Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) **Mod warning in OP 22/01**

Icyseanfitz

None of this makes sense, its purely political bull**** at this stage

amacca

Knine wrote: »

I don't get why those in mainstream go in every day & those in special schools are in on alternative days. It does not make sense. My daughters class in a special school is quite small.

Those in special schools would generally have higher needs than kids in mainstream & therefore need more support

I was wondering same...a lot of the SET in mainstream would have full mainstream classes so they couldn't be double jobbing at the online with those if they are in everyday for a SET duties ...I could forsee this being somewhat unworkable

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

None of this makes sense, its purely political bull**** at this stage

Looks like it all right

wirelessdude01

Knine wrote: »

I don't get why those in mainstream go in every day & those in special schools are in on alternative days. It does not make sense. My daughters class in a special school is quite small.

Those in special schools would generally have higher needs than kids in mainstream & therefore need more support

This whole thing is just a political charade. Norma has to get her way. Children and parents and the damage she is doing are just collateral damage that doesn't even cross her mind.

Birdy

amacca wrote: »

I was wondering same...a lot of the SET in mainstream would have full mainstream classes so they couldn't be double jobbing at the online with those if they are in everyday for a SET duties ...I could forsee this being somewhat unworkable



Looks like it all right

No they don't. SET don't have a class. They support pupils in groups, pairs or on their own.

amacca

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

This whole thing is just a political charade. Norma has to get her way. Children and parents and the damage she is doing are just collateral damage that doesn't even cross her mind.

That could prove to be a foolish strategy.......

amacca

Birdy wrote: »

No they don't. SET don't have a class. They support pupils in groups, pairs or on their own.

I'm talking about post primary now....they seem to there, in my OHs place mos SET teachers certainly don't teach a full timetable of exclusively SEN ....they teach mainstream classes to......they are qualified but only one teacher is fulltime SEN classes/students exclusively....know that for a fact ???

Icyseanfitz

amacca wrote: »

That could prove to be a foolish strategy.......

She doesn't care, it will look like she was so strong she opened up the schools inspite of lazy educators and their unions

amacca

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

She doesn't care, it will look like she was so strong she opened up the schools inspite of lazy educators and their unions

I'm thinking it might not be successful though...if it's to happen at post primary anyway, that wouldn't be a good look for her I'd assume....although the spin doctors will probably succeed in transferring blame away from themselves again with the usual weaseling

wirelessdude01

Look at Andy Pikes twitter. I'm guessing this plan will either have to be delayed again, amended or abandoned.

Birdy

amacca wrote: »

I'm talking about post primary now....they seem to there, in my OHs place mos SET teachers certainly don't teach a full timetable of exclusively SEN ....they teach mainstream classes to......they are qualified but only one teacher is fulltime SEN classes/students exclusively....know that for a fact ???

This plan has nothing to do with post primary.

The reality is that there are SEN and DEIS kids who really need this support. Norma could easily keep them all closed. At least she's trying to provide solutions and recognises that remote learning doesn't work for these children. INTO has backed it. I don't see how it won't go ahead.

mirrorwall14

I’m assuming this means all mild AEN students lose support?

amacca

Birdy wrote: »

This plan has nothing to do with post primary.

The reality is that there are SEN and DEIS kids who really need this support. Norma could easily keep them all closed. At least she's trying to provide solutions and recognises that remote learning doesn't work for these children. INTO has backed it. I don't see how it won't go ahead.

Fine... you only have to go back about a couple of my posts and you will see I asked was this related to post primary and clearly mentioned that's what I was talking about........

ax530

Knine wrote: »

I don't get why those in mainstream go in every day & those in special schools are in on alternative days. It does not make sense. My daughters class in a special school is quite small.

Those in special schools would generally have higher needs than kids in mainstream & therefore need more support

Not too have full classrooms
In mainstream <50% would fall into the category who can come in where as special kids all would qualify

Ray Donovan

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Look at Andy Pikes twitter. I'm guessing this plan will either have to be delayed again, amended or abandoned.

https://twitter.com/apike1/status/1350184583812308996

Looks pretty confident of solutions being found to me.

Funsterdelux

Whats going to happen to staff's school going kids?

wirelessdude01

Ray Donovan wrote: »

https://twitter.com/apike1/status/1350184583812308996

Looks pretty confident of solutions being found to me.

The most pressing thing is the provision of childcare for those that are to go back to work. Ms. Madigan was pressed on this on Drivetime yesterday and ducked and dodged when asked if the childcare and creche organisations had been involved in the discussions or had they been asked had they the ability to provide extra capacity. Watch this space regarding this. Herself and Norma are great at taking but not actually answering the questions they were asked.

Birdy

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

The most pressing thing is the provision of childcare for those that are to go back to work. Ms. Madigan was pressed on this on Drivetime yesterday and ducked and dodged when asked if the childcare and creche organisations had been involved in the discussions or had they been asked had they the ability to provide extra capacity. Watch this space regarding this. Herself and Norma are great at taking but not actually answering the questions they were asked.

Well all other essential workers have to find child care. Many kids are doing their work from their grandparents' house or their childminders' house.

Deeec

Funsterdelux wrote: »

Whats going to happen to staff's school going kids?

