Is there an argument to be made for increasing police firm-handedness in Dublin?

Sleepy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117734506#Comment_117734506

Incentivise educational attainment perhaps? A tiered rate of unemployment assistance based on educational level attained could be worth investigating... You could use the FETAC levels to ensure trade based skills would be recognised.

I'm sure it wouldn't work for everyone but I can see it encouraging young people to upskill (e.g. hairdressing/plumbing apprenticeships) that they may only initially take on with the intention of getting higher dole but once the prospect of decent wages was in front of them I suspect many would be encouraged to join the workforce.

Kermit.de.frog

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/a-gang-of-8-to12-men-and-women-began-violently-attacking-people-along-the-boardwalk-irish-olympian-jack-woolley-victim-of-horrific-attack-in-dublin-last-night-40751343.html

Sad but not surprising.

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117754882#Comment_117754882

It's an absolute shame that he was caught unawares and wasn't able to dish out a well deserved hiding.

If that can happen to a trained fighter in the city, what chance do the rest of us stand?

Agis_IV

Yes, but not in terms of assaulting people needlessly.

Bratton's NYPD is an example. L

Likely wouldn't work as the Guards is an institutional basket case.

Attempts to destroy the organization in which I once served have failed to date. I'm not hopeful for the future of Law Enforcement on this island.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117755593#Comment_117755593

Doesn’t matter how good a fighter anyone is with regard to their chances.

As you say he was caught unawares, anyone caught unawares like that is going to stand very little chance of gaining the upper hand on their attacker(s).

I do wish there was something could be done about it, but they just appear to be random attacks on random people. I don’t think it was the case that Jack was attacked because of who he is.

This was just another example of it I read about the other day -

https://www.thejournal.ie/dublin-disgrict-court-two-men-charged-with-alleged-rape-of-a-man-5519670-Aug2021/

Completely random, just utter scumbags.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117718561#Comment_117718561

I missed the point? Don't be daft. People from outside Dublin who get to live here and earn money from the place should be grateful for the fact that there's at least one reasonably-sized economic unit in the country to give them employment instead of moaning about the city. And people who don't live in the city just don't know, so their opinions aren't worth the paper they are (or in this case aren't) printed on.

dublinman1990

The pictures that were from the attack on Jack Woolley look really grim.

Whoever had the motives to do this attack on him in front of his friends should have a lot of regret afterwards while they carried out this attack. He was someone who became a national hero for taking part in one of the most watched major sports tournaments in the whole world. He was given this platform to improve himself to maybe make him become a professional athlete in a sport that is not recognised here that much on the Irish airwaves.

However; I do wonder how big the impact of this story could become in the future. I have a little theory that this attack on this young man will enpower more young people living here to take up Taekwando when they have free time outside of school. It will help them give a stepping stone in improving their self defence in later life when they become adults if they encounter these horrible scumbags out on the streets.

If that trend helps more young kids to become active in this sport here. That could be a big help to reduce low level crime in future.

crooked cockney villain

Where and who are the other people apparently attacked?

Why keep proceeding down the boardwalk if you see this happening if you're not intending to intervene?

How was an elite martial artist caught so unaware, plus why is his mother saying something like he chose not to fight back? Why would an elite level fighter choose not to resist?

Dublin city centre is a heavily policed area, especially at the weekend. How long were this group hanging around attacking passers by?

Something doesn't add up for me here I'm afraid.

batman_oh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117760740#Comment_117760740

Taekwondo is what it is, especially in the Olympic style. It's a sport with a self defense element but doesn't really prepare you very well for being attacked by randoms on the street (especially not multiple). It's almost entirely focused on flashy kicking with next to zero punching. Sure you will be better off than a random person and will be better equipped to stop yourself being bashed but it doesn't turn you into Jason Bourne. A lot of the stuff is not applicable in a real life situation.

crooked cockney villain

He also says on in his Instagram there were a "handful of us hospitalised". Garda statement says one man was and mentions no other victims.

Hmm....

mikethecop

Who was it again that objected to the public order units being allowed to drive in and around temple bar and the inner city because they felt it was intimidation of the young people enjoying he lock down on south William street ?

they really dont have our best interests in mind do they ?

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117760049#Comment_117760049

It’s a nice theory, but there’s no realistic chance of that happening when by all accounts even with the skills he has, Jack chose not to employ them to defend himself. Anyone looking at that is unlikely to be thinking it’s a good sport to teach self-defence!

