Does England feel like a foreign country to you?

Hyperbollix

A foreign land? Oh yes. I always marvel at University Challenge. You get these insanely well read 20 year olds attending the Oxbridge colleges who can answer questions on the most obscure / niche subject matter with utter confidence and mostly arrogance.... When it comes to geography, they will spit out answers to questions about the regions of Mongolia like they've lived there themselves and have direct experience.

But give them a question on their nearest neighbouring island and they will all flounder. It's actually comical to watch Paxman ask them something about Ireland which any Junior cert student would laugh at and see a whole team of geniuses scrabbling around to the point of almost saying things like "GUINNESS?.............er...............LEPRECHAUNS?"

If the cream of the British education system is THIS clueless about Ireland, it's really no wonder we are where we are.

Nqp15hhu

They’re like that about Scotland too

Hyperbollix

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

They’re like that about Scotland too

Yeah, to an extent, but by and large you can tell Scotland is viewed as in their own country. There is a baseline of knowledge that is usually there. When it comes to Ireland, it's normally a blackhole of knowledge.

I hasten to add, they are equally as clueless about the Six counties. This isn't a UK v Ireland thing from their perspective. It's nice to know all these little future Boris Johnson's view Ireland as one singular place and culture. Wish someone would tell Arlene!

theteal

Well I live in a small Essex town. Yes it feels a bit foreign to me at times but I can't say it wasn't expected and I will never refer to it as "home". People for the most part are really nice and there's a very strong local spirit with litter picks and crime watch etc. for example. There are a few walking stereotypes around but meh, leave them at it. I've worked in London for most of the last decade and have adjusted to it but give me Dublin any day.

Charles Babbage

Someone observed that if you are in any doubt that England is a foreign country, then go to a funeral.

Gaoth Laidir

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

I am not talking about the fact that it is a separate country, but purely from the standpoint of life and culture.

I am Northern Irish, so we are in the U.K. I lived in East Anglia and felt at times that the society was different, not from a stand point of infrastructure, food or day to day things but more the way of life in terms of cultural attitudes and communication.

The reservedness and inability to be direct and up front was something that I struggled to adapt to. I found it odd how the locals would avert eye contact, almost as if eye contact is a negative thing. I couldn’t get past the indirectness in communication; when communicating with English people I found it took a while to actually get down to the main point of what they were trying to say. Whilst here in Northern Ireland we just come out with it - (and I think that they did not like that approach).

If you visualise a politician being asked a question and not answering it. That is how the English communicate, with platitudes and indirectness... not actually getting to the point.

The very early closure of shops was also something that I found odd; 6pm shutters down everyday of the week, I’m not sure what it’s like in the south but here we would have shops open to 9pm at least a few days a week. To me closing that early is a very archaic practise, I know I struggled to get things done with such closing times, I’m not sure how working people are supposed to juggle such restrictive opening hours? Other things that stood out, would be the over reliance on public transport (most of my course mates at university had only started driving lessons, many were not intending to drive), small houses and large urban population.

So for me, yes certain aspects feel foreign, others don’t. Obviously for me it wouldn’t quite be the same as going to Spain etc.

Which would you say is more foreign to you: England or the Republic of Ireland?

theteal

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Someone observed that if you are in any doubt that England is a foreign country, then go to a funeral.

Weddings are different too - "what do you mean, last orders???"

cj maxx

No it doesn't. I lived in the NW for 3 years in the mid 90's . Even though it was the height of the troubles , I was never made to feel uncomfortable by the vast majority of people I met.
People were just more open and took you at face value. Sorry I ever left.

flazio

It's not just country or sea borders though. The way of life in Galway is quite different to that of Dublin for example. Heck the peoples Republic of Cork can feel like an alien experience.

BuboBubo

Yes it does, because it is.

Only been there for holidays a few times (in the south) people seemed more brash there than here in Ireland. It was either overt friendliness or total snub, no inbetween. Haven't been over since 2018.

One thing I really liked in England was the variety of things to do, no shortage of entertainment. Something for everyone, they have a massive population there to cater for which we don't have.

The cider over there is damn good too.

YoshiReturns

Going to a pub in and around London always felt cold, soulless and alien to me. Meanwhile in the middle of Dublin, at least before covid, you could drop into lots of places for a relaxed quiet pint and just melt into the place. Have a chat or just chill. So, yes, felt foreign to me.

RobMc59

bunny_mac wrote: »

I lived there for 9 years in three difference cities: one in the south, one in the west and one in the north. I never found the people to be unfriendly or condescending but they're definitely friendlier the further north you go. It is friendly in a different way, though. Can't quite put my finger on it.

I totally agree with the ignorance of other countries, though. It was beyond belief at times, particularly the 'Ireland not being in the UK' part. I don't know how many times I heard things like 'Oh, don't you use Sterling?!', or how many times I baffled post office workers by having to explain to them that I couldn't use a 1st or 2nd class stamp to send something to Ireland.

