LIV Golf Invitational League...... NO Political/Ethical conflict posts, see Post#2

benny79

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119613300#Comment_119613300

This wont happen imo. and the only big name they have is Cam Smith imo and the main reason they got him Id say was because of his Ozzy roots.. Brooks, Bryson & DJ you could argue too but to be honest I wont miss them and they haven't won in ages. Bryson is as slow a player as any and DJ is boring.. Brooks I did like a bit mainly cause of his spat with Bryson 😁 Theres lots of talent out there and new stars (Cam Smiths) coming through yearly! What LIV tour is great for is clearing the dead wood in Westwood, Poulter, Casey & Reed these guys are just all about the greed and have no love for the game imo! Glad to see the back of them to be honest..

PARlance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615901#Comment_119615901

I was thinking the same a few months ago. X won't be missed, Y is a has-been, didn't like Z anyway etc etc....thought that they had gotten the low hanging fruit and sure they probably won't sign anyone more.

Smith changed my view on that and I think putting it down to his Ozzy roots is a bit of denial. He's the most recent major winner, one of the top attractions in the game and he went to LIV for the money. More will follow over time, for the money.

Players like Niemann, Gooch, Varner aren't insignificant either.

The recent LIV event in Boston was an eye-opener for me (in many ways, hate the LIV "product" in general). Even though you can make excuses for X,Y and Z, the sum of the LIV parts at this (relatively early) stage is already strong enough to have an impact on the PGA Tour and it's only going to be one way traffic over the next while imo.

benny79

Smith was a nobody 2/3 years ago as in nobody new about him or wanted to watch him unless you were a die hard fan! Yes he was a big coup but I do believe his Ozzy roots had a big part to play. I am still shocked he went to be honest especially after winning The Open. One of the reasons I hope (although unlikely) they get banned from the Majors!. They just seen the money & left knowing the consequences. You made your bed lie in it.. If they were struggling Pros I'd understand but these are already multi millionaires!

They dont care for the History of the game! I know the PGA has it faults but if they had of invested in The European tour lets say I would have had no problem with it. It would of been great for the game. LIV is not.

~Greed - One of the 7 deadly Sins

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615901#Comment_119615901

Well that's just your opinion man.

The reality is LIV have got some pf the most recognisable names in golf and most of them were pretty high ranking as well.

You not liking players is irrelevant. They are/were stars on the PGA. its silly to claim otherwise.

benny79

Were 😉

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616543#Comment_119616543

So you're admitting LIV took PGA stars 😉

benny79

Obviously! but some would say most are in decline. Only one I'm raging over is Cam though.

Innish_Rebel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616538#Comment_119616538

I don't disagree - they've definitely gotten some big names in golf - bigger than I expected they would get. But I still am trying to see what the general view of success will be for LIV. The last tournament was in theory huge. Playoff with one of their biggest name signings winning over two new "big name" signings, & Open champ 1 shot back & UK fan favourite with a chance to win as well... Wow for LIV the leaderboard of their dreams I would think - However I saw an article online on the YouTube viewership for the final day:

Average concurrent streams: 74k; Peak concurrent Streams: 113k; Total unique viewers: 210k. That is worldwide for free airing. The CBS PGA Rocket Mortgage had an average viewership of 2.5 million (& that's US only)

So I guess my point is that yes LIV has got some major coups in the players they've got - but at what point does it move the needle enough to make a dent in the viewership numbers?

PokeHerKing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616685#Comment_119616685

I've zero interest in watching LIV as its on YouTube etc. If/when it gets broadcast by terrestrial or satellite TV I might.

PGA viewership is down YOY this year apparently. Not sure if it's because of LIV but something is moving the needle I'm the wrong way for the PGA.

Who knows where this all ends up. All I know is Rorys opinion on anything is fairly useless, his constant flip flopping shows he puts little thought into anything before shooting fr the hip.

slave1

Rory is a poor defender of the DP Tour, his patchy history with withdrawls and stretching of DP membership makes him not the most shining example to "defend" it.

I'm not sure I've seen a single DP Tour member day in day out (i.e. not on the PGA Tour) be in any way vocal over LIV or the LIV players playing the DP Tour, if anything some have said they've no issue with it (replies to McGinley assertion otherwise)

Keano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616814#Comment_119616814

Eddie Pepperell has been very vocal and is a DP Tour member for a long time.

OEP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616814#Comment_119616814

Mike Lorenzo-Vera came out strongly against LIV too

Hyzepher

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616685#Comment_119616685

Those numbers are incorrect. LIV broadcasts are aired over a number of channels and Youtube is only one. And even then, the Youtube streams are divided into territories (I believe that some alternate commendating is also done). LIV Golf is also aired on free to air channels in a number of countries - the list is available on the LIV Golf website.

