UEFA refuse to sanction illuminating Munich Stadium in rainbow colours

MrStuffins

kowloonkev wrote: »

Fully support UEFA here. Hope they don't bow down to this kind of fascism.

MrStuffins

Christy42 wrote: »

First we have people saying it is a meaningless gesture. Now others are saying that the show of unity is forcing others to do something (I am not really sure what it is forcing anyone to do admittedly).

I'd say with most of these lads it's forcing them to confront those feelings that they have been oppressing for their mate Phil but are too afraid to express

kowloonkev

MrStuffins wrote: »

That's why I said a kind of - as in having similar traits but from a different perspective. How long were you waiting poised to post your little picture that somebody else made and take the credit?

jakiah

Christy42 wrote: »

First we have people saying it is a meaningless gesture. Now others are saying that the show of unity is forcing others to do something (I am not really sure what it is forcing anyone to do admittedly).

"Protest" by decree hasnt really much value. Union Berlin, Hertha Berlin. Augsburg, Wolfsburg, Frankfurt and Cologne (all majority fan-owned football clubs remember) have said they will light up their stadiums in support of LGBT rights, which is good and proper.


Its vital that UEFA stay neutral, no matter how unpalatable to people who focus on these particular rights issues. Doing otherwise opens the door to all kind of politicising of football, indeed you could argue theyve gone too far already.

MrStuffins

kowloonkev wrote: »

That's why I said a kind of ...........

Saying it's a kind of fascism is still saying it's fascism.

Apologies if English is not your first language.

MrStuffins

jakiah wrote: »

Its vital that UEFA stay neutral..........

And LGBT rights are a politically neutral position. So yes, UEFA should be neutral and show support for gay people around the world and inside their own game.

kowloonkev

Christy42 wrote: »

First we have people saying it is a meaningless gesture. Now others are saying that the show of unity is forcing others to do something (I am not really sure what it is forcing anyone to do admittedly).

Well it's basically the hijacking of an event, the build up to the event, and media output of an event by a radical movement. Do you disagree that UEFA is being pressured into being a sort of mouthpiece for a number of activist groups?

The whole tournament has been drowned in nonsense.

Christy42

jakiah wrote: »

"Protest" by decree hasnt really much value. Union Berlin, Hertha Berlin. Augsburg, Wolfsburg, Frankfurt and Cologne (all majority fan-owned football clubs remember) have said they will light up their stadiums in support of LGBT rights, which is good and proper.


Its vital that UEFA stay neutral, no matter how unpalatable to people who focus on these particular rights issues. Doing otherwise opens the door to all kind of politicising of football, indeed you could argue theyve gone too far already.

What decree? Munich wanted to light up their own stadium. There is no decree there. Ukraine has a political jersey. You could argue there are many political jerseys and we have a specific point for the national anthem which will be political for most of the UK countries and Spain and probably others. Politics has been involved in sports since sports existed. Neuer has been wearing a pride armband. Plenty of players have various celebrations that involve religious gestures with said religions tending to play a decent role in politics.

MrStuffins

kowloonkev wrote: »

Well it's basically the hijacking of an event, the build up to the event, and media output of an event by a radical movement.

[Deleted User]

kowloonkev wrote: »

Well it's basically the hijacking of an event, the build up to the event, and media output of an event by a radical movement. Do you disagree that UEFA is being pressured into being a sort of mouthpiece for a number of activist groups?

The whole tournament has been drowned in nonsense.

It's a radical movement to think sporting organisations should support LGBT rights? A member of the org is failing to support such rights so I think it's fair that they should call it out.

jakiah

MrStuffins wrote: »

And LGBT rights are a politically neutral position. So yes, UEFA should be neutral and show support for gay people around the world and inside their own game.

But LGBT rights are not a politically neutral position in many UEFA member states. A sad state of affairs maybe, but true nonetheless.

Christy42

kowloonkev wrote: »

Well it's basically the hijacking of an event, the build up to the event, and media output of an event by a radical movement. Do you disagree that UEFA is being pressured into being a sort of mouthpiece for a number of activist groups?

The whole tournament has been drowned in nonsense.

Human rights as radical? Hungary were the ones that passed the law essentially guaranteeing it would be part of the media no matter what other countries did. The abuse from their fans will have highlighted in this competition. The media can report on whatever the media wants to report on and are free to choose to ignore this story. They did not out of their own free will, the stadium didn't force anyone to do anything.

UEFA do not own the stadium. A stadium that UEFA does not own sending a message does not make UEFA a mouthpiece for anyone. I absolutely disagree with your statement.

kowloonkev

MrStuffins wrote: »

Saying it's a kind of fascism is still saying it's fascism.

Apologies if English is not your first language.

Do you always just repeat forum clichés to try to come across as witty?

[Deleted User]

jakiah wrote: »

But LGBT rights are not a politically neutral position in many UEFA member states. A sad state of affairs maybe, but true nonetheless.

And UEFA have stated more than once that they support human rights so it follows that they should in general call out the states that aren't upholding then.

jakiah

Christy42 wrote: »

What decree? Munich wanted to light up their own stadium.

Its not a municipal stadium, its owned by Bayern and effectively rented to UEFA under contract for the euros.

jakiah

protonmike wrote: »

And UEFA have stated more than once that they support human rights so it follows that they should in general call out the states that aren't upholding then.

Thats not their remit, they are a football administration body not a political organisation.

MrStuffins

jakiah wrote: »

But LGBT rights are not a politically neutral position in many UEFA member states. A sad state of affairs maybe, but true nonetheless.

