Irish Under-20's 2023

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854371#Comment_120854371

I think the rigid aspect is down to the lack of greativity in the backline. To me, the backline was a weakness.

Dubinusa

The prospects this year are fine, promising players.

Loose heads, Hadden will be a professional player. I think he'll grow with time and at least make it to the Munster team. Morris is not academy bound and imo, will not make it. McCarthy if he stays at loose head is a possible international. He could make the switch to tight head and be solid.

Hooer. McCarthy unfortunately, has 2 international lads and McKee ahead of him. Also Lee Barron who is in his final academy year. I reckon that McCarthy has the tools to have a solid career. Great leader too. Sheahan, didn't see enough.

Tight head. McCarthy if he is switched has massive potential. Foxe looks like he'd be an asset to any of the provinces. Barrett is a work in progress, I've hopes for him.

Locks. Hopes is eligible next year and although he didn't feature much, I think could be a key lad next year. He's going into year 2. O'Connell has another year of eligibility and he too will benifit from this year's run. Irvine has great size, potential and showed some flashes. O'Tighernaigh is solid if unspectacular. A nuts and bolts lad. I think he'll be a solid option for Leinster in a few years.

Loose forwards.

Quinn is the real deal. Great prospect. I see him as a constant for Munster and perhaps Ireland. Barron, I don't know much about him. He's not signed to an academy yet. Mangan will be a good player, imo. Very good line out option and a good engine. Molony missed the tourney with injury. Gleeson the pick of the side. Huge hopes for this lad. Best prospect in the squad, imo. McNabney has the tools to progress. I can see him being a regular for Ulster soon.

9's.

Cawley is a good prospect. No academy place yet. Maybe Connacht? Gunne is a lad I am really excited by. In my opinion this lad could be with Leinster for a decade!

10's.

Prendergast will be on a senior contract next year. Lynch has no academy spot.

Wings. A weakness for the team in my opinion. Nicholson is a defensive liability at the moment. I can't see him being the future Ireland 11. Same with Osborne. Great size! Poor defense. But lots of time to work on it. McErlean is a joy to watch. I think he's going to have a solid career. Gavin is probably more of a 12? Big lad with potential.

Centers.

Cooney looks very talented. Good open field runner and defensive organizer. Lots of potential. Devine also a very good prospect. But, he's in a position with Forde and possibly Hawkshaw x 2 in ahead of him.

Congrats to the lads and Murphy and the coaching staff. Thy gave us a memorable season! I can't see a repeat of this anytime soon.

Also, congrats to France. Outstanding team.

Dubinusa

Anyone care to take a shot at next year's squad? In building up to the season, I'd like to see the squad play the province's "A" sides

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854881#Comment_120854881

Around Christmas every year the Ireland U20 squad plays games against Leinster and Munster development squads.

Locke_Lamora

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854881#Comment_120854881

In the build up to the the u20 six nations they play Leinster and Munster 'A' or 'development' sides and usually have a game against Italy, but that won't be until the end of the year. There aren't any u20 interpros anymore, but most players will train and play for their respective provinces A sides.

Locke_Lamora

A couple people already posted their guesses for next years XV a while back, and I've been thinking a little about which positions are looking to be the most up for debate and where some u19's might be promoted early.

I imagine O'Connell is the first name in the second row but the other spot seems open to me. Hopes probably has a running start on it as he's already played as an u19, but I don't think he really impressed all that much and the coaches could go with a heavier option or someone better at the dirty work. There are a couple of huge u19's but Walsh will still be in school and Spicer doesn't really seem to have started in interpros for Leinster much and seems more a project player rather that someone who will start for the u20s a year early.

Hooker looks very open to me. Sheehan played a year early but didn't really stand out, Zac Solomon just made Ulster's academy, and Stephen Smyth is a recent backrow convert and I thought he played well against Japan - just need to see if he has the lineouts and scrums down. Maybe is there's a standout u19 they can sneak in here but I reckon it's probably one of these three.

There are a few backrowers of similar quality all effectively fighting for two places because of Gleeson: Sheehan, Stevens, McKillop, Ward, Briggs. Sheehan has played u20 already but wasn't trusted much by the coaches and might not have played if Liam Moloney wasn't injured. Ward and McKillop missed out on Ulsters academy while Briggs made it. I think an u19 could win a place.

I'm not sure about the quality of the flyhalves next year or who's favoured over who.

