Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

I think the demand to protest is there but we just lack somebody to really lead the charge. You would need to have some kind of political party or big organisation involved to get it going.

The demand for change was there during the last general election but we simply don’t really have any alternatives. A Sinn Fein who didn’t even bother to run enough candidates because deep down they probably prefer opposition anyways.

Sadly, we have politicians in power that don’t listen to the people and know they’ll be voted back in anyways as there are no alternatives.

C__MC

Sinn Fein will have a landslide in the next election
Government shooting themselves in the foot with leaving cert shambles, bizarre vaccine roll out, destroying peoples livelihoods

acequion

SheepsClothing wrote: »

Have you considered the possibility that rather than people being a bunch of cowardly, defeatist sheep, that actually for the most part, they just disagree with you?

Yes of course I have. But that doesn't make them any less cowardly and defeatist imo. Because I consider it cowardly, defeatist, undemocratic and downright totalitarian to shut down all debate and alternative viewpoints about something with such an enormous impact on lives and livelihoods.

Disagreement is no problem. Disagreement is healthy. If only it were so simple.

hynesie08

C__MC wrote: »

Sinn Fein will have a landslide in the next election
Government shooting themselves in the foot with leaving cert shambles, bizarre vaccine roll out, destroying peoples livelihoods

What will sinn feins campaign be?
"we ignored restrictions ourselves and walked northern ireland into more deaths per capita than the Republic?"

Did the a levels go ahead up north?

They only have a vaccine rollout because of boris, meanwhile ireland has over 90% of vaccines in arms, and has more of a % fully vaccinated than the uk.

aziz

I noticed Leo speaking in the dail on the news whilst still wearing a mask,
Is it to hide the stupid smirk on his face

Boggles

acequion wrote: »

Yes of course I have. But that doesn't make them any less cowardly and defeatist imo. Because I consider it cowardly, defeatist, undemocratic and downright totalitarian to shut down all debate and alternative viewpoints about something with such an enormous impact on lives and livelihoods.

Disagreement is no problem. Disagreement is healthy. If only it were so simple.

Who shut down debate?

The alternative view was aired and debated, immensely experienced and qualified people made claims that were proven to be wrong.

Reputations and careers in bits.

Debate is healthy, but if the consensus is that we are doing it the best we can, it would appear you only want debate so we can have a contrarian counter point just for the sake of it.

PTH2009

If protests do happy the media will go around and ask the options on the families who have lost loved ones to covid. The media love the misery of this

Im not having a go at those families I can't imagine how hard it is for them

AlekSmart

paw patrol wrote: »

Well done them too tbh.
I am very polite always unless I've grounds to not be . I thanked her for her time and left.
Why i don't wear a mask? That's a massive debate tbh which will touch on :

• my beliefs in individual agency over my own body
• how effective masks actually are (not!)
• Can somebody catch it in an open setting like a supermarket (No)
• The covid plan by the state is it competent and clear?

and so forth - we could debate for 3 hours on it

and of course, for readers of the IT or Journal.ie - I'm also far right :pac:

There is an argument that I should wear a mask even if ineffective to put others at ease. But another's fear shouldn't dictate how I lead my life.

Nobody meets me (my house or theirs) or the beach/park that doesn't know my covid risk attitude. I'm very open about what I do (and my wife/kids too).

To people reading this ,
Always stand up for your beliefs and don't bow down just cos you are in a minority or the rabble attack you. That type of obedience isn't good for society which we have seen in the past. If you don't speak out it becomes the emperors new clothes.


You'd be right.

Without doubt,the most prescient statement I've read on here so far.
Well said !

You are,in the absence of anybody else,our version of Lord Sumption !

AlekSmart

Penfailed wrote: »

Thank you for taking the time to give a full reply. I really do appreciate that there's very little that can be done (legally) other than lobby your elected representatives. I suppose I was venting my frustration too. I'm not happy with the way things are currently panning out...but I'm not unhappy enough to do anything about it either. Even if I was, what's to be done anyway (as you rightly say)? I don't think it does anyone any favours to be calling people 'meek' and 'accepting' and 'rolling over' when there's really nothing that anyone can do. Small pockets of civil disobedience would be stamped out in no time and I really don't think there's a big enough cohort out there that could be galvanised to do something substantial.