And they seem to really hate the French. Like, really.

It's a love hate thing between the UK (mostly England)and France Probably because historically they were colonial rivals.
Regarding the friendliness of mainland people,I agree northerners are generally more friendly.

Castlekeeper

RobMc59 wrote: »

It's a love hate thing between the UK (mostly England)and France Probably because historically they were colonial rivals.
Regarding the friendliness of mainland people,I agree northerners are generally more friendly.

I'd say it's more to do with the fact that the proximate regions were all the one once upon a time, and then there was was a big break up. I know people from the north of France who, I was surprised to be told, would feel culturally closer to SE England than the South of France, and similarly people from the South of France who felt closer to Northern Spain than Northern France, but that may have been a Basque thing iirc.

BuboBubo

BuboBubo wrote: »

Yes it does, because it is.

Only been there for holidays a few times (in the south) people seemed more brash there than here in Ireland. It was either overt friendliness or total snub, no inbetween. Haven't been over since 2018.

One thing I really liked in England was the variety of things to do, no shortage of entertainment. Something for everyone, they have a massive population there to cater for which we don't have.

The cider over there is damn good too.

For me it was always the ALES.....the hand pumped liquid heaven

cj maxx

BuboBubo wrote: »

Yes it does, because it is.

Only been there for holidays a few times (in the south) people seemed more brash there than here in Ireland. It was either overt friendliness or total snub, no inbetween. Haven't been over since 2018.

One thing I really liked in England was the variety of things to do, no shortage of entertainment. Something for everyone, they have a massive population there to cater for which we don't have.

The cider over there is damn good too.

Very true, something for everyone in close proximity. Its also very true that southerners are very brash and not as welcoming. My experience is of living in Preston, which had a huge Irish diaspora and a lot of NI students.
Close to Manchester and Liverpool which are friendly enough cities for the Irish. Cider not so much

Charles Babbage

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

Very reserved, didn’t show much emotion, kept to themselves. They did not mix with or speak to people outside their friend groups. I was on a course for a few years with numerous people so this is not one group and is my general experience.

I found that people formed friendships there through connections, you couldn’t just form friendships by speaking to coursemates/strangers as you can here.

The reservedness would be all over, for example, if you were on a bus or a train, it would be silent. Nobody would speak, nobody would make eye contact. People would get on, sit and read a book or look out and get off when their stop was reached. That to me is a very alien concept and not at all how transport is here, as bus rides are certainly not silent here.

Then there is the joke: A ship sank and an Irish man and Irish woman, an English man and an English woman and a Scots Man and Scots woman were washed up on a remote island. When the rescuers arrived 5 years later they discovered that the Scots had got together and built a whisky still, the Irish man and woman had 6 children. The rescuers approached the Englishman who run over to them and said "thank God you've arrived, I need someone to introduce me to the woman".

PokeHerKing

I've never lived in the UK but haven been to Cardiff, London, Newcastle, Liverpool, Glasgow etc. All felt as foreign as a trip to Northern France or Barcelona as far as I'm concerned. They're different countries so why would they not feel foreign?

I suspect as a Northern unionist it may have taken you by surprise as you were expecting it to be your Mecca or something but I don't think any Irish person would be surprised that Britain is in fact a foreign land like any other.

It definitely does. England has no soul in it whatsoever.

Beechwoodspark

YoshiReturns wrote: »

Going to a pub in and around London always felt cold, soulless and alien to me. Meanwhile in the middle of Dublin, at least before covid, you could drop into lots of places for a relaxed quiet pint and just melt into the place. Have a chat or just chill. So, yes, felt foreign to me.

Would agree. Soulless corporate branded “venues”.

Barring a few exceptions The pubs over there are mostly Crap.

An Ri rua

[Deleted User] wrote: »

They even have different accents and stuff.

Ah no, theres a crowd up around parts of Dublin that sound just like them.

AllForIt

No, it does not. What does feel foreign to me is all of contiental Europe.

Church on Tuesday

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

Very reserved, didn’t show much emotion, kept to themselves. They did not mix with or speak to people outside their friend groups. I was on a course for a few years with numerous people so this is not one group and is my general experience.

I found that people formed friendships there through connections, you couldn’t just form friendships by speaking to coursemates/strangers as you can here.

The reservedness would be all over, for example, if you were on a bus or a train, it would be silent. Nobody would speak, nobody would make eye contact. People would get on, sit and read a book or look out and get off when their stop was reached. That to me is a very alien concept and not at all how transport is here, as bus rides are certainly not silent here.

Unfortunately.

Church on Tuesday

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Would agree. Soulless corporate branded “venues”.

Barring a few exceptions The pubs over there are mostly Crap.

Drinking in an English pub is like drinking in your kitchen with slot machines. Zero atmosphere.