I think Norma's plan has flaws but teachers cannot use lack of childcare as a reason not to go to school. There are lots of essential workers ( nurses, doctors etc) who have to go to work and can't use childcare as a reason not to. There are plenty of other reasons why this plan can't work - it would be wise for teachers not to bring up the childcare issue. There will be no sympathy from the public with this issue.

Clouron

Deeec wrote: »

I think Norma's plan has flaws but teachers cannot use lack of childcare as a reason not to go to school. There are lots of essential workers ( nurses, doctors etc) who have to go to work and can't use childcare as a reason not to. There are plenty of other reasons why this plan can't work - it would be wise for teachers not to bring up the childcare issue. There will be no sympathy from the public with this issue.

Plenty of childcare providers have received the funding for frontline and essential workers. Teschers are in that bracket and could avail of grant aided childcare.

wirelessdude01

Birdy wrote: »

Well all other essential workers have to find child care. Many kids are doing their work from their grandparents' house or their childminders' house.

I'm just saying that the goverprovided guarantees during the negotiations around childcare, no solution has been forthcoming from them yet. Limited return to school depends on it. Andy Pike confirmed that if this isn't put in place then SNAs won't be going back on the 21st. The bones of a deal are in place but there is no meat on them.

Just stating the facts.

Midnight Sundance

Deeec wrote: »

I think Norma's plan has flaws but teachers cannot use lack of childcare as a reason not to go to school. There are lots of essential workers ( nurses, doctors etc) who have to go to work and can't use childcare as a reason not to. There are plenty of other reasons why this plan can't work - it would be wise for teachers not to bring up the childcare issue. There will be no sympathy from the public with this issue.

I hate to say it but agree with you regarding the childcare. Its not even the main concern of teachers and should not be highlighted as it will deflect from the real problem of public health advice being completely at odds with this plan.
Its pure madness in my opinion

wirelessdude01

Deeec wrote: »

I think Norma's plan has flaws but teachers cannot use lack of childcare as a reason not to go to school. There are lots of essential workers ( nurses, doctors etc) who have to go to work and can't use childcare as a reason not to. There are plenty of other reasons why this plan can't work - it would be wise for teachers not to bring up the childcare issue. There will be no sympathy from the public with this issue.

It is the SNA union who is driving thi.s

Midnight Sundance

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

It is the SNA union who is driving thi.s

Agree but it will be teachers who are blamed for bringing up the issue

scooby77

Midnight Sundance wrote: »

I hate to say it but agree with you regarding the childcare. Its not even the main concern of teachers and should not be highlighted as it will deflect from the real problem of public health advice being completely at odds with this plan.
Its pure madness in my opinion

Re: public health advice-an email was sent to Principals this evening inviting all relevant special education staff to a Public Health Webinar on Monday at 3.30pm. If your principal hasn't forwarded yet, you may want to contact him/her.

wirelessdude01

Midnight Sundance wrote: »

Agree but it will be teachers who are blamed for bringing up the issue

Again it is the head of the educational section of Forsa who is pushing this issue. At 10:02 he confirmed that without agreement and solution to the childcare issue that there is no agreement.

INTO haven't said a word. That isn't surprising anyway.

Locotastic

Deeec wrote: »

I think Norma's plan has flaws but teachers cannot use lack of childcare as a reason not to go to school. There are lots of essential workers ( nurses, doctors etc) who have to go to work and can't use childcare as a reason not to. There are plenty of other reasons why this plan can't work - it would be wise for teachers not to bring up the childcare issue. There will be no sympathy from the public with this issue.

I really really hope childcare is not touted as a reason. Non teaching essential workers have faced this issue several times during the past year and there was very little made of it.

There certainly wasn't a major childcare "provision" for essential workers. They have had to manage things and get on with it whatever way they can.

BonsaiKitten

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Again it is the head of the educational section of Forsa who is pushing this issue. At 10:02 he confirmed that without agreement and solution to the childcare issue that there is no agreement.

INTO haven't said a word. That isn't surprising anyway.

And INTO won't say a word. John Boyle got to feel important and have a meeting with the big dogs. Ego stroked, game over.

What a sham of a union they are.

khalessi

Locotastic wrote: »

I really really hope childcare is not touted as a reason. Non teaching essential workers have faced this issue several times during the past year and there was very little made of it.

There certainly wasn't a major childcare "provision" for essential workers. They have had to manage things and get on with it whatever way they can.

Yes and they called for schools to reopened for this reason, mainly because Leo and Simon promised to sort it out during last lockdown and weren't able to. ANd if you look through this thread, you will see lots of people using it for childcare adn even our minister gave it as a reason for resopening.

Locotastic

khalessi wrote: »

Yes and they called for schools to reopened for this reason, mainly because Leo and Simon promised to sort it out during last lockdown and weren't able to. ANd if you look through this thread, you will see lots of people using it for childcare adn even our minister gave it as a reason for resopening.

Essential workers have had months where childcare wasn't available, they didn't use it as a reason not to go to work. That's why I hope it's not pushed as a main issue, because it is not the main issue.

wirelessdude01

khalessi wrote: »

Yes and they called for schools to reopened for this reason, mainly because Leo and Simon promised to sort it out during last lockdown and weren't able to. ANd if you look through this thread, you will see lots of people using it for childcare adn even our minister gave it as a reason for resopening.

Sure even Dr. Abigal Collins has mentioned it as one of THE reasons why schools should remain open.