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Brexit discussion thread XIV (Please read OP before posting)

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 14,662 ✭✭✭✭ BlitzKrieg


    Much like how they shipped out the (at the time not signed not completed) trade agreement announcement with Australia when Boris was struggling at the G7, the tories have once again shipped out a potential trade deal to try and distract from the boozy partygate.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61604784


    Slight problem.


    it's not a trade deal its a MOU (Memorandum of Understanding) has no actual legal framework and of course could have been done even as an EU member


    it's such a complete non story being pushed that you can actually with a quick google find another MOU done between educational bodies in the UK, USA and Ireland https://www.newsletter.co.uk/business/consumer/a-memorandum-of-understanding-has-been-signed-3707987


    But quick they need a brexit win to distract from the fact their brexit king is a boozy w*nker.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,662 ✭✭✭✭ BlitzKrieg


    The above gets better


    turns out Slovakia signed an MOU with Indiana five years ago https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/indiana-seeking-to-enhance-partnership-with-slovakia


    It's such an amazing non story that just searching MOU and a random EU country throws up loads of MOUs with member states and US states or organisation. Ireland has signed multiple with New York alone.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,532 ✭✭✭✭ Hotblack Desiato


    BBC unquestioningly parroting fake news / government propaganda. Sad.

    Trans rights are human rights. 🦄 🌈 💕



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭ eire4


    But predictable these days. The BBC have become more and more propaganda outlet when it comes to their government rather then balanced news source



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,123 ✭✭✭ Enzokk


    Is this the first call from the Conservative MP for a return to the single market?


    "And then there’s the unresolved issue of the Irish border. Current plans to bin the Northern Ireland Protocol could trigger a trade war with the EU (causing further economic harm) and is alienating the United States, our closest security ally.

    As a recent YouGov poll indicates, this is not the Brexit most people imagined, with the majority believing Brexit has gone badly. There is appetite to make improvements – not U-turns but course corrections.

    In a nutshell, all these challenges would disappear if we dare to advance our Brexit model by re-joining the EU single market (the Norway model). Leaving this aspect of the EU was not on the ballot paper, nor called for by either the Prime Minister or Nigel Farage during the 2016 referendum. There was, however, much discussion about returning to a “common market,” which is exactly what I propose."


    A common sense solution that will help their economy and solve the NIP in one swoop. I do find it interesting that this is the first call for a return to the single market. There will be opposition to it from the usual suspects but as the country keeps suffering those voices should become more and more marginalised.



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  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 26,517 Mod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp


    "The Norway Model", oh ye gods. I mean, at this stage nothing would surprise me and in some ways this was always the end result: hard Brexit is a pox on the nation and something had to give that amounted to a return to the Single Market. Of course, good luck anyone suggesting this - and calling it the Single Market. Watch those proposing it tie themselves in knots calling it anything but the Single Market.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,578 ✭✭✭✭ VinLieger


    Thats all well and good but EFTA would have to accept them and with the amount of **** they have pulled the last 6 years I doubt that's gonna happen.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,253 ✭✭✭ peter kern


    correct me but at this stage this would take many many years and right now its not guaranteed efta would take them and i guess rather unlikely they would take them on. so i struggle to see an norwegian model after all the uk shenanigans.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,790 ✭✭✭✭ Ads by Google


    Joining the customs union would make sense. Not sure about the SM.



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 26,517 Mod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp


    I doubt that MP even knows there are more aspects to the "Norway Model" than the single market. Christ I doubt they'd have even heard of EFTA given how stark the ignorance of European institutions was revealed to be.

    Who has that Red Lines infographic from yore? There a similar setup the UK can aim for that'd only contain SM access? That's Turkey, ain't it?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,123 ✭✭✭ Enzokk


    I don't think it would be EFTA membership though. That would be too integrated to try and sell. They will sell it as common market access only. The fine print will read about following rules and regulations set by the EU but a savvy leader could sell the fact that they can leave at any time to try and soothe the baying mob.


    He mentions in the piece they have cut way from the political union and single market membership is not a political union.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭ yagan


    It would be hilarious if Britain realigned with the single market via Northern Ireland. However wouldn't they still have to operate customs infrastructure as they're supposed to for GB goods entering NI but not for onward sale into the EU?

