I am Proud of Being a Conspiracy Theorist

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028374#Comment_120028374

If someone is genuinely open about a thought, they are also open to the data to show if it's possible or not and willing to change their view point to match the facts, people have literally worked out all those details about the JFK assassination or the physics behind the building falls which can be referenced relatively quickly when discussing it (and if the theorist believes in magic or a new tech that doesn't exist today, they can state that, the magnetic vaccine guy came closest there I believe).

What can be interesting is if people go beyond that "if this was possible, then this is how the rest could be done" but unfortunately most theorists will rathole on one detail and completely ignore the bigger picture.

new_world_order had some interesting posts, none of it ever came true (they would also put timelines on them), unfortunately they also descended into extreme right talking points (racism and nazis) which makes it hard to discuss (e.g. is there some constitutional mechanism where trump is really the president and calling the shots for Biden).

Curious_Case

A conspiracy theory is simply a suspicion that a group of 2 or more are conspiring.

To say that no theory is well-founded, implies a level of naivety that itself beggers belief.

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028452#Comment_120028452

Well you admit that your point can be budged. That's not so with the majority of debunkers here. They usually make excuses or suggest revisionism or out of context.

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028477#Comment_120028477

Indeed.

Also it's often far more about denial of events, than it is about the conspiracies themselves. For example, I remember after the Charlie Hebdo attacks happened, I went to a popular conspiracy forum, and users there were working together to discredit any information in order to create innuendo that the attacks were "fake" somehow, but there was no interest in building a conspiracy. It was the same for most other high profile attacks.

banie01

This thread, like the last couple of threads in feedback on this topic has again devolved into a them and us.

The 2021 feedback thread (and others) has all these arguments and even the moaning about the charter.

That thread had a suggestion put forward by a couple of posters regarding a basic template for an OP.

Outline a hypothesis, outline why the poster feels it's credible (or not) and provide their understanding of the evidence that they feel supports the theory being credible.

It goes a long way towards nixing those questions some are fond of complaining about and allows a discussion to move towards the quality of any evidence presented and the understanding or interpretation of same.

The only people opposed to that in the threads where it was proposed? Were the CT proponents, and we seem to be circling the same "say anything Vs support what you claim" point again.

Without some degree of underlying evidence? There isn't a theory, there's an exercise in creative writing. CT's aren't harmless and some of us here have seen people destroyed by an adherence to CT and the impact that the rabbit hole has on their wider relationships.

Posting about Jewish Space lasers, crisis actors and faked events and on and on, for some is fun and starts off as harmless, but without evidence those threads are worthless. Without evidence? There is no theory.

It's not an organised effort to oppose CTs (or at least if there is? I've yet to have gotten an invite) but, already on this thread there have been claims of such, of moderator bias, of deliberate inaction and even paid posters 🤷‍♀️ The crux of the mod issue in this particular corner of boards? Is if I had to guess, that noone wants to be lumbered with it. BBOC waded in last year and made a balls of it and since then? Apart from CMOD or admin action? Has there been any real regular modding?

**Edit**

Changed "cats" to CTs in last paragraph.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028708#Comment_120028708

Once again, why do yee "truthers" hang around in forums where CT are discussed ??? Very very strange................... Almost worrying. 🤔

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028778#Comment_120028778

A dog with a mallet up his arse know that's a lot of conspiracies are way out there and don't make any sense.

A lot of conspiracy theorists are probably trolling the novice debunkers. They like rolling around in an orgy of swill. I've read some strange things and thought to myself no way am I even going to debate or discuss lizard people, Nordic paledians or grey's working together etc to take us over. Yet lads will actually engage with such fantacy and ask for proof...

Outline a hypothesis. Come on how could someone outline a hypothesis to support something like lizard people or an ice wall surrounding the oceans in a flat earth blocking people from finding foothold in undiscovered land's run by Nazis or something like that.

I just wouldn't even waste my energy and time asking for proof or playing into it.

If I did I'd be asking myself after the emotional hangover, what in the hell did I go there for.

https://youtu.be/cmCzLxe8OFE

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028832#Comment_120028832

If one can't outline a hypothesis? One can't have an actual theory.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028778#Comment_120028778

If its an "excercise in creative writing".... Why are yee so triggered by the posts ?

Do you think theres a multi million worldwide audience for our 'creative writing' that is causing consternation, panic and trouble worldwide

Are there people around the world following (well apart from the dozen or so in here) us and thinking we are 100% correct??

Anyone of yee able to answer why yee frequent and disturb threads in here non stop ?

I dont hang around in places that i hate or think the people in there are 'knuckle draggers' or 'stupid cnuts' .... But thats just me i suppose.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028370#Comment_120028370

But your endless FUD on the Covid Vaccine thread (from which we're both banned) shows you are unequivocally an anti-vaxxer. I'd move on from trying to portray yourself as someone that is in favor of vaccines, you've gone on months and months trying to cast doubt - or, sealioning those that do.

Your comment on burning vaccines was satire, was it not? Nice attempt at changing the past.

If the shoe fits, wear it.

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028842#Comment_120028842

I'm not triggered. Evidence is a basic requirement for a theory. One formulates a hypothesis and tests it with evidence until it becomes a theory.

As for why "we" post here? I can't speak for anyone else, I post here as funnily enough I got sucked in a topic a while back that I had professional interest in. That developed into taking an interest in CT particularly around 9/11. Went looking through the "theories" went looking for evidence and was surprised at the amount of folk holding unevidenced CT as "fact".

Is there a rule against posting here? Do you think that CTs are above questioning and that you should be left alone in a safe space?

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028829#Comment_120028829

A "truther" usually refers to someone who believes that some event was a conspiracy, like 911 or Sandy Hook.