AdamD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616685#Comment_119616685

There are people streaming video games from their bedrooms who get better viewing figures than that

slave1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616938#Comment_119616938

Ah Eddie, I do follow him on Twitter but just realised my phone was not signed in so probably missed his no doubt cutting comments.

I see he's changed his "description" to "LIV golfer in the making". Love him.

Innish_Rebel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617120#Comment_119617120

Okay acknowledged - not exhaustive numbers but I've not heard of anyone watching LIV on anything other than YouTube (LIV website/Facebook/DAZN subscriptions), that page on the LIV website you mention is hard to find, I did through a google search but failed to find the page going through their website front page... I would still ask the question what level of viewership does LIV need to get to.

If anyone want to read the article I was referencing:

https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/Journal/Issues/2022/08/08/Upfront/Golf.aspx

Dav010

I don’t think anyone can assume that LIV will run out of fuel anytime soon, they are here to stay. There are two obvious milestones which will shoot them into parity with the PGA tour as the dominant tours, more top players joining , and SKY picking up live coverage of the comps. I really think the window of opportunity has almost closed for the PGA to stem the flow of top players. If the top players join LIV, Mcillroy will follow suit, he will have no choice as winning a comp where there are few to the top players competing will be an irrelevance.

Mushy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119619217#Comment_119619217

I hope that pun was unintentional!

But yeah, it is getting closer to a stage where something will have to be done, otherwise it'll just be 2 half-baked tours splitting an audience. If anything good comes from LIV, it'll either be more events this side of the water (and why would SA care about that, so it'll just be more events in the desert) and better coverage on tv/streaming.

So the rumours of a top player joining soon, well Rahm absolutely busted that one a few minutes ago.

Motivator

Someone above mentioned CBS getting 2.5m viewers for the Rocket Mortgage Classic, LIV will never get those kind of numbers in the US if they get a tv deal. American’s are well known for their patriotism and if someone or something is a perceived threat to anything American then they won’t give it the time of day.

American’s also love their history - Augusta, Pebble Beach, The Country Club in Brookline. Those three are the first courses that sprung to mind, but nearly all of the PGA Tour circuit courses are steeped in history and the tour itself is seen as historic due to the Palmer and Nicholas connection going back to the 1970’s. LIV is the shiny new thing which is being bankrolled by perceived enemy’s of the state and it has no history or legacy. I do think if LIV was the brainchild of some rich American man/family/company then it would be a totally different story. Look how much 9/11 has been brought into the LIV thing to try and dissuade Americans from watching it. American’s will never truly buy into LIV and that’s why it will never work. LIV needs the American market whether they admit it or not.

I’ve said it before but LIV will end up as a second tier tour with tournaments bouncing around the big university towns and cities in America where they can attract 25,000 rowdy lads when Norman can get a DJ playing and pour free beer off the clubhouse roof into the gullible open mouths of shirtless frat boys. It will never be a real rival to the PGA.

AyeGer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119612952#Comment_119612952

Could be Jon Rahm then, he was interviewed recently and wasn't happy with some of the changes.

callaway92

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119620027#Comment_119620027

Not a hope it’s Rahm going by his Tweet today

AyeGer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119620035#Comment_119620035

I didn't see what he said today. What was that?

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119620040#Comment_119620040

Here ya go

https://twitter.com/JonRahmpga/status/1570134495151656961?s=20&t=11Fys-YQXieLyYZXZsKg_A

Mushy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119620040#Comment_119620040

Ah responded to one of the propaganda bots who claimed they haven't got one name who jumped to LIV just saying its the start of a losing streak, but thanks for the PIP help

Rikand

Yep, he also said at the tour championship that while playing so many US based events will be tough for him as a European, he has no interest in playing 3 day tournaments with no cut. He wants to play golf the way it has always been played.

I think he said he's going to try to seek an exemption as a European based player to not have to play all the required pgatour events so he can play more events in Europe.

benny79

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119619843#Comment_119619843

This and the fact I dont think they will be granted world ranking points and if the majors ban them or event if the DP tour wins there case its dead in the water! As no ranking points = no majors.. bye bye LIV!

OEP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119621966#Comment_119621966

The majors won't ban them - the no ranking points could happen though.

benny79

Yes and then they wont qualify so either way its a win win.

Innish_Rebel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119619843#Comment_119619843

Just to flag one quote from you that is one of my issues with LIV "If LIV was the brainchild of some rich American..." I think this is a key point - LIV could not be in its current form - as Lowery said on the NLU pod - Golf is not the NFL, if the top guys get that type of money it will be impossible to balance the books at any stage.

Do I think the PGA/DP Tour are doing a brilliant job... No. Do I think a professional organization (sports or otherwise) should have a business model that will eventually balance books/make profit - Yes.

IAmTitleist

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119622457#Comment_119622457

In what way is having 20 odd of the best golfers in the world not competing in the 4 biggest and most prestigious (the majors) events in golf a "win-win" ?