    I can't actually see them effectively managing that when they've postponed their own checks on EU imports for the fourth time. Plus before Brexit the UK already had the majority of fines for distributing unverified imports into the single market. Their whole attitude towards EU trade standards was very only fools and horses.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,578 ✭✭✭✭ VinLieger


    So that would be a whole seperate negotiation and system then similar to what the Swiss have setup which the EU have vowed to never do again due to how complex and time consuming it was which they definitely will not get into with perfidious albion so in reality its EFTA or bust



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,253 ✭✭✭ peter kern


    he speaks of a norwegian model so he wants efta and the ecj lol



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 16,562 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    They will not get EFTA because the other EFTA could not tolerate them.

    If they accept the SM, that has implications that the Brexiteers could not stomach, but there could be a landing zone there.

    Accepting the CU would scupper all those beneficial Global Britain trade deals, if only they had a few to scuttle.

    Of course, agreeing to both would remove the need to find those elusive 50,000 customs officers.

    [Whatever happened to those 50,000 customs officers?]



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 26,517 Mod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp


    I suppose the chief consideration has to be, ultimately, is this a lone wolf MP mouthing off, or a stalking horse towards an eventual " we were always at war with Eurasia" moment, whereupon no, actually, this was always the end result of Brexit Britain. The pivot from Johnson on this may yet cause enough spinning in Churchill's grave to solve the energy crisis over there.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,604 ✭✭✭✭ Leroy42


    It all comes down to choices. Choices that the UK felt they didn't have to make since they were the UK and thus too important.

    These 'solutions' are nothing new. It was all laid out to them in easy to read graph immediately after the ref result.

    The Uk chose the hardest of options as none of the others were worth the choices they would have to make.

    And they still think like that. Hence them looking to simply ditch the NIP.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,161 ✭✭✭ fash


    One wonders how attractive a career it is going to be if there is ongoing uncertainty of the UK rejoining the SM or CU in some fashion.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 16,562 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    While they were in the SM/CU they failed to properly inspect goods entering the SM/CU and got a whopping fine from the ECJ over Chinese jeans that were allowed in at a price well below the wholesale price of cotton. So they will need customs officers no matter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,532 ✭✭✭✭ Hotblack Desiato


    Yeah, same as every other EU country. Not 50k of them though.

    Trans rights are human rights. 🦄 🌈 💕



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 29,708 CMod ✭✭✭✭ ancapailldorcha


    It makes sense for a post-Brexit UK that didn't do it's best to poison relations with its most important neighbours. Sadly, that isn't the UK we have. Joining the single market and customs union solves all of the problems that Brexit caused with the only downside being agitating angry Brexity types who definitely knew what they were voting for but not this which was the only course a Tory Brexit could travel.



  • Registered Users Posts: 43,952 ✭✭✭✭ Mr.Nice Guy


    Speaking of feeding lies, here's the Express outraged that free movement is a thing:

    Bemoans the 'preferential treatment' given to EU citizens. Sad thing is most of their readers probably believe they're being punished, as opposed to facing the consequences of their decisions.

    💙

    💛



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 26,517 Mod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp


    And naturally, the top voted comment in the article is someone whinging that it's the EU "punishing" them for leaving, with replies along the usual thrust of EU-phobic twaddle. The penny steadfastly refused to drop it seems

    Mind you, there's also a fair mix of "this is what you get" as well, albeit not attracting many votes themselves, so maybe there's some small hope.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 29,708 CMod ✭✭✭✭ ancapailldorcha


    There's a demographic amongst the Brexit voters whose minds have been thoroughly and permanently warped by decades of Express and Mail propaganda. I think that at this point they're intellectually incapable of understanding any of this. The only way this will change is if they discard their rags and actually calm down but if they had the self-awareness for that, they wouldn't use the Express for anything besides toilet paper.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 16,562 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    Well, those people in the queue do not appear quite as cross as if they did not have their [French printed] blue passports. At least they know they have those - which they could not have had if they were still in the EU.

    Oh, wait a bit, they could have had them, but who knew?

    I wonder how many things they could have had the Mogg is trying to put forward as yet another advantage of Brexit, because he has yet to come up with a single benefit for the general public as a result of Brexit.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,404 ✭✭✭ wexfordman2



    Quite a few brexit realities starting to hit home, even the fact the the DE is printing them is significant



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