The Tipperary GAA Discussion Thread

Fred Astaire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117671019#Comment_117671019

Do you ever take a day off with that absolute cack?

Almost salivating at the prospect of Cahill beating Tipperary for some mental reason. Supporting one man over your county is absolutely bizarre.

Cahill can have no complaints that he didn't get the job in 2019 given that the man that was appointed won an All Ireland.

Waterford are not favourites but you keep living in the Cahill-obsessed fantasy land you've created.

PTH2009

How's tickets looking from the Tipp side?

Seems club allocation in Waterford sold out in mins. Raging as I was at the last 2 qualifers

FoFo1254122

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117672326#Comment_117672326

would you stop. I will never shout for anyone but tipp. I hope they win the all Ireland and I am man enough to admit being wrong if they do

there is nothing wrong with calling out poor decisions by sheedy for example The Munster final loss lies fully with sheedy as how he stood and watched the second half unfold without making changes is truly bizarre.

and Waterford are favourites, they go in after trouncing Galway, we go in after being demolished by Limerick in 35 minutes. if tipp are favourites then surely we are also favourites to make the final with Limerick.

time will tell but just remember no excuses on Saturday evening

Ompala

On the subject of our underage teams - it always strikes me (with the exception of the U20/U21 with Cahill) that we tactically seem behind other teams e.g running into space for puckouts vs crowding under a high dropping ball. From our U20 this year I'd argue there was plenty of ability in the team but they looked poor tactically vs Waterford and Cork.

Mad about baa baas

If it's any consolation have a look on the kilkenny thread.. lads on their have the exact same complaints re underage structure..strength and conditioning...stone age tactics

formerlyET

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117675601#Comment_117675601

John Devane might not make the intercounty grade as a manager based on the last two seasons. Some of the positioning and selections...

I think Woodlock picked a very young minor squad/team with an eye on growth/development. He's getting it in the ear now for that decision. Had a number of 15-year-olds in there.

I think something like 16 of the squad are under age again next year. I think the view in some quarters is, you have more of a chance to develop players and gel a team over a two-year period- exposing them to bigger players, losses, and hopefully they'll respond into a stronger team the following year - giving them a longer apprenticeship rather than producing winning teams.

Time will tell.

formerlyET

    I wonder if Sheedy is considering anything like this or will he stay conservative:          

Barry Hogan

C BARRETT       Pauric Maher       Kennedy

                         Dan McC

 A Flynn              Ronan Maher    B Heff

        Paddy Cadell        Willie Connors

Jake Morris              Breen

                          Bubbles

Jason Forde          Mark Kehoe

OR

               Barry Hogan

C BARRETT       Pauric Maher       Kennedy

                               

 A Flynn              Ronan Maher    B Heff

          Paddy Cadell        Dan McC

     Jake Morris      Breen     Mark Kehoe

                         Bubbles

        Jason Forde          Seamus Callanan   

PTH2009

any spare tickets for the game Saturday let me know please

Tipp 77

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117678088#Comment_117678088

Think it's the same as your end nothing to be had

PTH2009

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117678318#Comment_117678318

Yeah the 6000 attendance is a killer

Why was the 7000 touted earlier in the week?

Tipp 77

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117678380#Comment_117678380

God knows to be honest I have had a season ticket since 2012 so you just took your ticket for granted

Ompala

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117678057#Comment_117678057

Can't really see either of those teams lining out, mainly because Sheedy is not one to make huge changes from what has gone before, but some big calls are needed, and we need to react quicker on the line when plan A isn't working. I'd say Waterford will be favourites for this one but I wouldn't be surprised either if Tipp nicked it. I can see us sitting deep to defend against Waterford trying to run through the lines. If we let them run through like the league game their speed will kill us.

formerlyET

Yeah, it looks like a case of a team trying to work off ball movement versus a running game.

But it's knock out now. And it will be a war, and whoever has the most heart and fight will come out on top.

