The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 3) Mod Notes and Threadbanned List in OP

A quick look at Twitter shows that some of the more "hardcore" SF accounts seemed to agree with the PBP stance this morning. Is there a disconnect between the party line and what some of the more traditional support based are thinking?

They didn't get the memo after the party site got "spring cleaned"

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118891582#Comment_118891582

Would broadly agree with pbp as regards sanctions harming ordinary russians the most,and will only serve to further harden support for putin in medium term

Have sanctions worked anywhere to further regime change,cuba been under a form of sanctions with 2 generations

weird bang of forced compliance off the whole thing,similar to what we laugh at the british over and their poppy season

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118891448#Comment_118891448

Compromise is how governments work. Particularly in Ireland’s system. If are elective representatives had your attitude cross party committees would never happen. For one who seems to take an interest in politics it seems to be a bit of an anathema that you have such a disdain for compromise. Unless you are just ‘playing to the gallery’ for effect?

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118891629#Comment_118891629

Yeah, that poor old ordinary Roman Abramovich has been reduced to asking friends for a loan of the odd million or so.

The sanctions are targetting the rich as my sarcastic example shows.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118891629#Comment_118891629

So no sanctions then and leave Putin at it ?

Laughable chamberlainisn that

The only reason pbp oppose sanctions is because they are trots and where do you think trotsky was from ?

At least one semblance of normality with Sinn Féin is their populism core now means they have had to abandon their Soviet loving past,at least in public

Pbp on the other hand are in the invidious position of not supporting sanctions designed to wake up the Russians to Putin making 10s of millions homeless and torturing and murdering 1000's

You'd be locked up in Cuba for criticising the government btw (ditto Russia)

Lovely system (sarcasm in case you don't notice,not the locking up the opposition, that happens,I'm being sarcastic about it being lovely)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118892495#Comment_118892495

Yous can gaurantee,no ordinary russian will go hungry as regards these sanctions?....because they certainly did in 2015 anyway

I know by your posts about the poor yous dispise em,but dont dress it up in pretending to want to damage the weathly when yous oppose wealth taxes and support paying over 100K to all and sundry in public service

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118892750#Comment_118892750

Soviet union has not existed in over 30 years mate,labeling/linking russia as soviet union is v.out of touch with reality

The sanctions arent working (never do,from i can see),this war will drag on for between 2 and 4 years,ukraines begging with weeks for air support/no fly zone and eu plus nato have sat on their hands,prefering sanctions,which will disportionatially affect poorest

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118892017#Comment_118892017

It deosnt work,and if they poll as well as indicated,it leaves them with no need to compromise,nothing to stop all other parties compromising and adopting the sf position

What do you think compromises achieve?,how has greens throwing their platform achieved for em??

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893005#Comment_118893005

I can guarantee that without sanctions, many many Ukrainians will be killed by Russian soldiers.

As for wealth taxes, I fully support wealth taxes such as water charges for millionaires with swimming pools and I am a huge supporter of the LPT, the only wealth tax in Ireland as it isn't paid by the homeless or renters. I am in favour of paying people what they deserve for the work they do.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893005#Comment_118893005

And what is happening to the ordinary Ukrainian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893026#Comment_118893026

The Soviet Union is alive and well in Putin who is attempting to put it back

The sanctions are not designed to stop the war immediately

Just to make it unsustainable

That was made clear from the start by the EU,USA and others

No country ever,even south Africa has ever had sanctions the like of which have rightly been put on putins regime

(you can use your credit card in Havana but not Moscow)

It'll take another 2 years or so to have Germany weaned off Russian gas

Then they're fûcked

Russia btw is taking in 100s of millions a day via state owned Gazprom

So don't give me rubbish about poor people in Russia

Their government could put those resources into their poor

Putin is a Soviet

So are the older core Sinn féin former IRA people

As I said,populism has taken over SF nowadays so the people who used laud Russia are being told they'll have to bite their lips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893140#Comment_118893140

Except i didnt ask this,seems yous cant gaurantee ordinary russians wont go hungry,but are happy to press on irregardless

16% of population here hold 84% of the wealth,what % tax do you think this 16% hold??

Or is your commitment to wealth taxes as shallow as every other "cause" you propogate

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893723#Comment_118893723

Utter demented rubbish,the soviet union hasnt existed in 30 years👏👏👏,its as relevent to todays discourse as albert reyonlds

Yous are right they could (and should) use these resources on their own people,but can you gaurantee they will with these sanctions??

Looks to me a case of wishful.thinking however

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893153#Comment_118893153

Being terrorised by russian army??

this is no my eyes not a justification for no-fly zone prefering to instead strave ordinary russians with a course of action that hasnt been proven to work....i think practical action trumps theory in time of crisis

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893793#Comment_118893793

You are against water charges, LPT and carbon taxes, all taxes that are paid disproportionately by the wealthy. If you are homeless or renting, conserving water in a small apartment and travelling by public transport to work, you pay very very little of those taxes, but you and the Shinners want to increase the income taxes on those people. That is the hypocrisy of the Irish left, that they can't actually defend the working poor.

