Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Seathrun66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019250#Comment_118019250

How about this. 67% of the 74 patients in the ICU at the weekend were unvaccinated. And 3% partially vaccinated so not protected. The figures are consistent, nearly 70% of the places in ICU are currently taken up by people who didn't bother to protect themselves with a vaccine.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/hse-and-private-hospitals-in-talks-over-tackling-900-000-waiting-list-1.4696425

Nyero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019200#Comment_118019200

Or go to a place that's not checking passports. (which is most places it seems)

Or bring a fake passport.

Passports also mean extra staff and extra operating costs.

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019000#Comment_118019000

There is no difference between the percentage Sweden`s older population and that of it`s Nordic neighbours Denmark, Finland and Norway. Massive difference in Covid deaths between Sweden and the other three.

Seathrun66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019309#Comment_118019309

6% of the adult population unvaccinated and with such a sociopathic lack of concern for others that they selfishly choose to not protect them. Instead they leave it to children to take their place. What does that say about such people?

Is the vaccine efficacy of the first round of people who got vaccinated , beginning to expire? It has been over 6 months Could be why middle aged are the most of the admissions, given elderly are getting their 3rd dose.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019364#Comment_118019364

I think anybody who would fake a covid passport rather than get the free vaccine is a bit pathetic.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019293#Comment_118019293

Your parents could never meet an unvaccinated person and still catch covid. I don't get why certain posters struggle with the basics, yet still manage to act so self-righteous.

Healio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019438#Comment_118019438

The 10th Sept was the day 90% figures was hit.

From September 11th onwards there have been 44,769* positive cases reported, allowing for the 14 days (from Sep 25th that's 26,185).

For arguments sake if 100% of these cases were from the anti-vaxxers 300k figure, who will be the scapegoat when the pool runs out?

*gathered from daily cases chart (https://covid19ireland-geohive.hub.arcgis.com/)

Seathrun66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019361#Comment_118019361

How about you stop questioning clear statistics. Unvaccinated people are worsening the situation in our hospitals. They're less than 6% of the population yet are taking almost all the resources that could be used elsewhere. It's extremely selfish. And it's extremely stupid.

Seathrun66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019332#Comment_118019332

Only 74.4% of the entire population is vaccinated. Not yet enough.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019271#Comment_118019271

Its almost as if you never heard Joe Duffy before.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019309#Comment_118019309

Is alcoholic liver disease or lung cancer contagious?

B2021M

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019427#Comment_118019427

I agree but a previous post implied that Sweden did a lot worse than us

Seathrun66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019484#Comment_118019484

(0% of adults. On Oct 11 we had only 74.4% of the entire population vaccinated. Thus 300,000 children will need to take the place of the 300,000 selfish anti-vaxxers who chose not to protect the elderly.

Nyero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019486#Comment_118019486

There is nothing selfish or stupid about it.

I was speaking to 2 unvaccinated people recently and their arguments for not getting vaccinated were sincere.

For example one of them took the swine flu vaccine and now suffers side effects.

seamus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019332#Comment_118019332

It's basically because we're exposed to the UK who have had and continue to have the worst case numbers in all of Europe.

We are the only country who cannot put controls on travel in and out of the UK. The UK has been on an upward trend since the start of October, and so we get dragged along with them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019508#Comment_118019508

nope but is holding people accountable for the welfare of older and vulnerable people ad infinitum fair???

so lets have a look. The covid certs stay ok but social distancing is axed and masks in nightclub are no longer allowed.

The young people go out like young people do and live up the 18 months they've missed in one wave.. They kiss, fondle and sleep with whomever they want, as is their right.. But a person masked up looking to sit out of the cold immunosuppressed, can not?? they drink coffee in the rain?

But I can go clubbing and lick every face and ashtray cos I'm vaxxed??? that's the logic here is it?? the numbers stay were they are as long as the unvaxed are kept outside or away from the dinner table?? give over will you.

shesty

This is actually becoming a far more multi-faceted problem.

Two examples - I mentioned here before I had been suffering an ear problem the last 2 weeks. I ended up in Beaumont A&E (for the first time in my life) through a combination of factors - not being able to get to a GP directly to look at the ear (phone call appointments only due to Covid, no same day or next day appointments due to surgeries being overwhelmed). Eventually after 2 different prescriptions of increasing strength, I rang the eye and ear hospital. No A&E emergency walk-ins due to covid, emergencies by phone appointment only, and not same day appointments. Since I was in quite an amount of pain, I was directed to Beaumont A&E. Which was flooded with people. I just added to the crowd, absolutely unnecessarily, but without any other options, what was I supposed to do?

Second example - a child I know has had a viral cough all week. Not covid, she was tested, but is running a temperature and is an asthmatic. Yesterday the cough got worse, parents got worried. An eventual phone appointment with the GP told them to go to Temple St A&E because "a doctor" needed to listen to the child's chest, and THAT doctor couldn't do it because it was 5pm, and she couldn't take the child in for an appointment and the A&E was their best bet. Off to Temple St they went, got there around 7 and there was a queue of parents out the door waiting to register at the reception to be seen in the A&E. The next 7 hours she spent sitting in a room with a load of other parents in a similar boat, just so someone could listen to the child's chest (and she was fine, no medication needed).