It's a public discussion forum. For me? I guess I enjoy debunking false or fake stuff. Again, there are a lot of true and highly plausible conspiracies, I've posted a conspiracy or two here myself.

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028838#Comment_120028838

Not everyone wants to outline a hypothesis. Some people have theories about all kinds of things.

It's like red tape, there's procedures for that kind of thing.

Not everyone is educated in having a hypothesis. In order to be all knowing you have to know how your opponent is thinking, why they think that way and go from there.

The best debunkers are the ones who have been there and found out that they were in a loop of fantacy. They knew how it works.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028864#Comment_120028864

No rule against posting here - you know that.

Its just that i wouldnt intentionally frequent places that i think is full of 'stupid cnuts' ...

Would you do it in 'real life??

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028903#Comment_120028903

You do know the difference between a theory and a hypothesis?

The hypothesis has to come 1st, for it to be a "theory" there needs to be an evidential basis.

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028908#Comment_120028908

Have I used that phrase?

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028910#Comment_120028910

Condescending much ??? 🙄

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028911#Comment_120028911

No, one of your mates did last night .........

(i didnt say you did by the way)

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028915#Comment_120028915

Not at all, it's odd that you feel that way. Why do you feel that every thing that doesn't fit your view is an affront?

All I was doing was laying out what a theory requires. Without evidential basis, there is no theory.

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028919#Comment_120028919

You strongly implied and you know that you did. What's with your constant effort to see anyone disagreeing with you as part of a group?

I don't actually have mates in here, none that I know outside crossing here as posters. I think maybe dohnjoe is an infrequent poster on another forum I post on but, no mates.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028910#Comment_120028910

Pretty clear b2b doesn't know that. If he does, I'd welcome seeing his procedures written up like he claims.

Won't hold my breath, though, it'll be some irrelevant response as always with him. He ducks questions.

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028910#Comment_120028910

Ah will you stop, that's the way I used to carry on year's ago. I'm aware of what you're at. I remember trying to be all matter of fact, nonchalantly intelligent with a sprinkling of faux humility.

Plagiarism was one of my short comings and talking down to lads on the internet. During my atheism phase I'd be quoting Christopher Hitches and Dawkins using their debating tactics.

Correspondence of similarity to my heroes in order to big myself up. I used to think it made me feel good about myself. In reality I sounded like a pretentious little prick.

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028967#Comment_120028967

Go on my son, you tell him, go on you know me better than myself. You tell em... that's right you tell him

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120029043#Comment_120029043

That's great and wonderful that you had the self awareness to knock plagiarism on the head.

It doesn't address starting a thread with an idea, a notion or a hypothesis but not being able to at the very least substantiate why you, or indeed anyone. Should afford that notion any credibility nor why such a notion shouldn't be questioned.

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120029068#Comment_120029068

I see where you're coming from, but that's unfortunately not how conspiracy theorists work.

If they had a map of where to go, like a vagabond they'd probably deviate and get distracted. I'm a bit of a drifter myself and yeah at times I'd swallow a brick and quiet gullible in ways.

Knowing the difference is very powerful.

"Nobody gives you that power, you take it...."

From Jock Ewing in Dallas

https://youtu.be/dGdfPtW56fo

banie01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120029157#Comment_120029157

I think everyone is liable to that risk, of an idea gelling with something within us that it seems perfectly sensible. I know I have been myself, confirmation bias and the lure of "knowing" something are hard to counter on a personal level.

But? Any idea, any theory or notion not just CTs need to be able to withstand scrutiny to be accepted as credible.

If the desire is to discuss a hypothesis to develop the who, what, where and how? Then of course the proponent of the idea needs to engage in at least giving their basis for why?

Without that discussion? As I said in an earlier post, it's really just a creative writing exercise and often it's more a case of throwing shít at a wall to see what sticks.

Now my stance on that? That's what blogs are for, if that's what someone wants to do? Then by all means. But? On a discussion site, those notions will be questioned by someone and without something underpinning them? They are close to being a worthless thought experiment.

On a discussion site, there are going to be myriad opinions some supportive, some not. It's the nature of the beast. Complaining that people are asking questions, and in some instances here, taking it quite personally and seeing skeptica as a hive mind, working with inside help from the mods? Well that doesn't build credibility. It's easy to tar both CTrs and Skeptics as homogeneous groups, and when one asks something? To get pissy with all on that side of the coin...

But? As I said to another poster here, I don't have mates in this forum. I don't follow posters (as was claimed when the OP here had 2 threads on front page).

It is descending to tilting at windmills. I know you previously said you were once a fan of Dawkins and Kitchens. I'm not, I have read them and enjoyed them but they aren't a jumping off point for me in anything.

What is? Is just a little bit of rigour. That if I assert something, that I can support it. That I can be open to new information and always change my stance in the event that information is valid and contradicts something I thought true. It's the same standard I expect from posters everywhere on boards and one I expect to be held to when I post myself.

Markus Antonius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120028908#Comment_120028908

This is the question we would all like to know! If the content here is so harmful then why are the same 5 or 6 skeptics the most frequent posters?

Very bizarre behavior..

Major irony in it too, that the people who are so adamant on "debunking" come across as the most unhinged conspiracy theorists of all!

Oooh, Conspiracy theories are dangerious! They lead to violence and school shootings or even worse - ANTISEMITISM! I have to ask questions quick before we get Holocaust 2.0

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120029389#Comment_120029389

I guess we're masochists.

If people have free speech to express extreme or far-fetched beliefs, they can't suspend that free speech to protect those beliefs from scrutiny.

Markus Antonius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120029591#Comment_120029591

Asking questions =/= scrutiny

Try contributing something of substance that doesn't destroy the forum.

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120029641#Comment_120029641

Sounds like you just want people to agree with you or get out.