As for the Russians, they won't get poor, you are swallowing Clare Daly-like propaganda. Russia has had a huge trade surplus meaning it is well able to feed its population.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893723#Comment_118893723

The love for Russia on display from Sinn Fein's supporters will come back and bite them in the next election. People won't forget, even if they have been cleverer than Daly and Wallace.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893804#Comment_118893804

They're using the Gazprom money to make the Ukrainian people homeless and dead with hyperbaric bombs

Go read up on the Soviet Union,your parties friendship with it and on Putin

For the latter I'd suggest Fiona Hill,the world's foremost expert on the man

SF were right to see the writing on the wall regarding Russia the other week by deleting half their Web resources but it was a conversion so late,it might well be crocodile tears

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893050#Comment_118893050

Compromise does work if played correctly at the opportune moment in politics. It worked for Fine Fail and Fine Gael. SF are normally skilled in knowing when to loosen their ideology when it becomes politically opportune. We have seen it in entering the Dail. The u turn on the EU and the SCC. Now I am not a green voter myself.

But I can see that environment is as buzz word for the youth. SF know this so they have to at least first have a Green ‘environment’ pretence while delaying the enviable.

It amuses me because SF and the Green politicians are by and large polar opposite’s in background and Outlook.

The Greens are middle class urban wishy washy, peace first idealists. SF still like to at least pretend they are the party of the working man. And there is still the deep down conditioning in SF of willing to die for the ‘cause’.

Going slightly ‘environmentally Green would at least help normalise the SF party moving it away from their old ‘6 county’ flag waving etc. it will happen eventually. SF will go more central in order to lead consistently. I find it fascinating at which junctures they decide to discard their harder Republican edges to achieve this normalisation making themselves palatable to the broader electorate in the ROI.

In my view the real sign of this will be when SF councillors do not vote on bloc on Dublin City Council time and again. When the party is more open to dissenting views. As far as I see it SF are the only party who consistently vote on bloc in unison in DCC. That does not happen by accident.

As I said SF going slightly Green for the environment will be a start in taking the hard edges off the party.

jm08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118893793#Comment_118893793

Data from 2020 says that Russia is self sufficient in food (exporting about half its grain) in everything except fruit and berries.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1103711/russia-food-self-sufficiency-rate-by-category/

They certainly won't be short of energy!

They import a lot of their fruit from China, so they should be ok there. https://www.producereport.com/article/russia-resumes-apple-pear-imports-china

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118894299#Comment_118894299

I am not a member of sf,soviet union hasnt existed for 30 years

You have to learn to deal with reality as it is,not what yous wish it to be

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118898385#Comment_118898385

Compromise deosnt work,liberials use it to destroy progress and damage poorest

Hence how greens stood on a platform of legalising weed,restore child protection for single mothers upto 18,reducing classsizes,introduction of wealth taxes and have been reduced to telling people have cold showers and drive slower....this governemnt would not exist without the greens,this is what compromise achieves in ireland,and why we go decades without any meaningful reform,

Sf have no need to go central to continously lead,dont really need to even be largest party tbh,they need to rout the centre and force people left/right like a proper country,centrism as a concept is defunt.....they have fg drove demented and further to the right than anyone could have hoped for.....just need to empower PD type folk to restablish,to shatter that vote and drive both further and further down rabbithole of nonsense that right leads people to

The green party is back boned by a lot more than wishy washy middle class folk,you really need to stop relying on outdated cliches

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118899871#Comment_118899871

Just to reiterate

It wasn't references to Germany or France that SF deleted en masse

It was references to Russia

Who do they think they are kidding ?

You apparently

Floppybits

I was wondering what SF have done that this thread is so busy then realised there is a bit of a scandal about Watt and Holohan. 😀

Ten of Swords

Mod - Back on topic please

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118899985#Comment_118899985

Neither of whom have a party affiliation that I'm aware of

Its really the higher grade civil service club that run the country

SF want them in check

Theres merit in that as long as SF keeping them in check is itself kept in check

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118899964#Comment_118899964

You do know,nothing is ever deleted from internet

Also sf have a political newspaper which covers their policy positions over decades,with unlike boards a working search function,

Looks to me,like your blowing smoke up peoples hole mate

I'll let yous into a secret,they will in medium term,subtly use/leak links/images to that dowdall chap to rout the centre and force the overton window (and them) further to the right

sam t smith

Did SF ever return the dodgy money they got from the will of the lad that chopped his own mickey off?

sam t smith

^ They ‘won’ the last one but the other parties wouldn’t let them into government.

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118902254#Comment_118902254

They won a number of seats but couldn’t for a government, there is a difference.