Human rights are always politically neutral. Just because some politicians are bigots does not make it political.

jakiah

MrStuffins wrote: »

Human rights are always politically neutral. Just because some politicians are bigots does not make it political.

Thats just silly.

kowloonkev

protonmike wrote: »

It's a radical movement to think sporting organisations should support LGBT rights? A member of the org is failing to support such rights so I think it's fair that they should call it out.

What did the Hungarian Football Association say exactly?

MrStuffins

kowloonkev wrote: »

Do you always just repeat forum clichés to try to come across as witty?

No wit here pal. You're just talking absolute pony!

As is always the case, the ones most fervently against homosexuality are normally the ones who are afraid of their own true feelings and desires

Strumms

sprucemoose wrote: »

who have the TV rights to your class, rte or virgin? are ye still at a reduced capacity for spectators or is it back at full?


false equivalencies dont help your argument

The class is broadcast online so anyone not comfortable or unable to be attending can pay, watch and participate, via a zoom link at home...as can any family or friends.

It’s not a false equivalence at all... they’ll start off wanting it at football, then a host of other sports occasions to other things going on in the community, like a gym class....the company I use has over 500 participants nationwide...I’d be resisting that . Soon it could be the likes of a gym class, a concert in Vicar St, before your film in the cinema...demanded of you....

I’ve no issue at this stage with anybody saying... “you know what I’m not doing it”... this is a democracy...the value of democracy underpins our existence... it’s all gone a bit fascist with people shouting down anybody not wiling to do it or disagree with it.

Could be soon “ we’ll you don’t do it, the game is canceled “

Sorry, it’s been done, the bullyboy nature of part of the movement is increasing to irritate.

[Deleted User]

jakiah wrote: »

Thats not their remit, they are a football administration body not a political organisation.

They formed a center for sports and human rights so they very much treat it as within their remit. The org explicitly states that states need to protect human rights. Also has plenty on LGBT rights so yep, they're not upholding the standards they supposedly wish to back
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/social-responsibility/competitions/

kowloonkev

Christy42 wrote: »

UEFA do not own the stadium. A stadium that UEFA does not own sending a message does not make UEFA a mouthpiece for anyone. I absolutely disagree with your statement.

UEFA has a contract with the stadium on match days that give them total control of what is displayed in the ground and around it. If UEFA didn't have such a contract then obviously this wouldn't even be a discussion.

jakiah

protonmike wrote: »

They formed a center for sports and human rights so they very much treat it as within their remit. The org explicitly states that states need to protect human rights. Also has plenty on LGBT rights so yep, they're not upholding the standards they supposedly wish to back
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/social-responsibility/competitions/

They already have measures in place for all of that stuff. Some local politician deciding what they do or dont do is not going to happen.

If they take direction from city mayors in Germany they'll have to take direction from city mayors across the continent. Not going to happen.

MrStuffins

Strumms wrote: »

it’s all gone a bit fascist

Some serious need for dictionaries on this forum.

MrStuffins wrote: »

kowloonkev

MrStuffins wrote: »

No wit here pal. You're just talking absolute pony!

As is always the case, the ones most fervently against homosexuality are normally the ones who are afraid of their own true feelings and desires

The usual reply of these groups when losing an argument of course is to accuse the opponent of homophobia/sexism/racism etc.

Strumms

MrStuffins wrote: »

Some serious need for dictionaries on this forum.

Fascism is characterized and defined by a dictatorial power / organization and forcible suppression of their opposition or anybody disagreeing with an element of their mantra....

No need for a dictionary my friend,,, it’s precisely what the BLM crowd, playbook and supporters are up to.

MrStuffins

kowloonkev wrote: »

The usual reply of these groups when losing an argument of course is to accuse the opponent of homophobia/sexism/racism etc.

That's all well and good but i'm not sure what this has to do with my post.

Christy42

Strumms wrote: »

The class is broadcast online so anyone not comfortable or unable to be attending can pay, watch and participate, via a zoom link at home...as can any family or friends.

It’s not a false equivalence at all... they’ll start off wanting it at football, then a host of other sports occasions to other things going on in the community, like a gym class....the company I use has over 500 participants nationwide...I’d be resisting that . Soon it could be the likes of a gym class, a concert in Vicar St, before your film in the cinema...demanded of you....

I’ve no issue at this stage with anybody saying... “you know what I’m not doing it”... this is a democracy...the value of democracy underpins our existence... it’s all gone a bit fascist with people shouting down anybody not wiling to do it or disagree with it.

Could be soon “ we’ll you don’t do it, the game is canceled “

Sorry, it’s been done, the bullyboy nature of part of the movement is increasing to irritate.

The only actual order or ban in all of this is that they can't use the pride colours on their stadium. Again the only demand that has been made is that this can't happen. I have no idea what the colours on the stadium were for France Hungary or Portgual Hungary. No demands were made for colours. The only time demands happened where when someone wanted to do it.

If you need to ban someone else from doing something so you don't feel it demanded of you then there are other issues at play with nothing to do with Germany.


People disagreeing with you is not shouting down. It is also not bullying.

MrStuffins

Strumms wrote: »

No need for a dictionary my friend,,, it’s precisely what the BLM crowd, playbook and supporters are up to.

DING DING DING DING DING DING DING DING DING DING DING DING !!

Wow! I can't believe it took so long for someone to bring BLM into an argument that has absolutely nothing to do with BLM.

Congratulations!