The underlined sentence,somewhat chillingly,points to just how successful the Covid Response Policy has been,in fundamentally altering our perceptions of what a democratic State should mean to it's citizens.

It is ominous indeed that our Leadership has managed to achieve such a level of expectation amongst "ordinary" people.

I wonder will it eventually come to an "I stand by the Republic" situation ?

It is both a sad,and dangerous situation we now face,and the Pandemic is actually only a minor element it .

FintanMcluskey

Chivito550 wrote: »

One email a day from each of us until they crack. Bit like Shawshank Redemption.

At least in Shawshank civil liberties were removed from criminals

At what point does going to jail make little difference to everyday life?

Nobody in Castlerea prison can visit the beach this weekend, or visit their families in a different county but then neither can I

dalyboy

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

At least in Shawshank civil liberties were removed from criminals

At what point does going to jail make little difference to everyday life?

Nobody in Castlerea prison can visit the beach this weekend, or visit their families in a different county but then neither can I

And the hilarious part is we are effectively paying the prisoners rent in their jails.

Boggles

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

At least in Shawshank civil liberties were removed from criminals

At what point does going to jail make little difference to everyday life?

Nobody in Castlerea prison can visit the beach this weekend, or visit their families in a different county but then neither can I

I read that in the voice of Morgan Freeman.

I thought it might make it less hyperbolic, it didn't.

ceadaoin.

AlekSmart wrote: »

The underlined sentence,somewhat chillingly,points to just how successful the Covid Response Policy has been,in fundamentally altering our perceptions of what a democratic State should mean to it's citizens.

It is ominous indeed that our Leadership has managed to achieve such a level of expectation amongst "ordinary" people.

I wonder will it eventually come to an "I stand by the Republic" situation ?

It is both a sad,and dangerous situation we now face,and the Pandemic is actually only a minor element it .

Yep. This is the scary part for me too.

It's just 2 weeks to stop the spread.
Its just a little bit longer.
Its just a mask
Its just a year.
Its just school.
Its just one exam year
Its just christmas
Its just a new vaccine you don't have to get it.
Its just mandatory testing
Its just a vaccine passport
Its just enforced quarantine
Its just 2 masks
Its just a ban on gatherings
Its just travel restrictions
Its just a fine
Its just not seeing your family for a year
Its just a prison sentence for not following "the rules"

Etc etc. I mean ffs, at what point are people going to stop rationalizing these things?

FintanMcluskey

Boggles wrote: »

I read that in the voice of Morgan Freeman.

I thought it might make it less hyperbolic, it didn't.

Some birds just ain’t meant to be caged Boggles, our feathers are just too bright

Boggles

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Yep. This is the scary part for me too.

It's just 2 weeks to stop the spread.
Its just a little bit longer.
Its just a mask
Its just a year.
Its just school.
Its just one exam year
Its just christmas
Its just a new vaccine you don't have to get it.
Its just mandatory testing
Its just a vaccine passport
Its just enforced quarantine
Its just 2 masks
Its just a ban on gatherings
Its just travel restrictions
Its just a fine
Its just not seeing your family for a year
Its just a prison sentence for not following "the rules"

Etc etc. I mean ffs, at what point are people going to stop rationalizing these things?

It's just a pandemic.

ypres5

Boggles wrote: »

It's just a pandemic.

that turned out to be a lot less catastrophic than was painted for us by the likes of McConkey with 80k dead and everyone in the country potentially needing icu treatment in the coming years.

noserider

ypres5 wrote: »

that turned out to be a lot less catastrophic than was painted for us by the likes of McConkey with 80k dead and everyone in the country potentially needing icu treatment in the coming years.

Well said

latency89

Boggles wrote: »

It's just a pandemic.

Correction

It's an oldemic

Pitch n Putt

Boggles wrote: »

It's just a pandemic.

It’s just a complete worldwide overreaction

Driven by the media and social media.

If ever a real dangerous pandemic should occur I’d be severely worried after seeing they way this was handled.

Ashleigh1986

Anyone else see hse chief paul reids performance on the six one news just now ?
On about the rollout of the VACINNES and especially at center in Dublin.
All going well until he tried to give out the hse helpline number .
Made a balls of it ...than again when your only on 350,000 euro a year we can't expect " dads army "to get facts correct .

hynesie08

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

Anyone else see hse chief paul reids performance on the six one news just now ?
On about the rollout of the VACINNES and especially at center in Dublin.
All going well until he tried to give out the hse helpline number .
Made a balls of it ...than again when your only on 350,000 euro a year we can't expect " dads army "to get facts correct .

