Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

ypres5

Arciphel wrote: »

Just reading through the last few pages of the thread, and lo and behold a fecking ice cream van pulls up outside and a load of kids (who have all been out playing together all day, mixing from about six different households, while I keep mine inside and away from their friends) all line up for a 99. Welcome to level 5 lockdown, Irish style! Madness.

true. the ice cream van driver should have been dragged out of the vehicle and shot and the children should've been sent to a camp in rural roscommon for reconditioning to better their covid awareness

Windmill100000

ypres5 wrote: »

true. the ice cream van driver should have been dragged out of the vehicle and shot and the children should've been sent to a camp in rural roscommon for reconditioning to better their covid awareness

Why do you have to go to such extremes to make a point?

ypres5

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Why do you have to go to such extremes to make a point?

the person going to extremes is the person keeping their kids isolated from their friends and giving out about kids playing and getting an ice cream together. what's wrong with people let children be children

The_Brood

At this point I am so angry at the wide-scale acceptance of this garbage that I don't want anything to open up. Keep the restrictions on forever. We chose to accept suffering and misery - let it be forever. Imagine Tony and Meehoe taking their boots off our necks and only then we go back to living. "Thank you masters, your humble slaves thank you for releasing us." Really? Just forget life ever existed.

Windmill100000

ypres5 wrote: »

the person going to extremes is the person keeping their kids isolated from their friends and giving out about kids playing and getting an ice cream together. what's wrong with people let children be children

Wrong. The person keeping his children away from others was doing what he believed was protecting his family during a lockdown.

ypres5

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Wrong. The person keeping his children away from others was doing what he believed was protecting his family during a lockdown.

keeping his kids isolated from their friends for months at a time? im not going to start critiquing people's parenting styles but it's cruel to do that to kids especially when covid is no harm to them whatsoever

Windmill100000

ypres5 wrote: »

keeping his kids isolated from their friends for months at a time? im not going to start critiquing people's parenting styles but it's cruel to do that to kids especially when covid is no harm to them whatsoever

You are not the child's parents. It is the parents responsibility to do what they deem necessary. Covid may not be a huge risk to the children, but it could be to the parents. If they decide it is necessary to keep their children away from others during a strict lockdown then that is their choice.

You are critiquing parenting styles if you imply what the poster did was wrong. And you were,
weren't you? The poster was following guidelines. They are the ones to make that choice as parents.

ypres5

Windmill100000 wrote: »

You are not the child's parents. It is the parents responsibility to do what they deem necessary. Covid may not be a huge risk to the children, but it could be to the parents. If they decide it is necessary to keep their children away from others during a strict lockdown then that is their choice.

You are critiquing parenting styles if you imply what the poster did was wrong. And you weren't,
weren't you? The poster was following guidelines. They are the ones to make that choice as parents.

you don't think it's unhealthy for kids to be isolated from their friends for months with no opportunity to socialize play or just simply be children. Doesn't sound to healthy to me it goes against everything being a child is about. and to be fair the poster was criticizing the parenting style of the other kids parents so...

ceadaoin.

ypres5 wrote: »

keeping his kids isolated from their friends for months at a time? im not going to start critiquing people's parenting styles but it's cruel to do that to kids especially when covid is no harm to them whatsoever

A friend of my daughter has been kept inside for a year now nearly. No other kids, no school. They play together online and she says things like she wishes she could go to school but she'd rather be alive, as if those are the only 2 choices. From what she is saying, it seems like she won't be allowed back to normal until she gets the vaccine which isn't even approved for children yet.

Bear in mind, the friends who are chatting with her are all in school and haven't gotten sick. Instilling this level of fear in children is going to have long term consequences.

Not saying the previous poster is doing this, just an example of how some people are taking it to extremes.

thebaz

ypres5 wrote: »

you don't think it's unhealthy for kids to be isolated from their friends for months with no opportunity to socialize play or just simply be children. Doesn't sound to healthy to me it goes against everything being a child is about

it is unhealthy , but the parents are only doing what the authorities are telling them to do - Closing real life education is similarly damaging .
Today , the real life studies from the vaccine are super encouraging from Israel :-

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-56069460

We have recorded zero deaths today , it is now up to the authorities to start road-mapping some form of return to normality , which might help reduce the social disaster isolation is having on all people , especially children as mentioned.

copeyhagen

my kids are out playing every day with their friends on the road, wouldnt have it any other way. theyre small and need the social interaction big time.

