Covid vaccines - thread banned users in First Post

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119228131#Comment_119228131

I'm guessing this wasn't responded to as they've driven themselves down a stupid cul-de-sac where everyone knows this can be easily proven but they want others to do work so they can resort to pedantic stupidity mode.

I've given the numbers, go and calculate your argument yourself (and to be fair, there is a big gaping hole in all your arguments that you haven't noticed yet, but isn't needed, I gave some evidence for it but as usual, it went way over your head :), all the experts disagree with you for reasons detailed already.

buzzerxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119231248#Comment_119231248

''No, I do not believe in anything I consider to be a conspiracy theory.''

Then you are either a deluded Fool living in LaLa Land, A Troll, suffer with Cognitive Dissonance or a paid shill. I didn't see your answer to my question because i don't be on here every hour of every day like you are.

''Where did you get it then?''

Get what?

''Also, have you blocked Markus now given his beliefs about the flat earth?''

Show me where he promotes that psyop and i will.

Markus Antonius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119231617#Comment_119231617

And I guess whatever source you pulled that from neglected to answer the age old question of whether those who died - died from covid or just so happened to catch covid while on their deathbeds.. (How dare I ask such an insensitive and pertinent question!!)

As a man who falls into the 0-65 age group, I am very much satisfied, based on this graph, that I do not need a covid vaccine or 7 boosters so thank you for reinforcing my beliefs

buzzerxx

Biggest elephant in the room

The unjabbed aren't dying.

buzzerxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119231617#Comment_119231617

What orifice did you pull them totally believable figures from?

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233049#Comment_119233049

Ask Markus for an image showing the rough shape of the planet we live on.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233054#Comment_119233054

That's only a rational response if you believe vaccines are dangerous, intelligent people know that they aren't.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233049#Comment_119233049

You don't seem to understand your own question there my dude.

There's a difference between conspiracy theories and real conspiracies that actually happen.

For example your continually accusations that people are shills is not a real conspiracy.

And I asked you where you got you previous link if you didn't get it from Twitter like the last few dozen links you've dumped. And I also asked how it would be better if you were dumping a link you didn't read or fact check of you were doing it from somewhere other than Twitter.

And lol, go do you own research man. Go look up his posts. Hell, ask him yourself. Really funny how you were all Gung ho about blocking out disinformation a few posts ago, but now you're cowering away from that conviction now you might have to confront a real flat earther.

Capra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233106#Comment_119233106

So you think no vaccines have ever been dangerous? That's an insane statement.

https://www.ctpost.com/local/article/Analysis-A-short-history-of-when-vaccines-went-15530841.php

"As much as 30 percent of polio vaccines were contaminated with simian virus for eight years."

"As recently as 2017, a vaccine supposed to combat dengue fever actually was shown to cause a worse form of the disease."

"Children treated with a vaccine designed to combat respiratory syncytial virus (RSV) actually developed an “enhanced” version of the disease, as the AAMC wrote, resulting in two deaths."

"...the so-called Cutter incident, when a laboratory mistakenly sent out batches of live polio virus (instead of inactivated cells as they should have), as the Association of American Medical Colleges wrote. Five kids died, and more than 100 patients were paralyzed."

"And of course, there were glass particles in the HPV vaccine back in 2013."

There should be a cost benefit analysis for all vaccines. There now appears to be some pretty solid evidence that a reasonably significant number of people have had very serious side effects from the Covid vaccines. Clearly there is pretty much zero benefit to Children/young people getting the covid vaccine as Covid doesn't harm them at all in most cases.

I'm unvaccinated and I have tested positive yesterday. So far this is one of the mildest colds I've ever had. I have a mildly stuffy nose and slightly sore legs. All my family members who got the vaccine were knocked out much worse than this by the vaccines....all so they could get worse immunity than natural infection would give them.

Not letting people live their lives normally because they don't want to get an experimental vaccine for an illness as mild as this is crazy. Particularly if they have recovered and have natural immunity.

hometruths

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233106#Comment_119233106

If you're over 65 and vaccinated you are 14 more times likely to die from Covid than if you are unvaccinated 18-49 year old. Vaccination status is not the risk factor here.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233674#Comment_119233674

Lol No man, that's not what he's arguing.

We've already gotten past this primary school level of debate where people make this accusation.

Do try to catch up.

All medical procedures and medicines come with some inherent risk.

Leaving your house comes with some inherent risk.

Staying in your house comes with some inherent risk.

The issue here is if the vaccines are more dangerous than the virus. It has been shown to that it it is not. Conspiracy theorists have failed to point out any safety issues that aren't already known about and accounted for.

What safety issue do you believe the vaccines have?