Match ups will be key.

formerlyET

For the Cahill obsessed, it's not a one-man show:

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-40348748.html

formerlyET

Tipperary Senior Hurling team v Waterford:

One change

Barry Hogan

Cathal Barrett

Padraic Maher

Barry Heffernan

Paddy Cadell

Brendan Maher

Ronan Maher

Alan Flynn

Michael Breen

Jason Forde

Noel McGrath

Dan McCormack

Jake Morris

John O'Dwyer

Seamus Callanan

Tipp subs: Brian Hogan, Eoghan Connolly, Willie Connors, Paul Flynn, Mark Kehoe, Seamus Kennedy, Brian McGrath, John McGrath, Niall O'Meara, James Quigley, Dillon Quirke

formerlyET

Eoghan Connolly has done very well to consistently win his place on the bench on a talented panel. Would love to see Connolly come on when they bring on Kiely.

formerlyET

I know I flagged Kennedy has having a bad game the last day. I'm still surprised he was the only one who got the chop. Defo see him coming on. Other players can consider themselves them lucky

Tipp 77

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117684807#Comment_117684807

Definitely.

Mantis Toboggan

Yeah surprised with Kennedy being dropped, thought Niall o Meara would get the start.

No idea how this will go tomorrow, real 50/50, we've obviously got the better players but not sure the fire is still there.

Joe_ Public

Thought we might get a couple of changes but not shocked to see just the one. Sheedy is backing them to deliver a response and know to never write these lads off. The middle is where i worry, get the forces marshalled effectively in that sector and I'd be more than hopeful we'll be ok.

Sweet.Science

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117685039#Comment_117685039

I think most deserve it . Other than the 3rd quarter meltdown nobody really had a bad game .

Brendan Maher and noel McGrath maybe . But they are two of tipperary greatest ever players . And noel could've had 4 points in the first half.

I'd expect to see 5 subs used over the 70mins this time though

farmerval

The narrative reading Friday's papers seems to be a close call, Daly and Enda McEvoy slightly favouring Tipp, Derek predictably expecting a Waterford win.

I assume the change is more tactical than a reflection on who was dropped or not. Waterford the last day withdrew their forwards a lot, leaving Dessie Hutchinson up top on his own lots of the time. I assume that Sunday will be similar, Tipp will look to squeeze hard in the middle third to choke Waterford's running game at source. Waterford have their own particular style, unlike Cork or Limerick who use short quick passes to bypass congestion and tackles Waterford like to step around or run past the nearest opponent and then suck in another opponent before passing on. Tipp do the same a lot with their short puck outs, Barrett or Heffernan step inside or around their man, draw someone else toward them and then play the ball on.

In 2019 in the round robin Tipp used Sean O Brien against teams that they expected to play with three inside forwards and Alan Flynn when they expected a corner forward to play out around mid field. I think Barry Heffernan is really suited to that role, he'll follow his man and defend well but he blends in good time on the ball when Tipp have it along with usually some great fetches as well.

I really have no clue how tomorrow will pan out, we've had Waterford's number when it's counted for a good while, but under Cahill they are improving, how much we'll know tomorrow. We have no reason to believe that Tipp won't perform, this bunch have done it for us for so many times, now's not the time to doubt them.

We probably could have done with three changes, but one it is. Here goes nothing. C'mon Tipp!

osullic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117685556#Comment_117685556

I thought there would be two three. Don’t know how Brendan is still starting at this stage.. I hope to god he proves me wrong today.

Hon Tipp!

FoFo1254122

Poor Seamus Kennedy gets the blame for the collapse. No other way to read it.

hope tipp prove me wrong today and but blahs by 7 for me. their youthful mix of power, speed, skill and confidence to win the day.

but again hope tipp can do it.

formerlyET

Bonnar is a huge loss.

John Mc was an able deputy in 2019. But he has lost all form. Hopefully, someone else can step up.

