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Connacht vs Munster, Sat 9th Jan 7:35pm, Eir/TG4

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    #302
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    A defeat snatched from the jaws of victory snatched from the jaws of defeat.


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    #303
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    Connacht had to go left here

    https://twitter.com/ek_rugby/status/1348034544415477760


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    #304
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,179 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    When you see it set up like that, it's pretty appalling. They didn't even need to do anything elaborate. With some basic passing, they were over on first phase.

    Friend should be livid with his 8, 9, 10 over that ending.


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    #305
    Bazzo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Buer wrote: »
    When you see it set up like that, it's pretty appalling. They didn't even need to do anything elaborate. With some basic passing, they were over on first phase.

    Friend should be livid with his 8, 9, 10 over that ending.

    Watch it back, Marmion was looking for the ball to come out to him.


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    #306
    mjp
    Registered Users Posts: 961 ✭✭✭mjp


    yerrahbah wrote: »
    Connacht had to go left here

    https://twitter.com/ek_rugby/status/1348034544415477760

    Hate to single out one person but Paul Boyle has to take a lot of flak for this call here. We don't know if initial plan was to go 8-9-14 play out to the backs and if pressure on scrum made him change plan at last minute but to pick and go against 13 men on near side was criminal. Friend will be like a bear with them for messing up a chance to make a pro 14 final over such a schoolboy error. This is second time in a month that Boyle is getting flak for poor decision making and whilst he's young and a serious prospect it's an area he needs to be more clued in to. The positive is that it's something that he can easily improve on and comes with experience. With an experienced half back pairing like marmion and Carty behind him this should not have happened. If they butchered the chance out wide with a knock on it would be much easier to take the loss than the way it unfolded.


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    #307
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,179 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Bazzo wrote: »
    Watch it back, Marmion was looking for the ball to come out to him.

    If the plan was to give it to the back line and Boyle went on a solo run, then he should be dropped solely for that.


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    #308
    Stout Warrior
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 224 ✭✭Stout Warrior


    Wegians89 wrote: »
    Take back what I said earlier in the week, Beirne was phenomenal.

    Is he a second row though? I think he would make a very effective 6 for Ireland but currently don’t think he’s in the top 3 locks in Ireland. One thing he has going for him is that he’s possibly the best lineout option we have in the country beside POM and that immediately puts him in a place that is very good in terms of getting selected. He’s better than all the Leinster options currently barring maybe Toner and he’s past international level.


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    #309
    Bazzo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Buer wrote: »
    If the plan was to give it to the back line and Boyle went on a solo run, then he should be dropped solely for that.

    He probably will be dropped, he was dropped after Bristol and only made his way back to the bench yesterday behind Masterson Jr.

    That said I don't think he decided to try and pull some heroics or anything, just that he got put under pressure and panicked, or didn't execute as well as he intended (maybe wanted to draw a man and pass?)

    Like I said at the time and others have said it too, he's an unreal prospect but needs to think with a cooler head - that will come with experience.


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    #310
    Thomasirl123
    Registered Users Posts: 134 ✭✭Thomasirl123


    nerd69 wrote: »
    When snymans healthy there's the potential for an absolutely monsterous starting 15

    The future is bright! Lots of potential in the young guns to go with the world class players. Time to retire Earls, though didn't add anything last night.


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    #311
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    It wouldn't shock me if Earls retires outright. He won't have a central contract on the table and so the offer will come with a hefty paycut I imagine. If Munster can keep him for another season, then they should jump at it. Next season could be a big one with hopefully a fit Snyman and more games under the belt for some of the young players.


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    #312
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    While the Boyle decision was a mistake, it wasn't a terminal one for Connacht. They still should have been able to recover and win the game. But IIRC the decision to go right on that last phase was basically the exact same mistake as they made vs Bristol 3 weeks ago. Why was Carty on the right? Why did Marmion go that way? Whatever about a young lad making that mistake in a recoverable position, experienced leaders making it in an unrecoverable position having made that exact mistake 3 weeks previous is unforgivable. Friend keeps talking after losses about learning....