Do you believe the claims being made on this thread including the notion that the vaccines are designed to cause death for a massive global depopulation plot?

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233695#Comment_119233695

That's not even an apples and oranges comparison. More like amoeba versus giraffes. Unvaccinated under 49 vs vaccinated over 65. Uhuh. Howabout vaccinated vs unvaccinated across groups? Here's a fairly recent USA chart. No need to read it - you're about 6 times likely to die from Covid if you're unvaccinated (moreso if you're vaccinated and boosted.)

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233674#Comment_119233674

Ironically I tested positive yesterday evening, as I had a banging headache Sunday evening fatigue,aches and felt a bit out of it Monday, yesterday felt my energy is back a bit foggy but I'm on the mend. Today I'm on my first day of 7 days of isolation. No respiratory conditions, just like a light flu or 24 hour bug.

Haven't been vaccinated, but my friends who were got omnicron quite bad, maybe it's the vaccine doing its job as they all say with the reaction to the vaccines.

Another friend who is boosted also got the omnicron quite bad out of work for two weeks and still brainfoggey, his theory is it's the vaccine is doing it's job. That makes sense to him but not me.

Anyhow I'm not in hospital and talking with my gp on the phone this morning, he said man you'll be grand it only effects people who are immunocompromised and elderly. He told me he had it a few months ago and had similar symptoms as myself, he said I sound like I'm over the worst of it.

According to the vaccine extremists here I should be clogging up a hospital bed and could potentially kick the bucket.

They love the fear and peddle it quite a lot here, but science will tell you that omnicron is less harmful than all the previous variants.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233722#Comment_119233722

Just another "new" poster hitting all the squares on the Covid anti-vaxx bingo card. It does seem Tuesday and Wednesday are bargain days when the anti-vax nutters show up as a group and babble. They'll be back next week around the same time.

hometruths

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233726#Comment_119233726

I think the point went over your head. Oranges are more likely to die than apples irrespective of vaccination status.

So showing a chart of death rates of fruit by vaccination status to argue that apples should get vaccinated is totally disingenuous.

Vaccination should be about an individuals risk/benefit analysis.

If you're a 65 year old and overweight with high blood pressure you'd be a total fool not to get vaccinated.

However if you're a fit and healthy 18 year old the risk/benefit analysis is entirely different. It is a perfectly rational decision for a 18 year old to say I am not getting vaccinated as the benefits are absolutely minimal.

Yet to all intents and purposes we forced fit and healthy 18 year olds to get vaccinated by telling them if they didn't they would have no social life. Total madness, and anybody who supported that should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves.

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233726#Comment_119233726

LoL you're some dose, more than 6 times likely to die of omnicron if you're unvaccinated.

Keep pumping out the fear and anxiety all you like, it's unhelpful for those people who fear such propaganda. You pro vaccine extremists are the cause of a lot of anxiety and intended fear.

Actually in a way your mantras are so last year. The virus has kept weakening over each time it mutates, even the expert's suggest that omnicron is quite tame compared to previous variants.

Stay retro if you like, but some of us actually follow the science, the vaccines work for the vulnerable, immunocompromised and elderly, other than that I think we're on a good trajectory of managing the virus whether it's via a choice to take the vaccine or relying on your immune system.

It's quite self explanatory at this stage.

Capra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233747#Comment_119233747

The only reason I know I have it is because I was at a wedding where other people tested positive. I felt significantly worse after the stag party....

But yeah, supposedly we should be dying and a serious burden on the hospital system.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233722#Comment_119233722

That's quite a leap to suggest believing vaccines can cause harm means you believe there is a worldwide depopulation conspiracy.

I will give you some examples from my own life as for some reason any evidence on the I telnet won't be believed by the person you are talking with. I find the Internet almost useless for civil discussion.

I know 1 previously very healthy 70 year old woman who dropped dead within 24 hours of being vaccinated in June 2021. No explanation has been given to the family yet, but she didn't drink/smoke and had never ever been hospitalised in her life.

I know several people who have developed sciatica over the last year when I have never heard anyone mention it before to the point they can no longer ride bicycles. Sciatica is a suspected side effect of some covid vaccines.

One of my staff members wives has had a series of health problems post vaccination including going into anaphylaxis when she is given dye to check a leaky valve in her heart. She has had that procedure several times and it is only post vaccination that she has had issues. The first time it happened, the anesthesiologist told her that he never once had that response in 10 years but had it three times from different patients that week....and it was the doctor who asked her had she been boosted so obviously he has his suspicions.