I'd imagine we'll try 6,7, 8, and 9 with puck outs - see how that goes.

I can't see Cadell playing at 5 - should be switches from the get go. Might be wrong on that.

Will be interesting to see what the formation is and what the tactics are at the beginning of each water break.

FoFo1254122

What do I win.

formerlyET

Rode by the ref a bit.

Had the goals chances to win it. Particularly, John McGrath's goal chances and more. Didn't take them.

We'll be in a transition period now for a bit.

I wouldn't have said that Ronan Maher would have been part of the trim but after today... very unimaginative play and shots.

Sheedy's conservatism has undone him. Way too slow with the subs. And with the likes of Kehoe's energy you have to ask why he wasn't started.

Best of luck to Liam and the lads now. Thanks for the memories and the All-Irelands.

Ompala

While we could have poached it, the better team won in the end. Our passing was terrible in this game, we looked so far off match sharpness it was criminal.

And still, I think we lost this one on the sideline. No coincidence when changes were made we started dragging ourselves back into it, don't buy into any talk that Waterford were tiring.

FoFo1254122

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687144#Comment_117687144

Waterford were by the far better team

But at least it’s good to see you admit some home truths

formerlyET

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687164#Comment_117687164

What are you talking about, you idiot?

Tipp 77

Waterford played well but how much did we hand them from stupid mistakes? Stupid wides as well We were desperate on the sideline too. That's the most disappointing championship defeat for me since 2012. Its going to be a very different championship team next year and for next year's league start all the young lads on the panel

Ompala

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687226#Comment_117687226

Yeah tbf Cahill has made a serious transformation of them, and best of luck to them going forward.

The 2 first half goals in particular were sickening as we should have had control of the ball. I hate to single out players but I was surprised Noel and Brendan stayed on. I was worried about Paudie Maher full back this year but in fairness to him he held solid. I'm expecting this to be the end of a lot of the 2010 group still soldiering on.

We kind of have to go for broke in the league next year and just play all the young players to get them some experience, similar to Cork this year. Talent is definitely there though.

solerina

Tipp beat them selves in many ways, far too many wides, as has been the case all of 2021 and very poor passing were at the core of an overall average performance.

Joe_ Public

Fair play to Liam and Waterford, definitely the better side but final scoreline was a touch unfair i thought. Our shooting and distribution were the two telling factors, thats the big disappointment for me. Lads fumbling balls off the deck, pop passes going over heads etc. And still it was in melting pot into garbage time, 19 times out of 20 that John Mac shot nestles in the back of the net and you don't know how the opposition will react. So it goes!

Some lads will have a decision to make now but that's up to them. Been an absolute joy to watch and support for more than a decade now and died with their boots on today, as you'd expect. Thought Cadell did ok and Kehoe had some impact and has always looked an excellent prospect. As to why he wasn't on sooner or been more of a feature, valid enough question I would say.

formerlyET

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687299#Comment_117687299

That's exactly it. Wides and poor passing. And the younger generations were just as guilty of it. Not an older generation thing at all, not that they were very good but they didn't let the side down. It was a collective problem. It's easy to point at the older lads and management but it was a collective problem. Jake Morris, case in point. It takes time and experience for the youth to develop and come through. It won't happen overnight. Sheedy has done a good job of binging them through, but he was off in his use of subs for me. And Kehoe deserved a start. But people calling for wholesale changes for youth's sake have missed the point.

I have to say Noel bust himself today, he covered the whole field.

Fred Astaire

I thought Noel McGrath was really, really poor and was very lucky to not be taken off.

I actually was one of the people that was supportive of Sheedy but the difference in our mentality, our energy when the fresh younger players came on was like night and day. From minute 1 the old guard were outhurled at every area of the pitch.

We played well for 15 minutes and even that 15 minutes was littered with a rake of missed wides and a ton of missed goal chances. The Waterford penalty was at the other end of the ground but I'm told it was a farcical decision.