Windmill100000

ypres5 wrote: »

you don't think it's unhealthy for kids to be isolated from their friends for months with no opportunity to socialize play or just simply be children. Doesn't sound to healthy to me it goes against everything being a child is about

I agree with lockdown restrictions and whatever was necessary to supress the virus and the rising numbers. Of course children need to be in touch with others, as we all do, socialisation is important, but they will be back in school, hopefully, in March.

If children were free to play with other children and mingle with households for the duration of lockdown I believe it would have hampered the reduction in cases and prolonged the lockdown further.

It's been a horrific time for all sectors of society but I understand why it was done. If children were spreading the virus between themselves and their parents, many of who were still working, it would have only kept case numbers up, which is the one thing no one wanted.

thebaz

We have had zero deaths today - the real life study from the vaccine are hugely positive - and somehow the Indo headlines about increased death rate

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/coronavirus-ireland-821-new-cases-and-no-further-deaths-as-dominant-uk-variant-may-have-higher-death-rate-ecdc-report-suggests-40094787.html

The media really want the nation crippled with anxiety and depression with ther never-ending bad news about what MIGHT happen.

ceadaoin.

ceadaoin. wrote: »

A friend of my daughter has been kept inside for a year now nearly. No other kids, no school. They play together online and she says things like she wishes she could go to school but she'd rather be alive, as if those are the only 2 choices.

That is a grotesque impression to leave a child with. Utterly horrific and abusive. And yes, I am "critiquing parenting styles".

PTH2009

thebaz wrote: »

We have had zero deaths today - the real life study from the vaccine are hugely positive - and somehow the Indo headlines about increased death rate

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/coronavirus-ireland-821-new-cases-and-no-further-deaths-as-dominant-uk-variant-may-have-higher-death-rate-ecdc-report-suggests-40094787.html

The media really want the nation crippled with anxiety and depression with ther never-ending bad news about what MIGHT happen.

Yeah it's sickenging and god knows what morale will be like next week when the new 'Living (hiding) from covid' plan will be released

ingo1984

PTH2009 wrote: »

Yeah it's sickenging and god knows what morale will be like next week when the new 'Living (hiding) from covid' plan will be released

Was just thinking the same myself. Rancid carry on. Need to celebrate each small victory and increase hope. If we don't have hope, we have nothing. It's as if the Irish media are intent on inflicting misery upon the nation.

Tpcl20

thebaz wrote: »

We have had zero deaths today - the real life study from the vaccine are hugely positive - and somehow the Indo headlines about increased death rate

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/coronavirus-ireland-821-new-cases-and-no-further-deaths-as-dominant-uk-variant-may-have-higher-death-rate-ecdc-report-suggests-40094787.html

The media really want the nation crippled with anxiety and depression with ther never-ending bad news about what MIGHT happen.

This morning RTE had fluff piece after fluff piece about hairdressers and nonsense. I actually rather scientific analysis and honest political discussion but striking a balance between "take the cyanide pills" and "head back outside and lick someone's face" seems to be completely beyond the reaches of the absolute spacemen under Dee Forde right now.

I'm yo-yoing between nervous breakdown and thinking this is hysterically entertaining. The see-saw is between consuming information, getting frustrated with its handling, ignoring the information, feeling uninformed, going back to the information, becoming frustrated again, hating the coverage, hating the government. It's absolutely ruined all of our lives and there are some people who literally won't ever recover, either because they die due to the virus, suicide, being displaced from their homes, losing their jobs... None of those people are working at RTÉ or in government buildings.

It will take a serious threat to their status quo to change their tack. I think with the announcements next week, things might change for those at the top. The people can affect change when enough people take enough decisive action. It just has to be directed at those responsible. They can't warn, fine, imprison, suppress and gag all of us.