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    #313
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,179 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    It wouldn't shock me if Earls retires outright. He won't have a central contract on the table and so the offer will come with a hefty paycut I imagine. If Munster can keep him for another season, then they should jump at it. Next season could be a big one with hopefully a fit Snyman and more games under the belt for some of the young players.

    I'd say Earls is going to have to be carried out of Munster. I can see him playing 2 more years and retiring at 35 at the earliest.

    One area where Munster don't have a lot of high level talent coming through is the back three. There are a lot of options but very little by way of established top level performers with best years in front of them.


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    #314
    leakyboots
    Registered Users Posts: 5,920 ✭✭✭leakyboots


    Thomasirl123 wrote: »
    The future is bright! Lots of potential in the young guns to go with the world class players. Time to retire Earls, though didn't add anything last night.

    He got very little ball. I might be wrong but didn't he make one of our only two linebreaks with that elaborated setpiece move off a lineout?

    Edit: doesn't have it down as a linebreak in the stats here

    https://www.pro14.rugby/match-centre/2021/guinness-pro14/connacht-vs-munster-2021-01-09/421111?mode=post#tabs-stats

    2 carries, 16 metres, made his 4 tackles, turned over ball once.

    I wouldn't be retiring Earls just yet personally, he still appears to be performing at a high level to my mind


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    #315
    Thomasirl123
    Registered Users Posts: 134 ✭✭Thomasirl123


    Buer wrote: »
    I'd say Earls is going to have to be carried out of Munster. I can see him playing 2 more years and retiring at 35 at the earliest.

    One area where Munster don't have a lot of high level talent coming through is the back three. There are a lot of options but very little by way of established top level performers with best years in front of them.

    They mightn't be speed freaks but daly, haley and carbery would be a nice back 3. Solid under high balls and play makers.


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    #316
    leakyboots
    Registered Users Posts: 5,920 ✭✭✭leakyboots


    CJ made the most tackles (19) and most metres - 46. Animal. Beirne won 5 turnovers on the deck


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    #317
    Mav11
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭Mav11


    The ref gave Connacht a penalty for "touching in the air". Is this now an offence? I can't see how touching can be avoided where a high ball is being contested.


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    #318
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Mav11 wrote: »
    The ref gave Connacht a penalty for "touching in the air". Is this now an offence? I can't see how touching can be avoided where a high ball is being contested.
    When in game was this?
    The wording is wrong but there is a protocol for contact in the air.

    Penalty only – Fair challenge with wrong timing - No pulling down
    Yellow card – Not a fair challenge, there is no contest and the player is pulled down landing on his back or side
    Red card – It’s not a fair challenge with no contest, whilst being a reckless or deliberate foul play action and the player lands in a dangerous position


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    #319
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,037 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Mav11 wrote: »
    The ref gave Connacht a penalty for "touching in the air". Is this now an offence? I can't see how touching can be avoided where a high ball is being contested.

    The operative word is "contested"

    In that incident, Daly (I think) didn't contest for the ball, but made contact with porch while porch was in the air.


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    #320
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    Porch had caught the ball and was on the way down when Daly bumped him.

    A timing issue by Daly, he wasn't in a realistic position to catch the ball. It was a penalty


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    #321
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    When in game was this?
    The wording is wrong but there is a protocol for contact in the air.

    Penalty only – Fair challenge with wrong timing - No pulling down
    Yellow card – Not a fair challenge, there is no contest and the player is pulled down landing on his back or side
    Red card – It’s not a fair challenge with no contest, whilst being a reckless or deliberate foul play action and the player lands in a dangerous position

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFp6U2wIWZk

    On the 15 min mark (game clock) following a Murray box kick.

    Initially missed by the ref


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    #322
    Mav11
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭Mav11


    yerrahbah wrote: »
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFp6U2wIWZk

    On the 15 min mark (game clock) following a Murray box kick.

