin, 6 each for Mayo and Kerry. Nobody else has really been at the races, consistently.

Strumms

14 players behind the ball is brutal, toxic tactics but it’s working for lesser teams. Toxic football in terms of entertainment.

other greatest problem currently and one favoured by lesser lights is toxic physicality / fouling that’s really showing up and the endemically piss standard of refereeing now at intercounty level… sick of it, every game you watch.

lots of high / seatbelt style tackling up around the chest and throat… pulling jerseys too is now a tactical strategy…. a complete lottery as to whether a referee awards a foul or no foul, yellow or no yellow, red or no red…. Depending…

Attempting to dislodge a ball and disposes a player… it’s seemingly ok now to go in throwing a closed fist in towards the player and ball, missing the ball, hitting a player in the arms and chest….if you don’t dispossess them you are slowing them down by virtue of the strikes….

back in the day Pat Spillane felt he had to apologise for the use of the term ‘puke football’…. But in fairness looking back, maybe he could see what was coming. What the game might be evolving into….

now it’s not one county it’s and it’s endemic puke inducing thuggery….. we don’t have intelligent enough or good enough referees to manage the situation… to deter continuous tactical foul play, to sanction properly dangerous high tackles… to even recognise and blow for fouls in some cases. That refereeing shît show of a performance in Derry was a fine example….

almost as if someone in HQ decided that they want more physicality in the sport…more competitive games and if violence and thuggery to even it up, ahead of improving skills and fitness levels, so be it…

chuck eastwood

Fully agree with OP. I was a steward in croker for almost 20 years on and off. Lucky enough to witness some sublime matches, fielding that would slot nicely into ozy rules and proper ballers allowed by management to foot pass. Watched Dublin v Derry last night and it was absolutely muck. As the panel pointed out after the refs are so inconsistent giving frees we now have in every single game dives become the norm. Its not the game we love but once it creeps in it won't be changed without hefty rule changes

billyhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058287075/why-wont-die-hard-gaa-fans-admit-football-these-days-is-muck

It's less kicking in case of losing possession and more hand passes. Sometimes I'm wondering am I watching basketball. It's turning into an awful spectacle and hurling is following suit. Hand passes galore and 5or 6 players trying to scoop up the ball. Balls being thrown aswell and the ref can't spot it. Long range points with a lighter slioter. Bring back the old days where you had to work harder for your scores and there wasn't as much tip tap hurling. In saying that though I still love the game.

The_Kew_Tour

Just don't watch Football anymore and don't miss it. Its a brutal sport now.

randd1

I wonder would football be better served with 1) reducing teams to 13 per side or 2) setting up the field that once you go past your own 45 and once again the opposition 45, the ball cannot go backwards.

The 13 a side would obviously see more space on the field opening it up for more attacking play, while the "can't go back" situation would either encourage teams to attack quickly or press the opposition who can't go backwards forcing them to play it for a score.

I wouldn't mind seeing the "can't go backwards" tried out in the pre-season games just once to see would it be worthwhile.

Strumms

Sort out the fouling…reduce players on the pitch by more precise and error free refereeing which sanctions bad fouling and repeat fouling with something more then a whistle being blown… yellow, black and red is a reminder for these lot of appalling, unfit, unable, unwilling and unsporting referees… they are fücking beyond awful.

dxhound2005

More work for referees and more scope for them to be abused.

the_amazing_raisin

I'm very glad I looked into this thread. Personally I don't watch any sports on the TV. The best way to participate is to play IMO (although I'll freely admit I've no interest in team sports anyway)

Sometimes I feel like I'm missing out when listening to people discussing the latest sportsball match between generic team A and generic team B

This thread has reassured me that I'm not missing anything and I'll continue to not watch sports 😁

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120321088#Comment_120321088

sure get rid of them all together so, a blight on the game

Gaelic football is fine. The days of lash it up the pitch and hope your nearest team mate wins his individual dual are long in the past. It's actually incredible how it took well over 100 years for teams to take a more tactical approach.

Very often it's compared to hurling which is ridiculous - hurling has also drastically changed but the difference is putting 15 men behing the ball in football is effective whereas in hurling you can still do that but it won't work as a good team can still pick off 25+ points from distance. Offaly played 2 sweepers once against Galway and I think Galway still registered 0-33 or something. Hurling v football comparisons are nonsense, the two sports are just too different.

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120321183#Comment_120321183

Playing is more enjoyable for sure, but people watch it for the sublime skills that well most aren't going to replicate themselves

whatever about TV, going to live sport is something else though

Hoboo

Bring in a half pitch rule like basketballs half court rule, once you bring the ball over the half it can’t go back over or you forfeit possession.

Must keep a minimum of 3 players in your own and the the opposition half at all times.

Bring in a shot clock if needs must. Bring in a half way line clock if needs be.

Plenty of ways to counter 15 man possession passing and full team defending in your own half without reinventing the wheel.

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320612#Comment_120320612

I played it for 20 years.