Kermit.de.frog

The_Brood wrote: »

We chose to accept suffering

Can you expand on the level of suffering you are experiencing and crucially why? It would be helpful.

It's a very emotive term.

hatrickpatrick

thebaz wrote: »

We have had zero deaths today - the real life study from the vaccine are hugely positive - and somehow the Indo headlines about increased death rate

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/coronavirus-ireland-821-new-cases-and-no-further-deaths-as-dominant-uk-variant-may-have-higher-death-rate-ecdc-report-suggests-40094787.html

The media really want the nation crippled with anxiety and depression with ther never-ending bad news about what MIGHT happen.

The media have been shockingly, extraordinarily, unacceptably irresponsible in this regard, I absolutely agree. Genuinely shocking. Claire Byrne's repeated showcasing of the supposedly quasi-permanent "new normal" with gimmicks such as going for pints in Father Jack-esque plastic pods, or going to concerts in zorb-like hamster balls, are so incredibly bad for peoples' mental health when they come with the unspoken inference that social distancing of this type is in any way long-term.

I've genuinely been massively disappointed in our media over this and coming from a family of journalists who worked for RTE and the Irish Times among others, I have huge respect for journalism and the media usually. The slide into clickbait and rage-bait over the last five or six years, however, has severely damaged the Irish media's credibility, at least where RTE, the Irish Times and the Indo are concerned.

Even before COVID, I found the Indo's intentional stoking of partisan sh!te extremely grating, and even more so the Irish Times' intentional promotion of identity politics sh!te to the front page of its website (the Louise O'Neill, Una Mullally, "straight white men are literally Hitler" crap) just because it drives social media engagement at the expense of heightening cultural tensions and really doing enormous damage to society in general. These are just two examples in a long litany of ways in which, to my mind, Irish journalism has really fallen off a cliff over the last decade and is now very far removed from any kind of public duty to report the news for the sake of disseminating factual information.

I'm not even going to suggest, like others do, that the media has an agenda in its bizarre and destructive COVID coverage. In my view, this sh!te is 100% peddled precisely because it results in the kind of conversation we're having here on this thread - ergo, more people sharing the articles, even if it's just to say "would you look at this sh!te?" - ergo, more Cost Per Thousand Impressions from advertisers. Very very very simple formula which is as old as online advertising itself.

Whatever justifications one might point to in terms of falling print revenues, falling TV license numbers etc, the media's behaviour with regard to COVID has in many ways been absolutely abhorrent. And I really wouldn't often be one to say something like that, as most who know my general political debating stances on Boards would attest to. The only times in the past I've criticised the media for bias were immediately after the 2020 election in which many media outlets seemed to buy into the "the public were wrong to reject the status quo" narrative, and as I've mentioned, the period around ~2014-2017 when the intentional baiting of The Battle Of The Sexes was at fever pitch. I'm absolutely not one of these "fake news" conspiracy theorists, but I do feel that in these specific circumstances the media's irresponsibility in pedalling utterly hyperbolic sh!te about the future of COVID needs to be called out. It's not just silly reporting, it's the type of thing which could very easily result in serious harm to people whose mental health is already pushed beyond its limit after almost a year of this.

Kermit.de.frog

One thing that would help in my view is to replace Donnelly in the dept of health.

I have little faith in him to oversee this vaccine rollout quickly and efficiently. We need an ass kicker in that dept now more than ever to oversee the rollout, EU failings aside.

Donnelly doesn't inspire enough confidence for me he is the man to oversee this.

Cork2021

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The media have been shockingly, extraordinarily, unacceptably irresponsible in this regard, I absolutely agree. Genuinely shocking. Claire Byrne's repeated showcasing of the supposedly quasi-permanent "new normal" with gimmicks such as going for pints in Father Jack-esque plastic pods, or going to concerts in zorb-like hamster balls, are so incredibly bad for peoples' mental health when they come with the unspoken inference that social distancing of this type is in any way long-term.