It's a bit tougher to take because despite being clearly the worse team for 3/4 of the game, we could easily have taken the game had we converted just one or two of our many missed chances.

Sheedy was far, far too slow to react to their 11, Jack Prendergast in the first half who must have been involved in nearly all of their scores. He got a handle on it in the 2nd half but far too late.

Waterford were out on their feet at the end - don't let their flashy finish take away from that fact, so it is also difficult to put tremendous stock in our 15 minute purple patch coming at a time when they were exhausted, having been on the road longer than us.

It's time for Sheedy to move on and a rebuild to take place.

FoFo1254122

What is needed an announcement in autumn that Cahill is in. then give him 2 years and we will be contenders again

tipp are going no where until a complete clean out is done. Hopefully That should take place before Cahill comes in. So he starts with clean hands.

if for any reason Any other course is taken we are in big big trouble .

Ompala

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687328#Comment_117687328

Good point. It was just so odd to see the whole team so sloppy - honestly can't remember the last time it happened. Wasn't even as though it was just a certain period where the opposition were on top that forced errors, it was prevalent throughout. One thing I will say in the forward line was Tipp caused Waterford the most problems when the younger players were on as they ran at the defence. On a day when our passing was so poor and how Waterford set up, our best chance of scores were to run the ball through the lines. Thats why it was no surprise to me that we started to get our way back in when the subs were on (far too late imo, should have been on from the start of the second half) like Kehoe.

I don't want to sound too harsh as Noel is one of the all time greats for Tipperary, and yes he tried hard but it was just not happening. It is more a reflection on managements decision making. As alluded to before the game, dropping Kennedy wasn't well justified.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687362#Comment_117687362

Just on Waterford's end, I think that save re-energised them. Just on the overall effort today, I'm proud of those Tipperary lads who owe the county absolutely nothing. 3 all Ireland titles in 9 years and a small gust of wind away from winning in 14. A hares breath away from finals in 15 and 17. if anyone of them stayed on as panellists id have no issue, but there is no way all of these lads can be expected to be starters. it's unfair on them, their legacy and their bodies too. They've played so many games for us over the years, it has to have its toll.

Sheedy done a lot of great things for Tipp hurling. He dragged us kicking and screaming into modernity in the late 00s, but he's now become stale and unimaginative. Far far too loyal. Sport is cutthroat, whether amateur or professional. Just look at the fact that Gary Donovan failed to make the boat for Tokyo and his brother Paul was probably under severe pressure from the new kids. Just look at Cody, and all the great Kilkenny servants he dropped over the years. Either stand still or move forward.

farmerval

We were a little stale looking today, between Ronan, and Paidi and Barry Heffernan we must have had 7 or 8 wides, our passing between defenders was poor, the receiving player always seemed to have to readjust taking those valuable seconds before we delivered the ball forward.

The whole sequence leading to Seamie's miss in the second half seemed to typify our day, Noel seemed hesitant to take it on himself, the pass to Jason wasn't great and Seamie miscued, the greatest goal scorer we have ever seen miscuing was symptomatic of that slight malaise we had today. Even John McGrath's shot lacked venom, great save but just didn't have the power you'd expect under the circumstances.

It's so very hard to interpret who played well or not, Jamie Barron looked man of the match after ten minutes, was barely seen again.

It was probably Jakes poorest game for us, Seamus Kennedy coming on didn't really change anything, our other subs brightened us up alright. I thought Paddy Cadell had a good game.

What next for Tipp, presumably retirement for most if not all the 2010 contingent. What will our management team be next year. Crucial time coming up, really bad year underage so that dampens hopes a little. The successful 20/21 teams have missed out badly on top class hurling with the Covid fiasco. Those not on the senior panel would normally have colleges and greater club competitions to aid their development but our next generation of seniors are missing that logical next step coming out of underage.

