Irish Under-20's 2023

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852502#Comment_120852502

This team had players from Naas, Galwegians, Ballinasloe, Kilbeggan, Tullow and few others. there is more and more each year coming throuhg beyond the schools base. it takes time for change and it is happening quite well.

AbusesToilets

The team lacked a bit of x factor in the backs, no one to really make an unrehearsed off the cuff play

johnh6767

Great tournament not meant to be, never got the run of the green and that French team with oxygen (assisted by dodgy ref calls) are unstoppable. They were the better team. Gleeson, Quinn, Gunne, McErlean, standout and all will feature in the seniors . Prendergast who will also have great days ahead had a tough day but he has given us so much and will learn & build from today. Incredible team and coaching staff . Onto next year

Podge_irl

I'm fairly convinced Prendergast was not 100% fit for that tournament. Its a shame, but he was a good ways off his ability to attack the line and defend from the 6N. Still had some excellent interventions and I'm still convinced he will be the Leinster flyhalf sooner rather than later.

Others were excellent also. Gleeson looks phenomenal and I like I look of Gunne. Was quite a sight to see Ireland pushing SA and slightly less so France around at the scrum.

Clegg

Disappointed, but not surprised, that there's some people on here so gleefully sticking the boot into the kids.

They were excellent all tournament and did everyone proud.

typhoony

Agree with the lack of X-factor in the backs, who was the last World class centre that came through the u20's, Ringrose probably, I thought Tom Farrell would make it but seems not to have progressed as much as his promise at u20's, he had a good season for connacht and topped a good few stats in the URC

nerd69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852963#Comment_120852963

Jamie osbourne has that potential for sure

Seadin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852453#Comment_120852453

Hard to know. Lots of those French players are world class, we can get stronger but trying to be better than them is simply something that can't happen that easily.

Seadin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852502#Comment_120852502

Or not enough above our weight at times.

bluedex

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852443#Comment_120852443

Exactly. The 2016 team that lost heavily to England produced far more successful senior players, who contributed to much more senior success, than their opponents on the day. As I said before, it's a development tournament, they'll be very disappointed tonight but it'll drive them on.

Well done lads!

Seadin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852666#Comment_120852666

If the senior team could even do that we be all thrilled.

bluedex

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852432#Comment_120852432

That's a very harsh (and imo incorrect) assessment of a team of 19 and 20 year olds who were up against a team containing a lot of Top 14 experience.

Experience at that level is invaluable and it would have been incredible, frankly, if Ireland had won that game. The lads had a fantastic tournament in extremely difficult circumstances. Fair play to them.

P.s. they also got very little help from the officials, but that didn't decide the result, just the margin.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120853073#Comment_120853073

I think the Irish captain questioning the ref got under his skin (even though he was right). But we need to remember that its a development tournament for refs too.

Dubinusa

Lads brilliant Irish team. Not up for the French but so what, the French lads are aways down the road as far as development goes.

We've had very successful 20's teams for the past few years, sides that have produced many senior players. Our lads were nowhere near the French in terms of physical play and skill. Our backline was pretty tame. France on the other hand were sensational. There's lots of work to be done and maybe the backs can develop into good players.

Our pack was exceptional this year.

ulsteru20s

On the subject of centres, i thought Berman looked very handy. Excited to see him more next year.

ersatz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852688#Comment_120852688

Right, the last 15 years of development is sarting to indicate what's possible once the base of players widens. I actually don't think we punch above our weight. Rugby, like most sports, comes down to development opportunities for as many kids as possible. Our only limitation is the small population size but rugby is a minor sport in most countries so that does not have to be a major disadvantage if our system is world class, which it clearly is. Remember NZ has a comparable population and while rugby is massive there they have a great soccer team and a lot of other very high level athletes coming form there all the time so rugby doesn't get its own way completely.

ulsteru20s

https://www.planetrugby.com/news/the-nine-world-rugby-u20-championship-stars-destined-for-greatness

Gleeson and Quinn make the list.

jacothelad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852515#Comment_120852515

