Liffey valley to start charging for parking

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933097#Comment_121933097

As I said urban shopping centres were built around the model that the vast vast majority of customers would arrive by car, buy shitloads of goods, load up the boot and then piss off back home - you can’t do that travelling by bus - doesn’t matter how many of them there are

Flinty997

I think there's more than one type of user getting to the shopping center. As this thread is about parking, then it going to be people with cars.

I use public transport to work, and the kids etc would use the buses to center etc. I personally just don't use the centers like that. My visits tend to fast and short to get a specific thing, in the least amount of time. If it busy enough that getting the bus makes more sense than taking the car, I just won't bother and go the next quiet day.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933232#Comment_121933232

Again, to a degree you’re reading what you want to read.

I am not for one minute suggesting that most people would choose it, nor that they should. It obviously isn’t going to be an option for many people. I wouldn’t expect someone to go there from Dundrum on a bus, nor did I even suggest it.

Why people focus on more extreme journeys like that I don’t know. Public transport can only go so far when it comes to orbital journeys. I have made it clear several times now that I am referring to those people who do have a direct realistic public transport option.

The point that I’m trying to make is that it would be interesting to see what effect the increased network and frequency of public transport at or adjacent to the centre has had in terms of people travelling by public transport, be they working there or there as customers. Reading this thread you’d swear that it was non-existent, which I just don’t believe.

I think that it is fair comment to say that as a result of chronic historic underinvestment in public transport in this country, and poor experiences in the past, many people will have developed a bias against public transport, and understandably so.

As a result many just don’t even bother to consider it despite new or improved services being launched and some never will, and that’s just the way it is. But that doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t try to make it more appealing.

This is not going to change overnight - it is going to take years to alter but the public transport usage statistics in general do paint a positive picture as the expanded services are rolled out.

Re Kildare and Meath, both the 115 (now half-hourly from Enfield and hourly from Mullingar) and the 120 to/from Edenderry have seen frequency increased and running times altered to improve reliability in recent months.

Blanchardstown has the NX, 105, 109/b, 111 from various locations in Meath all of which I believe are currently under review with a view to improvements.

Flinty997

Once you force people into buying a car, its unlikely they will choose to take a bus unless its better option than the car for that journey.

I've switched to the train because it was better solution than driving. But then switched back to the car at times because the train was miserable.

I'm currently 80% train when commuting. 100% car for shopping though.

Hippodrome Song Owl

I rely exclusively on public transport. I pass through LV at least twice a day (usually more) using the new bus hub. The car park is horrible to navigate as a pedestrian to get to and from the bus. The L51, L53, and W2 are very unreliable in my experience of daily use. The L51 particularly hardly operates at all - my mother has given up going to the centre since the L51 became so bad. She would have popped in once a week using the old 239.

On the N4, the Cspine buses are too full. In particular the C4 is too full nearly all day so getting on at LV means either not being allowed on at all and a half hour wait, or squeezing on and standing squashed just beside the driver (can't even move down the bus) until at least Celbridge main street. Nobody is going to choose that over a car. The W4 seems to regularly spend up to 7/8 minutes sitting at the N4 stop and is nearly empty always.

I went into the centre for the first time in nearly two years in February. I used to have lunch with friends there weekly but they won't pay for parking now so we go elsewhere. The centre certainly looks nicer inside than it used to, but it was completely dead. Nothing there to make me as a public transport user choose it over the city centre or Maynooth, even with me passing through the car park anyway every day.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933329#Comment_121933329

And depending on where you live an occasional trip into town could be less expensive by car than by using public transport .

Take surrounding counties like klildare- Many have to drive to train stations - so that’s 4.50 parking per day - return train ticket could be another 7-9 euro depending on how far out from Dublin you are - so 12-14 euro before you reach town. Then there’s the hassle of waiting on the train and organising getting back at the appointed time for the return journey.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933420#Comment_121933420

Even its more expensive you're only paying the difference between the bus/train and the car. Which actually reduced the perceived cost of the car journey.

Expensive, or no Parking becomes the real showstopper for driving.

Ezeoul

As someone with a disabled parking permit, it really annoys me that if I look for a space in the disabled bays at the Penneys / TK Maxx end and can't find one the first time around, I can't just keep circling around until one becomes available. The layout and traffic flow actually forces you to go back out through the barriers and leave the center, go to the roundabout and come back in again to be able to circle around. That's how bad the layout is. I kid you not. And you better hope there is no queue at the barrier.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933483#Comment_121933483

I wouldn’t be one for weekly or even monthly visits to these places - but if I was, paying 3-4 euro to park in a place that was once free and during the weekday day time would be mostly empty , while not a lot, would probably get in on me after a while and I’d just go elsewhere- it’s not really the cost for me it’s the principle behind it .

I visit Arnotts about 4 times a year - that’s all - each time by car- I hate paying for parking having just spent a few hundred euro in the shop, hate it. But I get on with it but I wouldn’t do it every week that’s for sure.

Flinty997

I think the days of paying €3 for a few hours parking are long gone.

But I agree in part, if it's not an essential stop for me, I'll probably just keep going and stop where its free.

