F1 2022 thread - see post 1 for rules

AMKC

I for one would love to see Daniel at Alpine and back to racing good again next year as he neven should have went to Mclaren in the first place. It was a mistake but then he never should have left Red Bill either.

I wish Daniel and Alonso all the best for next year and I wish Piastri and his management a horrible time next year as punishment for him running away from the team that gave him the opportunity to get into F1.

klose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433379#Comment_119433379

I mean Alonso has duped Alpine, Piastri has by all accounts done nothing wrong contractually. Sure, Alpine gave him his shot being their junior is all but can't begrudge the lad a shot in a competitive car over sitting on the sidelines again for another season.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433498#Comment_119433498

He would not have being sitting on the sidelines again for another season. He would have been in the Alpine who had him as there junior like you say and spent lots of effort and time on him. Alpine are also ahead of Mclaren at the moment in the constructors standings. He should have being happy when they said he was racing for them instead of going to Mclaren.

Then if it did not work out at Alpine for him next year he could have went to Mclaren then.

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433616#Comment_119433616

Why would he drive for Alpine if he could get a deal he preferred at another team? Accordingly to reports, the contract between Piastri and Alpine had expired the day before , so he was entitled to arrange another seat if he could. And he did so. He didn't break any contracts.

Alonso screwed Alpine. Lied straight to their face which (intentionally or not) allowed Piastri's contract to expire whixh gave him the freedom to arrange a Mclaren drive. What do you think about that?

chicorytip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433724#Comment_119433724

You can see Flavio Briatore pulling strings in the background here He is Alonso's manager and was Mark Webber's during his driving career- the same Webber who is now Piastri's manager and who also happens to be a close personal friend of Fernando.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433724#Comment_119433724

Why would he drive for Alpine if he could get a deal he preferred at another team?

Because they trained him up and put lots of effort and time into him.

mickdw

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433991#Comment_119433991

But as far as he knew when looking around for other seats, alpine were not going to be able to offer him a seat for 23 due to Alonso signing for another year.

If it was as simple as that, I wouldn't blame Piastri BUT it all looks like the management behind Alonso and Piastri knew exactly what they were doing and intentionally pulled the rug from under alpine and made them look bad along with it.

Piastri should have quietly gone to alpine even after they announced him as driving for 23 and made them aware and issued a joint statement to reverse it and let everyone save face and maybe keep so sort of relationship.

Renault have been around F1 for along time and much of that time with the winning engine. Not a smart move to publicly humiliate such a company who had supported him heavily.

Burkie1203

https://twitter.com/OconEsteban/status/1555607703292084227?t=QOIGHuM-2u_GTDscN18-yg&s=19

LOL ......

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433991#Comment_119433991

That's a very idealistic and servile attitude. Alpine would dump him if they felt it suited them and he should do the same. They were outside the contract which obliged Piastri to do what Alpine told him.

They made a contract, and Piastri fulfilled his contract. Alpine tried to strong arm him into driving for them by simply announcing him as their driver, even though they knew he had free reign to find a seat elsewhere. Is that good behaviour?

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119434317#Comment_119434317

Renault had a winning engine when the technology had been done to death and the engines were all roughly the same. They haven't won anything with the post 2014 engine and they won't win anything with it either (flukey Ocon win in a wet Hungary aside). They're never going to compete at the front with such an unambitious engine programme.

Even red bull couldn't compete at the front with the post 2014 Renault engine. So Alpine has no chance.

Piastri isn't livestock to be moved from paddock to paddock as Alpine want. They announced him as their driver whe. He was contractually free to sign for anyone. What was he going to be paid? What were his conditions? Very difficult to negotiate when you're accepting the drive just because they announced it and hope you 'go quietly'.

Things an astonishing attitude to labour. He should just go quietly and accept whatever slop Alpine feed him? He needs Mick Lynch advocating for him, not @mickdw

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119434812#Comment_119434812

They made a contract, and Piastri fulfilled his contract. Alpine tried to strong arm him into driving for them by simply announcing him as their driver, even though they knew he had free reign to find a seat elsewhere. Is that good behaviour?

No it's not good behavior you are right but what the other three drivers and there managers got up to was not good behavior either.

muckwarrior

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119429638#Comment_119429638

He may have had a torrid time at McLaren, but he was a top driver, so obviously they'd be hoping he can regain that form. It'd be fairly low risk for them to give him a 1 year contract, or maybe a longer one with strict performance clauses in it. Especially since they can probably get him for a fraction of the price they paid him before.

flazio

Channel 4 could get themselves a rating boost for Spa if Mark Webber is part of the presentation team.

Lawlesz

Scott Mitchell discussed it on The Race during the week. The understanding was that Alpine were giving Alonso a 1 year deal, with the option on the teams side for a second year. Alonso, being Alonso, was upset by this, and the thought that he was keeping the seat warm for a young whipper snapper. On the other side, Alpine were trying to place Piastri at Williams to serve his apprenticeship for a season or two, which he/his management was not keen on. Seems like both drivers were upset/insulted by the deals on offer which made them look elsewhere.

Then add in the fact that there is a whole other layer to this, with Alonso and Webbers relationship, Flavio lurking in the background etc. its fairly clear it was a coordinated move from both driver camps to make sure they both got what they wanted and punished Alpine for trying to string them both along.

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119435059#Comment_119435059

Sure. There's no great example of good behaviour by any of the parties in this case. So why are you only pissed off at Piastri?

flazio

Interesting to see the Tommy Byrne documentary "Crash and Burn" was added to Disney+ yesterday.

McFly85

The fault is Alpines if they let his contract lapse. They put a lot of time into his development but if he was that important to them then they should have sewn him up regardless of their plans for next year.

rock22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436026#Comment_119436026

Unless the rumours that Webber refused to return their calls are true.