Far more likely scumbags that carry out these sorts of attacks on people are inspired by the likes of scumbags like Conor McGregor - they’re not particularly interested in self-defence, but rather how to sucker-punch innocent people who aren’t expecting it.

The fact that it took Jack Woolley being attacked to highlight the issue means it’ll be back to business as usual by this time next week.

saabsaab

Every night there should be a unit on standby down a side street. I saw this in Bolton many years back about 20 armoured police with batons and riot shields with an armoured van just standing ready for anything to kick off. Nothing did that night.

Kermit.de.frog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117762993#Comment_117762993

At least it is being highlighted.

I do wonder is the boardwalk more trouble than it's worth. Most Dubs keep away from it because they know but visitors and tourists don't know.

Removing the boardwalk might improve things a bit along there.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117765509#Comment_117765509

I don't think it's just the boardwalk, simply cause umpteen times I've seen problems the other side of the traffic lane also.

It's just that north side juncture perhaps?

Or the mentality and subculture the city council has allowed to fester around that area for decades?

It completely defeats my understanding how this is allowed to happen; carelessness, glamorization of teh "bad boy" subculture by trashy girls who want to get pregnant as early and often as possible so encourage thugs who'll facilitate that?

Affect of Irish alcohol culture on city governance... ?

I like the idea of a unit being on standby, and it's not exactly difficult to implement either. The resources are clearly there but administration is obviously lacking.

I've seen this on the continent every time you get that thug-group "thing", a squad of heavy handed officers put an end to it in double quick time - but then the hill-billys would probably cry out from their den of insecurity about how quashing thug practice in Dublin is turning us into a Robocop style "police state"....

lol

imbéciles

Sierra Oscar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117762886#Comment_117762886

Eamon Ryan, he didn't like the sight of the public order unit dealing with serious anti-social behaviour on South William Street. The result? The public order unit has by and large been stood down, is no longer allowed to pro-actively patrol the streets, its members barred from making arrests and only allowed to intervene after regular Gardaí come under attack.

Completely reactive policing and disconnected from what the community actually want, in my view anyway.

In fact one time I was catching the bus out to belfield that leaves from bachelors walk and some absolutely drunk-off-his-face grease ball, actually tried to steal my shoulder bag from right in front of me (I'd left it beside me on the side walk as I was waiting).

He was obviously just walking by, saw it, bent down to pick it up and thought an easy nights work.

As he had his back to me and as I was basically looking on all the while, I was lining up my stance to swing a soccer kick in between his legs and score the match winning goal using his nuts.

Just as I was about to release this sidewinder from the next fucking postal code into this POS thief scum bags family jewels, this dude beside me tapped me on the shoulder and assured me if I did what I was about to do, I'd be spending the rest of the night at the garda barracks, and that this drunken imbeciles type were heavily protected by law enforcement from victimization, being "homeless" (despite the fact they get 225 euro into their bank accounts each week from the Irish state).

....and that I'd just have to swallow my pride, ask the dude to "please don't steal my belongings", and leave it at that.

He said he catches the bus from there daily and sees the same type of behavior, all the time, nothing you can do but mind your things and if something goes missing, your problem - thief has impunity.

lol

So again I ask, affect of alcohol culture, trashy girl encouragement, incompetent city council administration.... ??

Kermit.de.frog

The gardai keep saying there is enough patrols and visibility but anyone who spends time in the city center, especially the northside, knows that is just not true. Yeah, you'll see the odd guard, patrol car now and again but mostly you won't see any guards.

MrMusician18

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/crime/two-arrested-after-man-subjected-24721966?utm_source=taboola&utm_medium=display&utm_campaign=organic

Another horrific incident to add to the litany of lawlessness affecting the City Centre particularly of late

Kermit.de.frog

The mayor of Dublin was on the radio a few days a go saying "we have to understand the route causes of alcohol and drug abuse"...

I think time has past for this puff talk which is code for doing nothing in the here and now to most people.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/crime/one-gardas-story-of-working-in-dublin-im-hitting-burnout-there-are-not-enough-gardai-on-streets-40772870.html

My opinion on dealing with gangs of youth under 18 is to go after the parents through the welfare system. Set up some threshold whereby after a number of instances parent's welfare is deducted and warnings issued over their housing if the situation is bad enough.