    Initially missed by the ref

    Yeah 17:03 (youtube time) you can hear the ref say "15 was touched in the air by 11 red". Seemed to me to be a bit harsh!


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    #323
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Mav11 wrote: »
    Yeah 17:03 (youtube time) you can hear the ref say "15 was touched in the air by 11 red". Seemed to me to be a bit harsh!
    By the protocol you could give a penalty. You could just play on. You could give it either way and wouldnt see too much of an issue


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    #324
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,037 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Mav11 wrote: »
    Yeah 17:03 (youtube time) you can hear the ref say "15 was touched in the air by 11 red". Seemed to me to be a bit harsh!

    a player in the air has no control over how they land, if they are touched in the air.

    There have ben cases where players have landed on their necks and head due to the actions of another player who wasnt contesting for the ball.

    therefore theres a blanket understanding that if a player is in the air, and your not contesting for the ball, you have to let him land before you can touch him.


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    #325
    Mav11
    Registered Users Posts: 2,240 ✭✭✭Mav11


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    By the protocol you could give a penalty. You could just play on. You could give it either way and wouldnt see too much of an issue

    No, I get that and the ref had no choice, given that it had been brought to his attention by the TMO. I think that POM was similarly penalised later on in a lineout contest, but I thought that was more deserved.


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    #326
    The Inbetween is mine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    Mav11 wrote: »
    No, I get that and the ref had no choice, given that it had been brought to his attention by the TMO. I think that POM was similarly penalised later on in a lineout contest, but I thought that was more deserved.

    POM could have had a yellow for that challenge,


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    #327
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,225 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    ElisaAtWar wrote: »
    While Mr Murphy does wreck my head Munster were good value for their win. Not a very interesting rugby game but if your a Munster fan you woud be well used to that

    Ha, Munster have been involved in a lot of entertaining matches that have gone down to the wire this season, but whatever you're into...


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    #328
    nerd69
    Registered Users Posts: 9,632 ✭✭✭nerd69


    aloooof wrote: »
    Ha, Munster have been involved in a lot of entertaining matches that have gone down to the wire this season, but whatever you're into...

    Indeed one of the great european comebacks to beat clermont in clermont only a few weeks ago. What a borefest


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    #329
    Akrasia
    Registered Users Posts: 22,238 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    The operative word is "contested"

    In that incident, Daly (I think) didn't contest for the ball, but made contact with porch while porch was in the air.

    From the original angle, I thought it was a definite penalty but the reverse angle shows Daly was trying to contest but was beaten to the ball. It was marginal though


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    #330
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,037 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Akrasia wrote: »
    From the original angle, I thought it was a definite penalty but the reverse angle shows Daly was trying to contest but was beaten to the ball. It was marginal though

    Yeah it was incredibly soft, but technically a penalty.


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    #331
    almostover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,970 ✭✭✭almostover


    Stout Warrior wrote: »
    Is he a second row though? I think he would make a very effective 6 for Ireland but currently don’t think he’s in the top 3 locks in Ireland. One thing he has going for him is that he’s possibly the best lineout option we have in the country beside POM and that immediately puts him in a place that is very good in terms of getting selected. He’s better than all the Leinster options currently barring maybe Toner and he’s past international level.

    The two form 2nd rows in Ireland at the moment are probably more suited to no.6 given the size of international 2nd rows these days. I would love to see Ireland play the 6 nations with Beirne and Dillane starting and try to play are more expansive high tempo game. Both of these guys have great hands and are very mobile ball carriers. We don't have the heavy meat in the front 5 that other teams do for example and we should adapt our gameplan accordingly.

    To add to that, Maro Itoje was once often used as a 6 at international level. He's now recognised as probably the top 2nd row in the Northern hemisphere. Beirne and Dillane are both similar in physique if not at the same level of destruction as Itoje is.


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