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320632#Comment_120320632

It is such a pity, 1 v 1 was far better to watch. If you showed 99% of games to someone who never saw the game before, I dont think it would interest them.

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320769#Comment_120320769

I agree, them teams do play good football the odd time but only in Croke park where there is loads of space.

Dyr

I got out of the habit of going to games at the weekends during covid, in favour of spending the time outdoors or visiting friends and I ditched the telly cos I'm buggered if I'm paying a license fee to RTE. Both of which means I've seen very little football this year or last. What I notice when I see a "highlight" on social media, is that it's muck. Dublin throwing the ball the ball to next guy as soon as they catch it resulting in ten handpasses and a kicked point. It's like rubgy without the forward pass rule. Brutal stuff.

Make it illegal to recieve a hand pass with your hand to force the buggers to actually use their feet.

pgj2015

Most games these days is just like a backs v forwards game in training.

Imagine the goalkeeper coming out of the goal in soccer, it would be crazy and its just as crazy in gaelic football and looks stupid.

soccer is a game a neutral could happily watch by the way.

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120321016#Comment_120321016

They need to make a lot of rule changes in my opinion, like a player gets the ball and is surrounded by maybe 4 players, the player with the ball cant do anything so its a free against him, thats unfair, it should be 2 players at most allowed tackle you, not 4 or 5.

A friend was at Derry v Galway last year, seeing as the Derry goalkeeper kept coming out with the ball, at one stage he said there was 30 players in 1 half. 🤮

I just don't understand why the fans keep paying good money to go watch the matches, anyone any idea why they do?

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120321214#Comment_120321214

They lashed it up the field back say 40 years ago but 20 years ago that didnt happen, players picked out team mates with lovely foot passes or ran with the ball, now its all so slow and its not what football should be in my opinion. I honestly cant see how anyone thinks its in a healthy state right now.

farmingquestion

Agree OP.

The problem is that the GAA are far too slow to change the rules to keep the game attractive.

Teams and coaches obviously perfect the game based on the current rules...this is the same for any sport. Ireland rugby team...they introduced the "choke tackle". They identified a law of the game that if a player was held up, a maul could be formed which they could just kill the ball and win a scrum put in. The IRB quickly changed the laws as it was an effective move but it killed the entertainment value of the game, so they brought in the rule that if a knee touched the ground it was classed a tackle and players had to release.

The GAA need to bring in rules that prevent this boring handpassing across the 45s over and over again.

Maybe a rule like if you cross the 45 you can't come back or preventing the number of defenders in ones own half.

WesternZulu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120322326#Comment_120322326

They really didn't. That's a common thought but if you look at old games from even the 1990s it's all pretty much hit and hope. Very little good skillful foot passing.

I wouldn't agree that it was better to watch at all. A lot of it looked like unskilful hoofing it up the field.

The old games from the 60's, 70's and 80's are even worse again.

The main problem with football is the lack of a defined and effective tackle. It's too difficult to dispossess the player in possession compared to most, if not all, ball sports.

Most sports are not great to watch as a neutral. However I firmly believe that a good game of football is better than any sport. It's near perfection!

Better than the sacred hurling anyway where lads can score points from midfield. Hurling fans can go on about how skillful it is but by all accounts when you can score regularly and easily from that range it devalues the sport.

keeponhurling

You look at games like Derry v Dublin, and although at times the teams had 15 men inside their own 45, there were still 25 scores in the game.

A score less then every 3 minutes.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320633#Comment_120320633

Soccer is excellent when your watching top teams, the skill on show is unreal. Rugby is also very good. American football would be great also if it wasn't mostly ads.

Don't get me wrong, soccer can be drab, boring and petty much of the time, but the chance of that moment of magic makes me watch the odd game as a neutral.

farmingquestion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120322468#Comment_120322468

On the defined tackle part, GAA could easily improve this and make tackling more rewarding by enforcing the 4 steps rule.

Have a look at this goal last year by Armagh, I counted 16 steps total with one hop.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeSCPWh9S9c

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120322468#Comment_120322468

I played Gaelic football from say 92 to 2012, If I kicked the ball up the field, it was trying to pick a team mate out, it wasnt kick and hope at all. So if I was doing that, are you saying county footballers in those years were kicking and hoping?

TagoMago

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120322326#Comment_120322326

The late 90s/early 00s does stick out as a period where some of the finer points of gaelic football were best exhibited, coming after the era or hoofing the ball into the vicinity of your best ball winner and hoping he wins his duel, and the zonal marking/puke football that came after.

The incredible play of Maurice Fitzgerald, Padraig Joyce, Ciaran McDonald & others and some of the battles they had with opposing defenders are still so iconic to this day. Saying that, the there were plenty of counties without this calibre of player and the no shortage of low scoring, poor quality games, particularly around this time of year. Not exactly worse than today's bad games where you have 30 well conditioned athletes execute a defeinsive game plan to nullify each other, not much better either.