One way or another a serious toughening up is needed.

Mannix Flynn made great points about the reality of the situation in the area on the radio.

https://mobile.twitter.com/PatKennyNT/status/1428436189950922755

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117784251#Comment_117784251

"Route causes of alcohol and drug abuse".

lol, with all due respect to the mayor, that's not exactly going to be his area of expertise.

The day that is understood will revolutionize humanity the world over.

His job would appear more so to MANAGE the issue in the interim whilst we're waiting on this revolutionary scientific development.

To me the most advanced city in the world is up to this point, Amsterdam - so simply follow the functional template they've established - exactly what space-cake Eamon Ryan obstructed; enforcement units to manage and tackle group violence and intimidation which is rife throughout the entire city, free wheeling at this point.

How wonderful would it be to see some gang of scrots just getting "dealt with", exactly as per functional continental cities.

This Mannix dude is claiming it is a case of resources.

Pro-active policing plan.

He seems to think Helen Mac is a f**k up.

Body cams may preclude social media backlash.

Eoin Keegan - DCC manager, making avoidant statements? Administrators have dropped the ball seems to be his primary contention.

What's with the complication?

Enforcement units around the city, and start enforcing. 🤨

Kermit.de.frog

I think it's refreshing to hear a Councillor telling it as it is without the bullsh!t. We need more of that. The Gardai and justice dept need to get the finger out.

What he says is 100% correct. People just will not go in to the city because as things are now the perception is it is not safe. I feel sorry for any tourists/visitors too. If they are not mugged or assaulted the best we get is embarrassment.

It's a complete disgrace and another thing - has anyone heard anything from the Justice minister?

Kermit.de.frog

Apparently some charities are randomly handing out tents. I feel really sorry for anyone like that. Above all living in a tent in the center of the city is incredibly dangerous. :/ Also it may be fine now but if we get a really cold winter it would be a very serious thing for them.

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117786457#Comment_117786457

You're actually correct Kermit , there's mainstream charities with outreach staff working in conjunction with the Central Placement Device in DCC trying to get rough sleepers off the streets and into accommodation and then there's the Facebook, soup run type charities handing out tents and sleeping bags encouraging individuals to keep rough sleeping.

Kermit.de.frog

Sounds like the most vulnerable people being used to create an image in the city for the public whereby the "charity" gets more money in the end.

Although safety in shelters is obviously an issue I just can't help but think there is a lot of cynicism and manipulation around this issue by vested interests.

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117802585#Comment_117802585

Safety in shelters or hostels is regularly rolled out as a reason not to use hostels , there's a variety of different types of hostels and while definitely not for the faint hearted , they are not the end of the world type of environment as portrayed by some groups.

https://www.finegael.ie/actions-to-tackle-anti-social-behaviour-in-dublin-and-improve-community-safety-welcome-madigan/

Sound like lip-service to anyone else;

lol, more CCTV, are they trying to get more footage for their skanger hand puppet twitter page?

Umpteen disturbing scrot and anti-social behavior incidences caught on CCTV, but not a single one of them shows effective intervention.

Youth scumbag culture thrives on fear and intimidation, until the state realizes that responding in kind and putting the "fear of God" into said perpetrators is the EXCLUSIVE effective measure, I can't see anything changing.

Again, I defer to the wonderful city of Amsterdam, you know how many sick/crazy assclowns wander the streets there?

But it's perfectly safe at all times of day or night?

Put that in perspective of their enforcement protocol and it quickly becomes evident there's only one way to get it done (+ nobody complains about a brigade of Robocop stunt doubles running the place either).

enricoh

Was in Edinburgh a few years ago and around 2 in the morning I went down some side street and a couple of cop transit vans sitting there with cops waiting if something flared up. Any lads scrapping outside the clubs would get literally a minute before the cops arrived.

It'd be ground breaking over here!

Kermit.de.frog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117803880#Comment_117803880

There are plenty of videos of scraps going on from start to finish for minutes on end on O'Connell St, not a guard to be seen. That's the "main street" in a capital city. I can't think of a single other capital city in Europe where street fighting would last more than a minute on such a prominent place without police intervention.

I think the problem in Dublin is standards. This seems to be the acceptable standard. The gardaí are not fit for purpose in the city. It needs it's own specially resourced police force that caters to modern fast response city policing. And we need the justice system fixed.

Everything else proposed instead is just waffle.