How can we integrate Unionism into a possible United Ireland?

Speedline · 08-05-2022 01:13PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119031445#Comment_119031445

They didn't protest because the protocol was devised to deal with it.

The cheerleaders for Brexit are the same ones against the protocol.

FrancieBrady · 08-05-2022 01:15PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119031601#Comment_119031601

My sense of it it this. The DUP, as I predicted managed to scare Unionists voters this time.

If they make another strategy blunder and push it to another election, the Protocol will continue to show that it is doing little to no harm to NI and is actually making Brexit easier on NI. Donalson will not get away with lying or inventing bogus figures and you will see those voters 'scared' this time move to the more moderate UUP (who seem convinced that the path they have taken will eventually pay dividends)

In that scenario the TUV will be sniping on the sidelines. All SF have to do is the same as they are doing now, and not interrupt Unionism as it further divides itself.

08-05-2022 01:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119031616#Comment_119031616

Deos the protocol not exist,because the british were proven untrustworthy as regards conduct around the orginal "backstop"??

Ceramic · 08-05-2022 02:01PM

The “etc” that isn’t genuine is the Tories.

The EU has bent over backwards to come up with a solution to this. All the Tories seem to come up with are invented problems to keep stoking the Brexit fire for domestic political reasons in England, not in Northern Ireland.

I think the DUP have been useful props for that agenda and nothing more.

Any sensible British government would see that there are pragmatic solutions being put on the table, but we aren’t dealing with a sensible British government.

That’s why I don’t think this can be resolved until after a UK general election.

briany · 08-05-2022 02:31PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119031657#Comment_119031657

That was another thing that I'd forgotten about. At the end of 2018, I think it was, the British government agreed to a backstop "in principle" in order to move to the next phase of negotiations, and then turned around, essentially waving their crossed fingers in the air. I think the intention was to keep on kicking the NI question down the road and hoping that the EU would just drop the requirement once everything else had been agreed. This is in line with "when push comes to shove, Ireland doesn't really matter" Tory thinking.

As for trust between the two largest parties in Northern Ireland, it's never really been there. They are fundamentally opposed when it comes to their very reasons for being. They can perhaps do business on relatively minor questions like what shape a road sign should be, but can never see eye to eye on the direction of Northern Ireland.

Brucie Bonus · 08-05-2022 02:53PM

They will behave democratically if they get what they want?

Maybe they should do a SF and not take their seats?

"When you are accustomed to privilege, equality can feel like oppression".

downcow · 09-05-2022 06:44AM

cant Remember who, but a political correspondent put it very well the other day re Boris and tearing up the protocol.

he said that the truth is for unionism (and everyone else) is that Boris ‘could do anything for you or could do anything on you’.

so we may all just watch this space

FrancieBrady · 09-05-2022 08:10AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119034726#Comment_119034726

So you'll just sit back hoping a liar who has shafted your people multiple times will 'do something' while the place goes to **** around you?

ancapailldorcha · 09-05-2022 11:28AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119034726#Comment_119034726

Yes, sure. Any day now. They've been saying that for years but I'm sure Johnson, a notoriously lazy compulsive liar will do the right thing very shortly.

Unionism needs a new hymn sheet. They really needed one a few decades back.

FraserburghFreddie · 09-05-2022 03:52PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119034845#Comment_119034845

Johnson has his obvious faults and shouldn't be in the job following 'partygate' (amongst other things)but the myths and prevacification churned out by extremist republicans to aid their selfish, idealistic clap trap that NI is"going to sh*t" doesn't fool anyone. NI is doing fine,aided by the protocol which puts them in a strong position.Why on earth would they want to loose that advantage by opting for a UI?

FrancieBrady · 09-05-2022 03:54PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037071#Comment_119037071

Are yopu that conditioned to the failures of your statlet that you think what is happening is normal? Dear me.

ancapailldorcha · 09-05-2022 04:06PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037071#Comment_119037071

Johnson slept around while his wife, Marine Wheeler QC was on chemotherapy for breast cancer. He should never have been allowed more power than a floor cleaner but he was born in the upper caste so here we are.

NI is fine because of the protocol. Do you not see how that suggests that it might be better off in a unified Ireland?