THIS IS THE REAL PROBLEM. I apologies for the capitals, but I am sick to death at this point of seeing these headlines and stories about "not enough vaccinated" people, and comments that the general Irish populace are somehow the source of all problems through their behaviour and are causing this. There are almost 90% of the population vaccinated. I mean we cannot get any better, bar maybe a percent or two. Why can we not not turn our attention to the actual problem - the health service. Why are we obsessing about the properties of vaccines (in use around the world and doing just fine in other countries), about what activities we are and aren't allowed to do, about whether you can dine indoors and outdoors, about whether masks should be worn or not. This is just distracting away from the actual problem - the Health Service. We have stored up this problem by having non-stop restrictions in place for months, and then obviously once people start getting back together, all the usual stuff starts doing the rounds, the Health Service can't cope, and we are back at Square one.Sure they could introduce more restrictions, but I think at this point we all know how that plays out - everyone hunkers down for the winter, hospitals clear, we start to get a drop in Covid cases, public are howling for freedom come Jan/Feb, we s-l-o-w-l-y lift restrictions, real life starts to resume in maybe....May (insert time period for booster vaccines)....we start to get back to normal and then bam, September hits and there we are again, hospitals overflowing, and there we go again.

For the life of me I cannot figure out when we are going to grow up and address the actual problem.We are solving nothing by this, we need to actually take the bull by the horns here and either figure out a different way to channel covid patients through the Health System in order to cater for the normal Winter overflow, or else implement drastic and radical change in the HEalth Service as it exists. Which of course won't happen overnight, but hasn't even started. We are going nowhere in our current format.

Rant over.

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019486#Comment_118019486

A good point maybe to link to this piece from August on why some are doing so.

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/health-family/why-we-re-not-getting-the-covid-19-vaccine-irish-times-readers-share-their-reasons-1.4650503

Also a link to an explanation to the well-known phenomenon of the 5Cs and vaccine hesitancy.

https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19-vaccine/news/20210608/targeting-covid-vaccine-hesitancy-what-are-the-5cs

Seathrun66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019521#Comment_118019521

Not implied it but demonstrated it. Sweden had 38% more deaths per capita than us despite having more than three times the living area per capita and thus being far more rural.

Seathrun66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019462#Comment_118019462

Absolutely. It's also a €2,000 fine and a criminal record for fraud.

Ozvaldo

What this spineless shower will do is keep the covid certs for indoor dining and pubs which will include sitting you at a table with social distancing -I can see them keeping the same opening hours as now on top of this.

next bank holiday weekend will be a disaster same as all year all out on the streets at 1130 pm

floorpie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019486#Comment_118019486

This is senseless stuff. There are more cases/hospitalisations/deaths amongst vaccinated people today, than the entire country on this day last year, at which time we were put in level 5 due to the numbers.

The primary reasons for negative developments now are 1) Most important: Delta variant, 2) Lowered restrictions, 3) Restrictions are even less for vaccinated people but vaccination does not prevent infection or transmission, 4) Flu season.

GeorgeBailey

The ISAG lads must be delighted by this latest flurry of doom-laden soundbites. Just when they were disappearing into obscurity they've been thrown a lifeline.

Scuid Mhór

Media running with a continuation of covid certificates beyond Oct 22. If the government decides to do this, I would hope closing times are extended beyond 11.30. Of covid certificates and separate table seating is going to be continued, does that mean nightclubs will still be closed for the foreseeable? Probably.

B2021M

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019649#Comment_118019649

Not arguing further but they have significantly higher proportion of older people so the 38% is not fully like-for-like.

CorkRed93

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019743#Comment_118019743

an absolute farce if so. jazz weekend in cork next week, 11.30 closing times and separate tables + capacity restrictions will be a killer to pubs/clubs/hotels. all this after reopening was promised (again)

Scuid Mhór

I suppose the real ramification of this is that if restrictions cannot be lifted on Oct 22, it’s basically an admission that we will probably never live in a post-covid society. Restrictions will be something seasonal, or perhaps cyclical dependent on case numbers, for the rest of our lives, unless a better vaccine were to be produced that could stop symptomatic infection from manifesting. That is a tough pill to swallow, especially for someone like me - I had so much faith in a return to normality predicated on vaccine dissemination.

rob316

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019773#Comment_118019773

Or you put the investment and restructuring of the HSE a top priority. We will need a new government though, FFG have had control of it for decades and never improved it.

Seasonal restrictions will just kill hospitality, why would you bother open a business to trade 9/12 months in a year.

bokale

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118019682#Comment_118019682

Sounds good!

I couldn't hack things moving backwards again. But the way things are now are grand sure.