Billy Ocean

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320633#Comment_120320633

I find Hurling and Rugby can be great to watch as a netural, football actually can be too, Armagh Mayo a few weeks ago was brilliant, funnily enough Armagh Kerry and Armagh Donegal the last 2 weekends were a desperate watch.

farmingquestion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120323178#Comment_120323178

Nothing sums up the modern game of football as much as goalkeepers coming forward to take 45s/frees

If you don't have a forward, whose job it is to score points, that can kick over a 45 from the ground more often than not, you're in big trouble.

Treble double

The Pro 14 leauge not sure if that's it's right title. (The leauge competition that the Irish provinces compete in, in rugby) I would consider being asked to watch too random teams in this competition as a form of torture.

If there was a leauge of Ireland match being televised, I would attempt to watch it, but 5 minutes would be all I'd tolerate.

I would say even a March leauge game of Gaelic Football which would be the equivalent of the above, would be more appealing.

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120323302#Comment_120323302

A league of Ireland game in person is a far better watch than most gaelic football league games.

Billy Ocean

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120323302#Comment_120323302

Alot of it is personal taste too rather than matter of fact things, American football for example is very popular these days, personally i couldn't get into it at all.

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120323243#Comment_120323243

That is a very small element of the game. No one thing could be selected as summing up the modern game. It includes the short kick out, sometimes countered by a high press, sometimes not contested. The short passing game to retain possession until a scoring opportunity arises, facing a blanket defence. Nearly every player including the two keepers in one half of the field by times. Passes back to the keeper if deemed useful.

What summed up the old game was much simpler. Long kick outs for four midfielders to contest, and in turn to kick long. Forwards were there to score, and defenders were there to stop them. The rest of the team looked on from afar at these set contests.

But of course it is not as black and white as that, since there are still long kickouts, and high fielding is a skill which continues. The high ball into the goal area is still a tactic. And no doubt back in the day some defenders roved up the field, and some forwards helped out the defence at times. One thing which could be said about the new game, is that it must demand a higher fitness level to execute, compared to catch and kick.

WesternZulu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120323125#Comment_120323125

I'm big into soccer too and agree that at the very top level in the Champions League it's an excellent watch from the knock out stages. However, most EPL games are very poor to watch from a neutrals perspective.

As for rugby being a good watch. For me it's painfully stop-start which becomes really obvious when you go to a live game. Anything below international standard is awful.

Treble double

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120323613#Comment_120323613

Ya that's my point all field sports at the top level where there is a lot at stake are compulsive viewing.

Coming out and calling a sport "muck" because you are not entertained watching random teams in a humdrum leauge competition is a stupid comment.

As I said back up this statement with an example of a field sport that is brilliant to watch at an equivalent level, before labelling one sport "muck"

I watched a bit of Aussie Rules and while it has some good elements it is very stop start and highly tactical. In fairness to that sport the tackle is defined.

American Football I know nothing about apart from watching Super bowl finals. The action comes in spurts from what I have seen and there is an awful lot of forced razzmatazz to fill the gaps. It is supposed to be a gamblers dream which like horse racing would explain a lot of its popularity.

I think personnally GAA in its totality is complete muck!

When you think of people being assaulted who give up their time

to officiate & I am well aware that this happens in other sports also but

then the carry on of what should be an ambassador for the sport!

GAA needs to be run professionally without the parish pump politics!

Fr Tod Umptious

It all depends OP on what you want to call a "die hard GAA fan".

Listen to Radio Kerry anytime they are talking about football and all you have are these guys from the 80s complaining about how numbers on backs of jerseys don't seem to matter anymore, or how keepers come up to take frees, or how Armagh are using Ethan Rafferty, etc

They think the game was better when all you had were individual battles and let the best man win that individual battle.

But things have changed, it's been 20 years since the swarm defence, the infamous "puke football" which Spillane later apologized about calling it.

It been 20 years of possession football, keepers coming up to take frees, blanket defenses etc.

For a die hard GAA fan under 30 this is the football they have grown up with.

And yet the game is still popular, the sky has not fallen is as many predicted.

I watched four games on TV this weekend, two of which as a complete neutral, and I enjoyed them all for different reasons.

Ethan Rafferty playing the way he does is great to watch.

The hard running fast movement play is great to watch.

The hard physical challenges that force turnovers are great to watch.

And counter attacks at speed from those turnovers are great to watch.

People always complain that football is dying, or is dead if they continue to do x, y and z, but it's not, it's still very much alive.

Treble double

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120324130#Comment_120324130

It's more than alive it's thriving, I haven't the TV viewing figures for the latter round of the championships but they are bigger than ever.

I remember being at an inter county championship game in the late 80s as a child and listening to adults talking after saying the standard was brutal and the game was finished. Here we are going on 40 years later and the same doom mongers are in full voice, but the evidence seems to be to the contrary.

tastyt

Football can be boring if it’s two poor teams or one very negative team , but so can soccer and rugby . The difference is at least supporters of these sports can just come out and say when a match or season is shite

But god forbid anyone say that about a hurling match , all you get is the same bullshit “ warriors , magicians , best game in the world “. Maybe football people should just ignore the bad stuff like the hurling cult and just pretend everything is wonderful all of the time