Yes. It seems to me that the Ulster Academy is where good young players go to end their careers. Some talented inmates rarely get any exposure to the senior side therefore they don't develop and therefore they get the boot.

nerd69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120853637#Comment_120853637

Thwve a 21 year old sh with over 40 caps, a 24 year old prop with about 80 a 22 year old wing with about 50 etc. Ulster are as good as anybody at playing young players

johnh6767

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852497#Comment_120852497

Given their success in the 6Nations and World Cup, they all can be proud. The 5 players you mention were stand out, but so too was Prendergast despite the patchy performance in the 2nd tournament. He and Gunne will enjoy a strong partnership for the next 10 years or more. McErlean is right up there, great flair. Gus McCarthy was an exceptional leader and player. This was a squad of immense talent and the provinces & Ireland senior team will be the beneficiary over the coming years. A few dodgy referee decisions gave momentum away at a critical juncture in the first part of the 2nd half and led to a score line that didn’t tell the true story . Some talent to enjoy next year also on the U20

theVersatile

https://twitter.com/OptaJonny/status/1679896034472865812?t=ca24WSOxPTcKF6kvrNNG6Q&s=19

Interesting stat from a style of play/coaching/x-factor perspective

johnh6767

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120853878#Comment_120853878

Telling alright

Locke_Lamora

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120853637#Comment_120853637

I'm as critical as anyone of our academy, but do you have anyone in mind? It seems more to me that we don't have enough good young players that deserve game time.

pickarooney

Very much in keeping with the playing styles of the two countries.

Clegg

This has been a very successful tournament for Ireland and I can see half a dozen of those players being provincial regulars and getting Ireland caps. Ireland looked well coached and the players executed their attacking strategy well. The standouts for me were Quinn, Gleeson, Prendergast, Paddy McCarthy and Mangan.

I think Mangan in particular got better as the tournament progressed. Did a lot of the dirty work in the backrow whilst also contributing with so huge tight carries.

I do think Ireland looked a bit too rigid in attack at times. Like we were playing to the plan rather than the game. I've seen some of the more prominent Irish rugby Twitter accounts calling Prendergast a systems player, but to me that's a complete misreading of his abilities. He's a very dangerous broken field runner and can spot gaps in defence and push the line break. Did a fair bit of that in the recent Six Nations. Didn't show it much over the last few weeks, but the ability is there.

jacothelad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120853648#Comment_120853648

It's not the few that are there, I am talking about, it's the ones who disappeared over the years. The last international back 5 forward of any real note produced by the Academy is Iain Henderson. He got his first Ireland cap in 2012. The last prop of note before TOT was Simon Best who retired in 2007. The last back row of any quality was Ferris with a nod Chris Henry. The last 10 worth a place in the Ireland squad apart from P.J. was David Humphreys. The last scrum half from the academy before Doak was Paul Marshall and before that Doak's father. Lots of guys have gone through the academy in these positions and we never heard of then again. Yes, we have produced good hookers and backs over the years. I just refuse to believe that all those other guys over the years selected for the academy and who disappeared into the ether were no good. All of them? .....Nah!

Remember wqtching in bewilderment while Brian Mclaughlin and then Les Kiss turned out teams where the centres were on the wings, wings in the centres 6s at 7, 9s at 8 etc. Remember the jokes about selections by chicken entrails and Ouija Board. Well it isn't as bad as that but not a lot.

pickarooney

Does anyone know where I could watch the u20 Trophy?

USA v Uruguay on currently

Number 137

France simply excellent and unfortunately they dished out a hammering to Ireland in the end. I think we missed Cooney from a defensive point of view in the backs.

I'm usually a staunch defender of referees and this is a development tournament for referees too, but I thought the referee was out of his depth. Made a lot of technically poor decisions, was bailed out by his TMO more than once for what should have been relatively clear and obvious offences. He also had absolutely no relationship with players and had the game been tight, I think control may have become an issue.

His performance ultimately didn't affect the score line, but his performance was sub par in my opinion.

johnh6767

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854379#Comment_120854379

Yes conversion v Leinster in particular is abysmal , something amiss

johnh6767

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854498#Comment_120854498

100% agree