Found people in Manchester to be pretty sound for the most part, similar sense of humor, found them to be pretty open and frank about stuff personally. I find it amusing some people are saying they are reserved when Irish people pussyfoot over practically everything without wanting to offend.

You can say they are ignorant of certain things, which they are, but we are ignorant of some of the particulars over there also and there is certainly a class system there you mostly don't get here.

Yyhhuuu

theteal wrote: »

Well I live in a small Essex town. Yes it feels a bit foreign to me at times but I can't say it wasn't expected and I will never refer to it as "home". People for the most part are really nice and there's a very strong local spirit with litter picks and crime watch etc. for example. There are a few walking stereotypes around but meh, leave them at it. I've worked in London for most of the last decade and have adjusted to it but give me Dublin any day.

I'd be interested to know of examples of what you dislike about Essex, could you elaborate?

I always found Central London people quite friendly, certainly the people I met and many parts of Central London are quite beautiful with the most fantastically ornate period buildings you just don't get in Ireland and so many things to suit all tastes.

As regards the previous person who said there was no class system, are there not working class and middle class and upper middle classes in Ireland? The only difference is the absence of an upper class or aristocracy.

dd973

You can't tar the whole of England with the same brush, living in Liverpool or Manchester is quite similar to living in Dublin in terms of the size of the city, proximity to Ireland and friendly people, many of whom are of Irish lineage, either recently or further removed, you probably see more Irish faces in Liverpool than O'Connell St these days.

The worst place I've lived is that outer swathe of London, that's neither Metropolitan London nor England, utterly soulless and gormless place with zero personality. Actual inner city Londoners are OK, the South East area at large though has a lot of horrible people in it, ranging from the sort of Sun reading right wing football thug you see in the stands at Chelsea or Tottenham to arrogant Lawrence Fox types who populate Middle Class London or places like Henley, Weybridge or Beaconsfield, very, very dull Times reading affluent Home Counties England.

Generally speaking, you could draw a line from the top of Essex over across to Milton Keynes/Oxford and down to Portsmouth, outside of that area English people are generally more like us and easier going, people in the North East of England are very affable and outgoing but it's a bit of a place apart with lots of poverty, deindustialisation and a big drinking culture.

Yorkshire folk tend to be a bit opinionated and tight fisted, Midlanders, especially Brummies, affable and self deprecating.

East Anglians and West Country people tend to be like the way they're stereotyped, rustic, easy going but to the point of making you think they're not all there!

The Cornish don't consider themselves English but a Celtic nation with it's own culture.

Fluorescence

Visited England many times, lots of different cities. People are polite enough but it's in a different way, can't can't explain why it's different. Don't think I would want to live there, but who knows!

The general ignorance of English people about the rest of the UK, let alone Ireland, is kind of gobsmacking though. I live in NI now, and applied to be a covid vaccinator through the NHS "National Campaign". 5 weeks, 4 professional references, police background checks, 11 hours of unpaid online training and 9 rounds of applications later, it turns out the campaign was only for NHS England. I had given them my address about 4/5 times during the process and marked that i was willing to work up to 20 miles away.

I checked the job description again afterwards and nowhere did it say that the campaign was for England only, it said nationwide numerous times.

Mind. Boggles.

Nqp15hhu

Fluorescence wrote: »

Visited England many times, lots of different cities. People are polite enough but it's in a different way, can't can't explain why it's different. Don't think I would want to live there, but who knows!

The general ignorance of English people about the rest of the UK, let alone Ireland, is kind of gobsmacking though. I live in NI now, and applied to be a covid vaccinator through the NHS "National Campaign". 5 weeks, 4 professional references, police background checks, 11 hours of unpaid online training and 9 rounds of applications later, it turns out the campaign was only for NHS England. I had given them my address about 4/5 times during the process and marked that i was willing to work up to 20 miles away.

I checked the job description again afterwards and nowhere did it say that the campaign was for England only, it said nationwide numerous times.

Mind. Boggles.

The U.K. government runs most affairs in England, whereas the rest of the U.K., we often run our own affairs.

Most of us born outside England can tell when a campaign only applies to England. In NI it’s not actually called NHS, that’s the first hint.

indioblack

dd973 wrote: »

West Country people tend to be like the way they're stereotyped, rustic, easy going but to the point of making you think they're not all there!

Oi! That's where I'm from.
I'm all there.
[Just got to figure out where "there" is!]

Fluorescence

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

The U.K. government runs most affairs in England, whereas the rest of the U.K., we often run our own affairs.

Most of us born outside England can tell when a campaign only applies to England. In NI it’s not actually called NHS, that’s the first hint.

I figured that out afterwards alright. Was surprised nobody brought it to my attention during the multiple rounds of interviewing and applications though.

Nqp15hhu

It’s just a thing we all work out. When most announcements are made in Parliament we all know it’s mostly for England. And we watch our local news to see if it will apply to us, sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn’t.

But I would prefer if they would say “england” instead of “across the country”, because they use that term to mean U.K. and England.