I've genuinely been massively disappointed in our media over this and coming from a family of journalists who worked for RTE and the Irish Times among others, I have huge respect for journalism and the media usually. The slide into clickbait and rage-bait over the last five or six years, however, has severely damaged the Irish media's credibility, at least where RTE, the Irish Times and the Indo are concerned.

Even before COVID, I found the Indo's intentional stoking of partisan sh!te extremely grating, and even more so the Irish Times' intentional promotion of identity politics sh!te to the front page of its website (the Louise O'Neill, Una Mullally, "straight white men are literally Hitler" crap) just because it drives social media engagement at the expense of heightening cultural tensions and really doing enormous damage to society in general. These are just two examples in a long litany of ways in which, to my mind, Irish journalism has really fallen off a cliff over the last decade and is now very far removed from any kind of public duty to report the news for the sake of disseminating factual information.

I'm not even going to suggest, like others do, that the media has an agenda in its bizarre and destructive COVID coverage. In my view, this sh!te is 100% peddled precisely because it results in the kind of conversation we're having here on this thread - ergo, more people sharing the articles, even if it's just to say "would you look at this sh!te?" - ergo, more Cost Per Thousand Impressions from advertisers. Very very very simple formula which is as old as online advertising itself.

Whatever justifications one might point to in terms of falling print revenues, falling TV license numbers etc, the media's behaviour with regard to COVID has in many ways been absolutely abhorrent. And I really wouldn't often be one to say something like that, as most who know my general political debating stances on Boards would attest to. The only times in the past I've criticised the media for bias were immediately after the 2020 election in which many media outlets seemed to buy into the "the public were wrong to reject the status quo" narrative, and as I've mentioned, the period around ~2014-2017 when the intentional baiting of The Battle Of The Sexes was at fever pitch. I'm absolutely not one of these "fake news" conspiracy theorists, but I do feel that in these specific circumstances the media's irresponsibility in pedalling utterly hyperbolic sh!te about the future of COVID needs to be called out. It's not just silly reporting, it's the type of thing which could very easily result in serious harm to people whose mental health is already pushed beyond its limit after almost a year of this.

This all day!
Our media have become a leech on society as a whole. They’re pondering to the narrative of the curtain twitcher or to the very well off mad scientist community we see or hear on our TVs, radios and papers.
The vaccines will bring a different take on things once groups 1-4 are fully vaccinated! We’ve seen from Israel already that they work.
It’s a depressing trend of leaks and let down after let down. Seen already today partial leaking of the new “living with covid” plan which in my if true is scandalous and unfortunately will mean a hole lot of pain for a lot of sole traders and small business. It’s just a sad situation mad worse daily by the constant viewpoint that were in this shît show for the next few years etc!
Anyway I won’t be booking any staycation this year, did it last year, it was fine but no spontaneous calls into a nice cafe or a pub off the beaten track or been able to bring the kids into a swimming pool or amusements. It’s just crap!

ingo1984

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

One thing that would help in my view is to replace Donnelly in the dept of health.

I have little faith in him to oversee this vaccine rollout quickly and efficiently. We need an ass kicker in that dept now more than ever to oversee the rollout, EU failings aside.

Donnelly doesn't inspire enough confidence for me he is the man to oversee this.

Unfortunately he won't be replaced. Replacing him will be an admission by the government that they have gotten it wrong.

Captain_Crash

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

In my view, this sh!te is 100% peddled precisely because it results in the kind of conversation we're having here on this thread - ergo, more people sharing the articles, even if it's just to say "would you look at this sh!te?" - ergo, more Cost Per Thousand Impressions from advertisers. Very very very simple formula which is as old as online advertising itself.

One of the old timers in my local was a journalist for over 50 years (much of it with the times) and we had this discussion over a few pints at Xmas when talking about the coverage of covid and he said pretty much word for word what your post said!

The most important thing when writing anything was generating advertising he says. Doesn’t matter what your writing about if you can get people buying papers then advertising will generate more revenue and to quote him “fu*k everything else”. And this before world of online news media! So I can only imagine it’s even more prevalent now. He agrees the coverage has played a massive role in this but understands rightly or wrongly how its ended up like this!