I have a friend who I suspected wouldn't approve of my unvaccinated status u till he told me that one of the girls in his athletics club is basically wheelchair bound since she got her second Pfizer dose last year. Her symptoms sound almost identical to a mountain biker I follow on Instagram (and i actually have met at several competitions over the years) who has had very significant health problems immediately following vaccination. Kylewarnermtb is his name and he is anything but an antivaxxer.

Do you believe none of those things happened or that all those people are lying? Should we just ignore the fact that many of these issues cropped up almost immediately after vaccination and just try not to think about it?

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233844#Comment_119233844

Your original point was comparing amoebae to giraffes. What is the death rate of vaccinated under 49 versus vaccinated over 65? That's apples and apples.

But, I am pleased to see you, yet again, agreeing the vaccines are safe. You just recommended them for over 65. Good man! What other demographics should take them?

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233858#Comment_119233858

Be specific about who you mean by 'we.' The US is still having plenty of people die; Ireland is doing much better because... of vaccination. The vaccines work for everyone, but do share your data that you think makes it self-explanatory.

hometruths

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233894#Comment_119233894

But, I am pleased to see you, yet again, agreeing the vaccines are safe. You just recommended them for over 65. Good man! What other demographics should take them?

I have always said I thought over 65s would be wise to get vaccinated, and anybody who has underlying health issues. It seems to me that for those people the benefits of being vaccinated are greater than the risks of being vaccinated. This is not breaking news.

But just because I think they would be wise to get vaccinated, it's none of my business whether they do or not. I don't think they should be forced or shamed into doing so.

Mic 1972

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233912#Comment_119233912

Vaxxed or unvaxxed, everybody catches omicron because it's highly infectious and because the vaccine was created to fight against a variant that is no longer around.

Once you catch omicron, your chances of survival depend purely on your age and health. Given this, people should feel free to evaluate the risks between adverse reaction to the jab or sever reaction to omicron. Both are very little

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233859#Comment_119233859

Yes, it is a leap. You dodge the question though.

What safety issues do you believe the vaccine has?

Are you claiming that the vaccine caused these effects in the people you know personally? (Again, really weird how anti-vaxxers just seem to know people personally affected...)

What about the claims being made in the thread so far. Do you agree with them or not?

You are again falling back to high school level debating tactics.

In my personal experience, none of my friends or family have had any side effects from the vaccine. So therefore, can we say that the vaccine is safe? If not, why not? Why is your anecdotal claim better than mine?

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233945#Comment_119233945

Or maybe, ask a doctor?

Crazy I know. Especially how you guys all believe they're in on this global conspiracy.

Markus Antonius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233859#Comment_119233859

https://youtu.be/aebtcTi7EaA?t=82

I don't know Capra, he hasn't published this testimony in any scientific journals to be adequately peer reviewed nor has it been analysed yet by CNN.com/fact-check. Not sure if this will stand to scrutiny amongst the skeptics of the forum and he will be dismissed as an antivaxxer or accused of spreading dangrious Disinformation.

hometruths

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233912#Comment_119233912

The vaccines work for everyone, but do share your data that you think makes it self-explanatory.

You've changed your tune suddenly wanting to see the data that other posters reference. It was only a couple of days ago that your position on this was:

Sure, my opinion is, you're dodging looking up the data that Astro pointed you at. And you're doing that, because (a) lazy and (b) would further hold you up for more ridicule when you do and realize it refutes whatever arc of complaint you're on about now.

So, you're not going to look? This is why 'for arguments sake' is bs when you're disingenuous. You really have to do the work No one will do it for you.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233984#Comment_119233984

Again mate, you believe that all space flight is fake.

You really don't understand why this makes you a joke do you...?

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233990#Comment_119233990

No, like I said, do share your data. Have you got any? Astro provided data that you failed to look into. So, what data have you got? And, am I replying to "Bad to the Bone" or "hometruths" because my question was posted to BH but replied by hometruths. Which of you has the con now?

Capra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233961#Comment_119233961

Jesus Christ, you're a fairly unpleasant fella to talk to aren't you?

I would have thought it was extremely obvious what I was saying....no I don't think its a global depopulation exercise. The fact that you weren't able to extrapolate that for yourself makes me think know you aren't as you sharp as you seem to think you are....

As for the other claims being made in the thread so far,you'll have to excuse me for not being familiar with 260 pages of a handful of people bickering at each other while not conversing at all. I tried to read back even 2 pages and it's painful as ye are all so unbelievably uncivil to each other. No one is going to read through hundres of pages of people just insulting each other and being totally dismissive.