Wonder will Alpine consider going to court ( in France presumably)

klose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119433616#Comment_119433616

Up untill Vettels retirement and all this kicked off he was going to be sitting on the sidelines next season as Alonso would have still been at Alpine. Did Piastri/Webber know vettel was retiring meaning Alonso would just ship to Aston? Hardly. They were obviously negotiating all this with mclaren before any of that kicked off, the vettel/alonso switch just happened at the same time.

I agree it's **** from Piastri not staying "loyal" to Renault/Alpine but its a cut throat business and you have to take your chances when you get em asap.

Alpine are 4 points ahead of Mclaren in the constructors and that's with a massively struggling Ricciardo on board. If Ricciardo was pulling similar results to Norris they would be miles ahead of Alpine.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119435830#Comment_119435830

Because he does not appreciate how lucky he was to have Alpine develop him and give him a chance to get into F1. What harm would a year or two at Williams have done him? It done George Russell no harm.

I Have a feeling the Piestri will regret moving straight into Mclaren with the extra pressure and what will be expected of him there. He could end up like Kevin Magnussen at his stint in Mclaren. They will be a lot more pressure on him at Mclaren than if he had went to Williams.

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436396#Comment_119436396

Ah be serious. You think he should spend a couple of years at Williams out of loyalty, instead of taking a seat at Mclaren?

If he's ready to step up, he'd be a fool to muck about at the worst team on the grid.

Mclaren want him and he wants Mclaren. There's no loyalty in reality. And outside a contract there isn't even an expectation of loyalty.

mickdw

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119434879#Comment_119434879

I said he should have gone quietly to them to reverse it, release a joint statement and keep his options open for the future, not accept the drive.

You are taking a very narrow view of Renault performance in F1. Yes they didn't win titles with the hybrid engines but they did win a number of races with red bull in the hybrid era. They are a serious manufacturer with a history in F1 as good as anyone out there. I'm thinking 10 or more titles as an engine supplier in the years since 1990 - the length I've been watching F1.

Piastri has got involved here with Alonso and flavio, yesterdays men with a grudge.

If he goes well and is the equal of Norris at McLaren, he will be on safe ground.

If he is looking for other seats in a couple of years, well he might be a sorry boy to have pissed all over Renault.

Hijpo

https://twitter.com/Formula24hrs/status/1555867177332490240?t=Sk8pKdab8k2lVeSYNhK66w&s=19

"According to a report from racingnews365, however, Pierre Gasly has an exit clause in his contract that allows him to leave Alpha Tauri if the team approaching him is higher in the standings. "

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436572#Comment_119436572

Both he and Renault did each other dirty. Loyalty is a lovely idea. But it doesn't exist in F1.

I doubtbhes burned his bridges at Alpine. Could end up there yet. It depends on whether he's good. If he's crap, Alpine might be highly principled and never hire him. If he's good and Alpine want him, they'd hire him in a heartbeat. In other words, there is absolutely no principle.

guyfo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436396#Comment_119436396

The idea of "Loyalty" in F1 is just hilarious to me. People didnt get to where they are in F1 by making sure they didn't step on anyone's toes. Motorsport is cutthroat.

Look at George Russell, he played the loyalty game and got rewarded with 3 years stuck at the back and by the time he got to the big team it wasn't on top anymore, and his carrot on a stick was Mercedes... not the mid-field Alpine.

Hamilton jumped ship from McLaren, Alsonso from Renault (3 times now) Vettel and Riccardo from RB and I could go on. The idea of Alpine training up Oscar is a bit of a push too, they only started their support after he won Euro F3 in his rookie season, another team was always going to snap him up if they couldn't.

Oscar is a man who won the Euro f3 championship, then the FIA F3 championship and FIA F2 championship first time of asking and should have been in a seat this year. Instead he is on the sidelines because of his links to Alpine and they were going to stick him into the worst team in the grid for at least a season after that. Why on earth would he not jump an opportunity with a team that is performing vetter than Alpine themselves and would actually put him in their car?

guyfo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119436396#Comment_119436396

Can you elaborate on the Alpine "developing" Piastri statement? Back it up with some facts etc?

From what I can see he was well into his career, was already with the best team for junior series (prema) and had a deal signed in FIA F3 for the 2020 season before Alpine took him on, so I'm struggling to see what they actually did for him bar come in after he had proved himself in Euro F3 and make him unappealing to other teams for a seat this year.

dulpit

Odd that nobody seems to be talking much about how McLaren look in all this. Currently have 2 very messy contract issues ongoing, I can only assume it's Zac Brown stirring it in the background. Whereas Aston Martin swooped in and got their deal done quickly, McLaren are looking like the villain of the piece.

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437228#Comment_119437228

I don't see it that way. They were hamstrung by Ricciardo's poor performance but he also had all the contract power. Now they can give him a few bob and 'allow' him to go to Alpine. Ricciardo gets what he wants, Piastri gets what he wants and mclaren get what they want. Alpine are the only one losing out. Mclaren and Ricciardo did a good bit of business.

I'm assuming Ricciardo ends up at Alpine.

Burkie1203

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437330#Comment_119437330

Unless the Gasly clause sees Alpine swoop for him. Leaving Ric out in the cold.

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119437341#Comment_119437341

Yeah I suppose. 2 French drivers isn't ideal though. It sounds good but it's actually covering the same base twice. Ideally they'd have a driver from the top 2 markets they want to expand into. I've no idea who Alpine want to market their cars to though.

Driver nationality aside, I'd prefer Gasley Ricciardo. Gasley isn't having a standout season like the last 2, but he's a good driver with decent experience now. He'd be my pick if he's available and it doesn't cost too much to pay him and buy him out of his AT contract.