This is it

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933753#Comment_121933753

Isn't LV around €2.50 for up to 3 hours?

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121934460#Comment_121934460

No idea.

List of charges here...

https://www.liffeyvalley.ie/parking

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933568#Comment_121933568

you can loop around the top part and there are up and down loops within the bottom part and you can go into and loop around he bits by cosmos

So you don't need to go back out

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121934589#Comment_121934589

Trust me, I've tried it. Unless you are willing to turn against the flow of the traffic (dangerous) you can't just loop around where the disability spaces are.

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121934993#Comment_121934993

You can loop at the top where one batch are, not sure about the second batch

They should get rid of the family parking spaces really and move the further back

I would say for a disabled person the parking charges are a good thing as it's way easier to get a spot

Ezeoul

Like I said, I've done it, a couple of times now, and was forced by the direction of the traffic flow to go out and come back in again. If it was possible to simply loop around, I wouldn't have brought it up.

The parking charges don't really make any difference to the disabiity spaces that I've noticed.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121934460#Comment_121934460

Yep.

Plus free if you going to cinema.

Spanish Eyes

The bus services have increased alright. They are fine if the bus stops at the bus zone within the centre. If you are on an N4 route the walk to the Westbound stop is down a ramp and/or steps, about 700m from the Penneys entrance anyway. Eastbound you'd nearly get your 10,000 steps in before you get down to the bridge, cross over, go down the enormous ramp and wait with bags full of shopping. 800m. The guts of a kilometre to get into the centre from the N4 corridor. Now maybe there is a connection somewhere that will take you from N4 into the centre, but I couldn't find it!

I did both journeys (E and W) the other day from town as I was meeting friends in the Hudson Rooms for grub and drinks, so no driving. It was a right pain in the backside, and there is always a skinny wind up there.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121935430#Comment_121935430

There's a new bridge to be built as part of the Lucan core bus corridor scheme (currently with An Bord Pleanala) and the N4 bus stops moved further west in line with the new bus interchange.

FYI The 26 is always an option for that journey - it goes into the centre and doesn’t take much longer than the C-Spine.

Hippodrome Song Owl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121935974#Comment_121935974

Yes it will be great when the bridge is finally built, but in the meantime it's a shockingly bad interchange - so bad it does not deserve to be advertised as an interchange. And many of those worst affected by the difficulties in changing routes here (and so are unable to make use of it) will be dead by the time it's in place.

At the very least they could put an entrance from the Westbound N4 stop through the wall and up the grass hill to improve the connection between there and new hub. That could surely have been done without major fuss.

Spanish Eyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121935974#Comment_121935974

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121936313#Comment_121936313

Agree. I'm not there very often but when I do, it's for social purposes (often involving drinks so no car), and I can't help criticising the bus layout. If they even had a minibus circling the centre with stops at the footbridge, M+S, the Retail Centre and around Penneys etc. it could help an awful lot. There are many people who don't drive, but I do realise that such centres are car centric anyway, despite the Greenies trying to get us all on our bicycles!

The new bridge and bus stops proposed will shorten the distance to the bus zone and the centre, but it is still not an interchange by any stretch of the imagination.

average_runner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933041#Comment_121933041

Bus service is unrealiable, L53 is not frequent enough and if you have a load of bags you won't find space for them

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121941295#Comment_121941295

How frequent ought it to be?

average_runner

Every 10-15 mins. If you want people to get out of their cars you need to overload the system and be reliable

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121933568#Comment_121933568

Are you sure? I ask as someone who has circled through the carpark for years, in fact I find it hard to exit sometimes

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121944373#Comment_121944373

Once upon a time you could, but not since they re-did the car park.

Yes, I am sure. So sure that next time I'm down there I'll get it on dashcam.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121944346#Comment_121944346

I would question whether the demand for the L53 is great enough given that the C1 and C2 are there as well.

There's only a small section of unique routing.

Dodge

Was there for the first time in a long while yesterday. Plenty of parking on the M&S side. Centre itself was very busy. School holidays of course but some here were making out it was a ghost town even on weekends

Free parking because of a cinema visit too

Hippodrome Song Owl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121944509#Comment_121944509

But the C1 and C2 go half way around the world to get to LV and you then have to make the lengthy trek across the bridge and car park to actually enter the centre. The L53 is direct and actually goes TO the centre. Nobody going to the centre from Lucan would willingly choose the C1/2 over the L53 if it was a real viable option! It's night and day if you were actually familiar with the area. The L53 also offers access to the retail parks unlike the C1/2.

If it was improved enough to offer a real alternative for a trip to LV then it would also help alleviate the issue of people left standing at bus stops by full C1/2 from Earlsfort onwards inbound - particularly on Saturdays when this issue is most severe.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121944613#Comment_121944613

I am fully aware of the routings that they all take. If someone missed an L53 they’re not going to wait 30 mins for the next one, they’d far more likely take the next C1/C2.

I’d seriously question whether the demand for the L53 is more than half-hourly or max every 20 mins. There has to be a balance between delivering a reasonable service and putting buses in to carry thin air.