FoFo1254122

i would personally like to thank those great players for the great and not so great days they gave me and my family for the last 10 years

pauric And Brendan maher Kennedy heffernan Alan Flynn Noel McGrath breen Dan McCormack callinan are all probably going to be cleared out

sad to see it, but should have happened last year

nklc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687388#Comment_117687388

It’s not a bit odd to see Tipp sloppy when they’re playing a type of hurling that’s totally unnatural to Tipp players. Backs passing the ball across the back line , trying to run the ball up the center and equally bad was Ronan and Barry refusing to deliver nice ball to the forwards even though they had time to pick their spot . If Eoin kelly in his prime had been playing today, he’d hardly have got a touch of the ball with the quality of ball going in

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687828#Comment_117687828

Id have Dan back next year. Still young, and a good war dog. Noel and Bubbles may still do a job off the bench. i think Seamie, Bonnar, Brendan and Paudie will possibly retire anyway. The problem is, other than Liam Cahill who may not leave Waterford unless they win the All-Ireland, we have feck all other obvious management candidates. Darren Gleeson maybe, but he is still learning his trade really.

We are in a dilemma. Sheedy has proven he is no longer a real competitor. No good for blooding youth....but if he goes, then other than Cahill, you have a lot of dross. Look at the recent underage results to see that.

Joe_ Public

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687867#Comment_117687867

Fair enough point but still the ability for a 20 yard pass to stick should be second nature to players at this level. I can't explain it, maybe they were feeling panicked in some instances but it was happening when they were in acres of space on occasions too so I'm not sure that's any mitigation. Just found it perplexing really and it had a bearing i think.

Agree on the quality of ball. Not good enough. Dan hit three awful ones into no man's land in the first half alone but not sure he's the guy i want to be in those positions to begin with. A problem we had was having too few targets up front to aim at on account of dropping fellas deep to cover runs. A bit of robbing Peter to pay Paul, perhaps.

To the chap above suggesting Dan (among others) be cleared out, stop with the waccy baccy lad, it's addling your brain ;-)

FoFo1254122

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687940#Comment_117687940

trust me when I say that If tipp do get Cahill , fingers crossed, you won’t see the majority of those players wearing the jersey again. If you can’t see that you don’t know hurling

FoFo1254122

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687880#Comment_117687880

Cahill has to be got no matter the cost. There is no one else

formerlyET

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687940#Comment_117687940

Let the lads chat among themselves. I think they're auctioning for Arsenal TV.

Dan was clearly injured. Not sure what happened. But he was up front before he was taken off.

It's just bad form. It happens. You'd say the team was finished, a dud, if they didn't create chances. There was a tonne of chances on offer today. Loads of them.

And the simplest of passes and finishes were there to be taken.

That's what will really hurt today. They had the chances to

Why was Bubbles taken off so early? Four points from play? Would he have finished those John McGrath chances?

Doesn't matter now, I guess. But those are the questions that need to be asked.

At least, we have plenty of options if Sheedy does go. And that's not a foregone conclusion either. You'd have to ask are players confused re-game plan? Are there too many chefs in the kitchen? Dunne, Kelly, Sheedy, O'Shea, and Egan. There's plenty of options to go for. And a load of talented coaches and managers up and down the county on the club scene and plenty of Tipp men operating around the country.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687981#Comment_117687981

Interesting post-match interview here. Reading between the lines, I reckon he might take it if it's offered. The County Board should act swiftly at the end of the championship.

https://www.the42.ie/liam-cahill-waterford-tipperary-5511537-Jul2021/

FoFo1254122

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117688050#Comment_117688050

many in the county board don’t like him

liam talks straight , he will tell them he has full control, they are there to provide money and admin assistance nothing else

he will also be outspoken on footballers interfering in hurling business

of the 2018 and 2019 u20 teams for the last 3 years of sheddy only 1 player from that good bunch has been given any real consistent chance - jake Morris.

i find that says alot about sheedy and his management team. You could make a way more competitive tipp team for a mix of those 2 u20 panels then what was on show today.