Sure a lot of the “journos” on those clickbait headline grabber sites (journal, extra, buzz etc) are unpaid interns or collage grads with sh*t haircuts and no sense of real word perspective, the social media generation who are always looking for the next thing to be outraged over that will win them some twitter likes

Tork

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

One thing that would help in my view is to replace Donnelly in the dept of health.

I have little faith in him to oversee this vaccine rollout quickly and efficiently. We need an ass kicker in that dept now more than ever to oversee the rollout, EU failings aside.

Donnelly doesn't inspire enough confidence for me he is the man to oversee this.

Donnelly has been piss poor but how much influence does he really have when it comes to the rollout? I agree with you though - the slow rollout of the vaccine is so frustratingly slow. I heard a GP on the radio this morning saying that if the HSE allowed it, they could've used a church hall beside their surgery to vaccinate a load of people in a day. They're not allowed to so they're going to be doing a fraction of that. That sort of red tape would drive anybody mad. The key to getting out of this mess is getting this vaccine into as many people as quickly as possible.

ypres5

Tork wrote: »

Donnelly has been piss poor but how much influence does he really have when it comes to the rollout? I agree with you though - the slow rollout of the vaccine is so frustratingly slow. I heard a GP on the radio this morning saying that if the HSE allowed it, they could've used a church hall beside their surgery to vaccinate a load of people in a day. They're not allowed to so they're going to be doing a fraction of that. That sort of red tape would drive anybody mad. The key to getting out of this mess is getting this vaccine into as many people as quickly as possible.

why can't we start buying doses of the Sputnik vaccine and the Chinese ones? if they're good enough for serbia hungary and other countries they're good enough for us

hatrickpatrick

ypres5 wrote: »

why can't we start buying doses of the Sputnik vaccine and the Chinese ones? if they're good enough for serbia hungary and other countries they're good enough for us

In fairness, there's no way you'd convince a critical mass of the population to voluntarily take the Sputnik vaccine. Not because it is or it isn't safe and/or effective, but because the Western public has been absolutely pumped full of Russia Bogeyman Propaganda ever since 2016, when Russia made a convenient scapegoat upon which to hang the wave of populism which swept through Europe and America while avoiding actual accountability for the leaders in the West whose fiddling while Rome burned directly precipitated that wave of discontent.

Ever since then, Russia has essentially returned to Cold War status in Western culture and discourse. There's just no chance you'd get enough people willing to take the risk when they've been told that Russia is the root of all evil for so long.

ypres5

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

In fairness, there's no way you'd convince a critical mass of the population to voluntarily take the Sputnik vaccine. Not because it is or it isn't safe and/or effective, but because the Western public has been absolutely pumped full of Russia Bogeyman Propaganda ever since 2016, when Russia made a convenient scapegoat upon which to hang the wave of populism which swept through Europe and America while avoiding actual accountability for the leaders in the West whose fiddling while Rome burned directly precipitated that wave of discontent.

Ever since then, Russia has essentially returned to Cold War status in Western culture and discourse. There's just no chance you'd get enough people willing to take the risk when they've been told that Russia is the root of all evil for so long.

that's sad but true. how ireland would up getting dragged into americas little quarrels is ridiculous. to be blunt i think people should take the vaccine they're offered and if they don't want to take it then they should be put to the back of the queue and give it to someone who will take it.

Cork2021

This article on sky news is one for the bed wetters!
Is social distancing something that our fantastic scientists here want? Looks like over in the UK the mad scientist want to ruin all small business and possibly put many professional sports teams into administration!

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-government-scientists-want-to-keep-social-distancing-measures-in-place-for-foreseeable-future-12219223

TheDoctor

How come their distance is only one metre. So unfair.......

ypres5

Cork2021 wrote: »

This article on sky news is one for the bed wetters!
Is social distancing something that our fantastic scientists here want? Looks like over in the UK the mad scientist want to ruin all small business and possibly put many professional sports teams into administration!

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-government-scientists-want-to-keep-social-distancing-measures-in-place-for-foreseeable-future-12219223

whatever else you say about the Tories but at least they'll have the gumption to tell the nutty professors where to go while over here im not so sure