The back three should be a tight contest, lots of good options there. McLaughlin, Kenny and O'Connor all highly regarded in their respective provinces. McFarlane, Kiely, Graham all good as well.

Kritzinger and Berman were the preferred centres at u18 level but Gavin played a lot for the u20's this year as an u19 and although was a mixed bag at times, his size and strength are great assets. I think he'll be the first name on the sheet but I'm not sure who'll partner him and who'll be 12/13. Kritzinger didn't stand out for me in the senior cup or for the 19s but he was out all year long with a bad injury I think, and Berman has u20 experience and had a few good moments but overall I wasn't very impressed. They were fairly poor defensively for the u19s against Japan but only had a couple of training sessions together whereas Japan were very well organised. Wales gave them a lot of bother in the u18 six nations but Akerman and Hennessey have both stood out for them in the u20s already. I feel like I'm forgetting someone else in contention and there are a couple of decent u18 centres this year but they are very small and still in school.

Anyway, that was a lot of rambling and obviously there's a lot of rugby/developing to do but at this stage I'll guess:

1. Jacob Boyd 2. Stephen Smyth 3. Andrew Sparrow 4. Joe Hopes 5. Evan O'Connell 6. Luke Murphy (u19) 7. Josh Stevens 8. Brian Gleeson 9. Jake O'Riordan 10. Jack Murphy 11. Ben O'Connor 12. Luke Kritzinger 13. Hugh Gavin 14. Lukas Kenny 15. Hugo McLaughlin

realhorrorshow

Gavin definitely struggled a bit at times at 13 but I'm not aware of him playing any high level rugby in the position prior, tough ask to come into such a key role at short notice. Wonder where he'll play his rugby next year, he'll surely have to leave Wegians. If he's seen as an outside centre long term some time in that position for Buccs and Connacht Eagles would do him a lot of good, in addition to adding another year of S&C to excellent natural athleticism.

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854946#Comment_120854946

Didn't know. Thanks

Dubinusa

I reckon Berman will make the team. He's a good player and did well in this tournament despite only coming off the bench.

snotboogie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855160#Comment_120855160

A couple of points you didn’t mention from a Munster perspective; If you’re moving Ben O’Connor I’d rather see him at 10. I don’t think he has the pace to play on the wing at this level. Dylan Hicks must have something about him to be taken straight from (a non rugby) school into the Munster academy, I think he’ll feature at some stage at 10. Sean Edogbo is best athlete I’ve even seen come through Ireland youths, he’s more than physical enough for the backrow and he beats most backs for pace but he’s a bit undersized for a modern 8 and the fact he hasn’t been selected for the Munster Academy in his second year out of school is a bad omen. Still it would be a shame not to see him at some stage next year.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855829#Comment_120855829

I’d guess O Connor is going to be a 15 or maybe a 12. He has so much upside i’d play him at 15 even if he is raw. Just from the clips i’ve seen he is a real athlete.

Edogbo needs to change position. There is way too much talent in the munster back row and more coming. I’d offer him an academy spot now if he would try centre. Honestly, munster need some of these guys to play front row but its prob too late for edogbo there.

Locke_Lamora

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855829#Comment_120855829

I thought Hicks might have a chance but all I've seen of him are those three u18 six nations games.

I wasn't too fussed about the back three's exact positions but I felt that I'd want McLaughlin on the ball as much as possible. You are probably right though and honestly all of McLaughlin, Kenny, McFarlane and O'Connor are very good and came through as fullbacks.

I've seen only a little of Edogbo but mostly didn't mention him here as he didn't feature at all in the four tests with Japan and France, and as you said, hadn't been picked up by Munster yet. He could very well feature in the squad though, this is all guesswork at this point without seeing how these guys do at a more senior level.

snotboogie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120856161#Comment_120856161

I think Edogbo was injured for the Japan and France tests as he also didn’t feature at all for UCC at that time, which would be unusual. Ultimately you are probably right though, I don’t think this Irish set up is primed to take a punt on upside, especially in a position as stacked as the backrow.

snotboogie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855932#Comment_120855932

The time to try him at center was at the academy intake last year. Instead Munster went with trying Gibbons as a center, which by all accounts has been a disaster in year one. UCC have tried him at 6 but he’s better at 8.

ljsulster

My opinions on eligible ulster players next year:

Jacob Boyd- Hugely athletic and skilful prop who can scrummage on both sides, would be expected to start at loosehead

Joe Hopes- high ‘hopes’ for a hugely talented 2nd row- should partner O’Connell

James Mckillop- The best forward I’ve seen at schools level since James Mccormick/ Tom Stewart. Hugely physical, skilful and athletic. A more skilful McNabney

Josh Stevens- Very Physical defender who runs great lines in attack, Twice the player of Crothers who came before

Bryn Ward- Animal ball in hand, not sure about his defence. Should be in the squad

Tom Brigg- Not as good as the above imo. Ulster must rate him highly though

ljsulster

Ben McFarlane- put in one of the best individual performances I’ve ever seen in the schools cup final in 2022. Similar in height to Mike Lowry but a better looking player who’s goal kicking is very good. Very quick and great footwork

Ethan Graham- Electric pace and talented footballer who’s a very good tackler also. Came through the clubs pathway in ulster and has played regularly for Ballynahinch and ulster A

Lukas Kenny- Absolute game changing player on both sides of the ball, by far the best back in ulster and will probably make his senior debut straight out of school this season. Physical, Fast, Skillful. Has so much time on the ball

johnh6767

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855702#Comment_120855702

Absolutely

conquestscarer

I thought Hugo McLaughlin was one of the better school prospects I've seen and putting him on the wing probably doesn't get the best of his kicking game/ playmaking as a second receiver. The fullback position does look competitive though.

alanb92

Will Gene O’Leary-Kareem still be in school next year? He looks an incredible talent so I reckon he will put his hand up for one of those centre positions, if he has left school.

Back 3 should be really exciting - Hugo McLaughlin is the best wing talent Leinster have produced in a long time. Ben O’Connor is a serious player too, great coup for Munster to get him to commit to rugby.

Locke_Lamora

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120859620#Comment_120859620

Another year in school I believe

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120859620#Comment_120859620

You can figure this out by looking at the NTS lists, anyone who is in last year of school now will be available for u20 next year regardless of their age..as long as they are u20 of course which they always will be to my knowledge. .

https://www.irishrugby.ie/2022/10/17/irfu-announces-national-talent-squad-inductees-for-2022-23-season/amp/

So, looking at the list,. No, he has two years of school left and he’s u18 now so he will only be available for one year of u20.

Looking at guys who will be u19 next year and finished school, and I’m not saying this is all of them

Paidi Farrell

Luke Murphy

Jed O Dwyer

Dylan Hicks

Alex Mullan

Emmet Calvey

Alex Usanov

I cross checked latest u18 schools with NTS to make list. Obviously could miss people who were injured for that.

alanb92

Cheers for that, good to know.

Does anyone see Charlie Sheridan being involved much next year or will his size work against him? He seems to be tearing it up in the AIL.

Side point, but does anyone know how Karl Martin has been faring at Montpellier? He looked so promising at u18 level.

pickarooney

He played half a match all season

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120864582#Comment_120864582

I don’t see Sheridan on the NTS which is probably a bad sign. Although this is the first year the list is public i think so who knows how much it changes year to year. He does seem to be killing it in the AIL.

tindjim1990

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120865215#Comment_120865215

Find it odd why Sheridan isnt, anytime I see him play im impressed, and no gaping holes in his game that suggest why hes not involved in the NTS for example watching NAAS play he looks a far more complete and player than Osbourne and Osbourne seems to be getting all the attention...maybe with some help from his brothers profile.

Sheridan is on the smaller side but theres plenty of smaller backs in the NTS and Ringrose isnt exactly a monster whilst granted Ringrose is a very physical defender.

Dubinusa

Is Murphy still the coach next year?

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120866621#Comment_120866621

Haven't heard otherwise but not sure of his contract status.

You'd imagine that he'd be reasonably in demand given his CV - Skills/Kicking coach for the National team for a good while and now back to back grand slams at U20.

ulsteru20s

You’d imagine he’d want to as his kid will probably be the 10. One last year.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120866572#Comment_120866572

It depends how small he is. That could be the gaping hole. We seem to be trending size in centre and wing recently at u20.

Locke_Lamora

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867076#Comment_120867076

Leinster aren't afraid of taking in smaller centres - Liam Turner, Hugh Cooney and David Hawkshaw certainly aren't towering over anyone, although they've all shown to be fairly physical for their size.