How many phone numbers do you remember off the top of your head?

noserider

Pitch n Putt wrote: »

It’s just a complete worldwide overreaction

Driven by the media and social media.

If ever a real dangerous pandemic should occur I’d be severely worried after seeing they way this was handled.

Absolutely.
And what if there is a serious outbreak of Winter Vomitting bug in the future, will we also enter a lockdown to protect our Health Services?

Ashleigh1986

hynesie08 wrote: »

How many phone numbers do you remember off the top of your head?

I guarantee you this .
If I was going on live tv and I was head of an organisation I would know that organisations helpline number .

Boggles

ypres5 wrote: »

that turned out to be a lot less catastrophic than was painted for us by the likes of McConkey with 80k dead and everyone in the country potentially needing icu treatment in the coming years.

Stop listening to extreme views.

Like I explained to you earlier all you need is common sense and basic maths.

noserider

Boggles wrote: »

Stop listening to extreme views.

Like I explained to you earlier all you need is common sense and basic maths.

Do those in power have those qualities?

FintanMcluskey

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Yep. This is the scary part for me too.

It's just 2 weeks to stop the spread.
Its just a little bit longer.
Its just a mask
Its just a year.
Its just school.
Its just one exam year
Its just christmas
Its just a new vaccine you don't have to get it.
Its just mandatory testing
Its just a vaccine passport
Its just enforced quarantine
Its just 2 masks
Its just a ban on gatherings
Its just travel restrictions
Its just a fine
Its just not seeing your family for a year
Its just a prison sentence for not following "the rules"

Etc etc. I mean ffs, at what point are people going to stop rationalizing these things?

Brilliant post.

The rationalisation is frightening

I remember posting last October when lockdown was beginning again that there was no way out of lockdowns until metrics used to implement them were changed.

I was insulted and my credibility questioned.

I was told the vaccine was near approval and last October’s lockdown would be the last.

Ryan Tubridy was on the verge of tears on the late late urging us all to knuckle down 1 more time.

This quote was from last night

Enhanced restrictions on personal freedoms will extend into June, far beyond the March 5 review date previously announced by the Government, the Tánaiste has warned.

Leo Varadkar also said restrictions on non-essential travel are likely to remain in place “for the rest of the year and into next year”.

FintanMcluskey

Boggles wrote: »

Like I explained to you earlier all you need is common sense and basic maths.

Haha.

Common sense and basic maths can be applied to countries with no lockdowns

It the fact the median age of death in Ireland is 83-84 and male life expectancy in Ireland is 80.

Common sense went out the window last May

acequion

Boggles wrote: »

Who shut down debate?

The alternative view was aired and debated, immensely experienced and qualified people made claims that were proven to be wrong.

Reputations and careers in bits.

Debate is healthy, but if the consensus is that we are doing it the best we can, it would appear you only want debate so we can have a contrarian counter point just for the sake of it.

Exactly the kind of stuff I'm talking about. The emboldened is an utter nonsense comment because you can find no more effective counter argument. Try harder Boggles.:rolleyes:

And yes certain experts have indeed been vilified and rubbished for daring to express a contrarian viewpoint.

Consensus at all costs. Which you very obviously are ok with. But I'm not. I'm for open, honest and respectful debate. A pipe dream in post pandemic Ireland.

Boggles

acequion wrote: »

And yes certain experts have indeed been vilified and rubbished for daring to express a contrarian viewpoint.

They have been vilified and rubbished because their view points were proven to be absolute nonsense.

Silentcorner

Boggles wrote: »

Stop listening to extreme views.

Like I explained to you earlier all you need is common sense and basic maths.

The extreme views are all over the media all day everyday.

They don't get challenged.

We've had the most ridiculous predictions since this started a year ago, from freezer trucks full of bodies, to mass graves, to 120,000 people dead, to every family will lose someone to this...in reality, our ICU capacity has been stretched over two separate periods during our two surges in infection....god knows what extreme predictions our Government are hearing that is keeping the whole nation under house arrest for the at least the coming months.

This is madness!