FraserburghFreddie · 09-05-2022 04:27PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037137#Comment_119037137

Yes,NI is fine because of the protocol so why change that unique advantage of having a foot in both the UK and EU?Certainly not to facilitate unrealistic,vague and financially nonsensical extremist republican longings.

ancapailldorcha · 09-05-2022 04:33PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037235#Comment_119037235

What advantage? NI's economy is pivoting away from the UK. Why bother remaining shackled to it for no gain. All Westminster has done is to use the people of Northern Ireland as mere pawns in their silly game with Brussels.

Furze99 · 09-05-2022 04:45PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037269#Comment_119037269

Brexit was always going to be a disaster for relationships between these islands. But it isn't only the Brits that have used NI as a lever in negotiations. The EU and our Irish government have been happy to use NI as well as a lever to beat the Brits. The 'problem' goes back to the GFA which erected a shaky structure between the two islands, which was dependent on both islands being members of the EU.

I agree with above comments that NI business now has a pretty good deal with a foot in both camps. But the DUP don't like the infamous protocol for their own assine reasons and I'm not sure than the Shinners really like it either (despite what they currently say), as if implemented to full effect, it will make NI stronger economically. And that's not in their interests, they want dissatisfaction with the status quo in order to drive their main agenda.

FrancieBrady · 09-05-2022 04:48PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037316#Comment_119037316

Isn't Northern Ireland's economic weakness one of the prime reasons why some say Unification is impossible?

jmayo · 09-05-2022 05:13PM

No a prosperous NI would mean lots of people are doing alright and wouldn't want to rock the boat.

A lot of it comes down to economics and quality of life.

SF might like to see a prosperous Republic that would look enticing to people in a poorer failed NI.

But that is all based on the big assumption by SF that people in the Republic will want unification no matter what.

And that is one big assumption.

Lots of people in the Republic just see belligerent people when they look north and that is no way just loyalists.

And that view is copperfastened by shinners on the likes of boards firing off insults at those in the Republic and continously whining about how we left them.

Another thing that could scupper unification is SF entering government in the Republic and actually trying to implement some of their crazy policies.

Speedline · 09-05-2022 05:14PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037333#Comment_119037333

You have one unionist poster saying the protocol is fine, another saying it has to go, partitionists saying we can't afford the North, another saying we want it doing badly, talk about clutching at straws with them.

FrancieBrady · 09-05-2022 05:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037453#Comment_119037453

And sure republicans or nobody in the north ever got insulted here. 😁

You are a glass half empty person and alright Jack. That's fine, I don't believe you have anything approaching a majority here. If it is shown that a UI is an investment in our future then there will be a landslide here.

ancapailldorcha · 09-05-2022 05:36PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037316#Comment_119037316

Yes, it is. It was the Brits who threatened a hard border, it was the Brits who used NI as a pawn and it's the Brits who've threatened repeatedly to repeal the deal they themselves negotiated and signed.

trashcan · 09-05-2022 05:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037235#Comment_119037235

Well it’s the Unionists who want to ditch the protocol, so you might want to have word with them. Let them know they’re doing fine !

FrancieBrady · 09-05-2022 05:46PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037580#Comment_119037580

The rampant victimhood will ensure all that is ignored.

blanch152 · 09-05-2022 07:48PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037459#Comment_119037459

It doesn't matter whether they are right or wrong, there are so many of them that they will vote a united Ireland down in a border poll.

blanch152 · 09-05-2022 07:49PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037617#Comment_119037617

The only rampant victimhood comes from Sinn Fein.

FraserburghFreddie · 09-05-2022 08:32PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037596#Comment_119037596

Just as not every Irish person who would like to see a UI is`nt an extremist republican,not all unionists are extremists either.Some of us(whether from NI or elsewhere in the UK)see the protocol as an advantage to NI and are trying to be realistic about the situation.The EU having some say in British affairs is uncomfortable for British people but is probably necessary following brexit,although needs tweaking to a degree.

The fantasy world some extremist republicans inhabit in which things like funding a UI is an inconvenience they wave away whilst trying to cod everyone "it`ll be grand " is bizarre.

Speedline · 09-05-2022 11:14PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119038259#Comment_119038259

Northern Ireland would come on leaps and bounds under a UI, and would be self funding in no time.

ancapailldorcha · 09-05-2022 11:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119038259#Comment_119038259

The EU has no say in British affairs. NI is in its single market for goods and therefore must adhere to the rules of it.

Decadent Unionists will always be livid unless they can establish full cultural control over NI, thankfully a fantasy. The protocol is fine. The DUP knew what they were voting for.