As for you not knowing anyone.....I guarantee you know people who have had side effects but a. You are extremely hostile/aggressive towards any dissenting opinions and they wouldn't bring it up b. You would find some other way to explain it regardless of what they told you. The instant reaction of a very significant portion of the population is to just repeat lines like "we know they are safe and effective so it must have been something else". My first cousin is like this. He had absolutely no questions about the woman we know who died but just kept saying "well it was obviously something else" over and over again. He cannot contemplate any link between vaccines and illness and I'd imagine you are exactly like that.

I would say there is no amount of evidence that could be presented to you that would make you talk to me or anyone else like a human being. You are talking at us like we are some sort of sub human species....its very very weird.

I am reasonably elite Irish level amatuer athlete and almost all of my friends are in the extremely fit and healthy category. People like me tend to notice when previously healthy people get sciatica out of the blue

So yes, I do think there is significant chance the people I mentioned above all had those issues cause by the vaccines. When people have almost identical issues with 24 hours of going through the same procedure then I think it's only rational that they could be linked. The link between sciatica and covid vaccines is quite strong and reasonably well documented.

hometruths

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119234023#Comment_119234023

No, like I said, do share your data. Have you got any? Astro provided data that you failed to look into. So, what data have you got?

If you're going to get all astrofoolish be my guest.

Astrofool referenced data, he didn't provide it, share it or link to it. He simply said I had to go and look at this data myself. As did you.

The data he referenced was the separate clinical trials for each vaccine in the EU, US and UK. I said I couldn't look into to this data as it did not exist, there were no separate trials in each region. They all used the same data from the same trials. To support this claim I posted:

It is not possible to a perform meta-analysis per vaccine from the different trial data across different regions because they all used the same clinical trial data.

Here is the relevant data the FDA used for Pfizer: https://www.fda.gov/media/144246/download

And here is the relevant data the EMA used for Pfizer: https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/documents/assessment-report/comirnaty-epar-public-assessment-report_en.pdf

Notice any similiarities?!

I asked astrofool if he thought I was wrong on this point to share the links to the individual trials by region he was talking about. So far he has yet to do so.

And, am I replying to "Bad to the Bone" or "hometruths" because my question was posted to BH but replied by hometruths. Which of you has the con now?

Amusingly you've changed your tune on this too, given that you jumped on a question I posted to astrofool, to tell me to get back to you with this fictitious data astrofool pointed out:

Sorry, when you're disingenuous in arguments, you don't get a pass on 'for arguments sake.' Astro's pointed out what you need to research to reach conclusions on trial size. He's provided you a starting point. Get back to us with the data summarized and maybe then someone will engage with you.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119234080#Comment_119234080

Ok great, so all of the conspiracy claims on the thread so far are false.

You start off being offended at the tone of my post, then got off on a rant about what a terrible person I am. Very hypocritical.

Also, very funny that you're claiming that my anecdotal evidence is false based on absolutely nothing.

That's fine.

In that case, you are also lying about your personal stories.

So if you're claiming that the link between covide vaccines and sciatica is well documented, can you please provide that documentation?

bad2thebone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119233912#Comment_119233912

I've no problem whatsoever with people taking a vaccine. But I don't need to point it out to you that omnicron is quite tame compared to the previous variants.

Can you picture a conspectus or over view of the trajectory of the omnicron varient of covid and how unvaccinated healthy people are hardly effected by it apart from a headache, flu like symptoms and some brainfog which could last a few weeks or just a day or so ?

Most people are vaccinated or boosted and I think you're reading data from people who have no other option than to keep people in fear and tell everyone that you're more likely to die or clog up hospitals if you're unvaccinated.

It's unfortunate via your source the unvaccinated people in America are dying still, that's quite serious. I'm confident I can trust you're getting that information from a reliable source and are those unvaccinated people who are dying immunocompromised, elderly or have other underlining condition's, abusing alcohol and drugs etc.

Or are they generally otherwise healthy people who are fit, not overweight or have a potentially life threatening underlining condition.

I don't really need to share data that makes it self explanatory, all you need is common sense really .

There's a lot of information about omnicron out there.

I'm well aware of how you guys twist everything and play pingpong and dragging people into a maze of bamboozle and hedonistic discussions. Zig zags of absolute mayhem and trying to create chaos in order to put people off discussing these concerns.

Well aware of it, so it's time there's serious discussion rather than posting shite. It wouldn't bother me if I had most of you pro vaxxers blocked or on ignore. But I'm confident some of you will grow a pair and take the discussion seriously rather than acting the maggot.

There's only a few of ye left anyhow and everytime a new poster comes in ye start with the same old tripe until they had enough and get annoyed and leave.

Some of you are so archaic and behind the time's with omnicron that you're fossils here at this stage and people have you well buried and forgotten about.