Connacht Team Talk Thread VI - Some like it TOH

testtech05

Bit surprised it turned out to be true, was showing very well for us before his current injury and looked like nailing down a 1st choice spot. Will he be guaranteed more game time at Munster? I think provinces aren't allowed to outbid each other in these cases?

Redo91

Disappointing one. I thought the days of us losing players to the other provinces that we wanted to keep were over.

Utopia Parkway

I think Connacht will be a bit sore at this one. Is that the first young academy player that they have lost to another province since Henshaw? Obviously Kilgallen isn't Henshaw but after he finally broke into the Connacht team as a regular this season to see him go at the first available opportunity will rankle with some.

conncussed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121767348#Comment_121767348

Clearly whatever conversation he's had with Rowntree and Prendergast has convinced him he has a better future down south. I think the way Munster want to play favours having a wing like him too.

It doesn't surprise me too much. We've loaded up our back three with options then rotated him.

SqueakyKneecap

Don't get me wrong and I don't want to sound like I'm disrespecting lads we gambled on like Bolton/Ralston/Smith/McNamara (a couple of whom are turning out to be worth the risk) but this one is a particular blow. We're not flushed with experienced back 3 players and it adds insult to injury (pun not intended) with our biggest signing in years essentially missing a full season.

Zeugnis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121767348#Comment_121767348

Strongly agree with this. I wish Kilgallen well with his recovery, but the minutes available until the end of the season should eb used for players who are committed to Connacht. Give the ban on provinces outbidding each other, he has obviously opted to go south for his own reasons. That's bitterly disappointing given that he was developed through our academy etc.

To leave is his choice; to play him once recovered - that's the choice of Connacht management. I would use him only as a break glass option. Let's have a look at Chay Mullins and Josh O'Connor, both of whom I've heard good things about.

A word on Munster and attitudes present among some of their fans. A minority of them seem addicted to the quick fix, thus the endless appetite for signing NIQs or demanding provincial moves to their benefit. Such moves are justified on the grounds that it'll be 'good for Ireland' and 'sure they're all contracted by the IRFU anyway' etc etc.

When was the last time a regular starter developed in Munster's Academy was moved to another province? How do you they'd respond if roles were reversed? I'm not impressed.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121767950#Comment_121767950

Can you show me where has Munster been "demanding provincial moves to their benefit"? Provinces cannot outbid one another, Munster made an offer, Connacht likely matched it and ultimately, it was up to the player where he saw his future.

You seem to forget the countless players Connacht have picked up from Munster (as well as the other provinces) over the years.

Zeugnis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121768020#Comment_121768020

Can you name a regular Munster starter serenaded away by Connacht? I can't think of any.

JJ, you dumped, and he ended up with us via a circuitous route.

Alex Wooton had been sent to Siberia after injury.

Conor Oliver had played a grand total of 300 minutes for Munster in the two seasons before his departure for Galway.

Conor Fitzgerald was released from the Munster Academy.

So, help me out here.

As regards the 'demanding provincial moves' that was a reference to a part of your fan base not Munster rugby - we don't know what they say to the IRFU, or what was said in the context of this move. If you want evidence of that attitude among your fan base, look no further than the munsterfans board. It's full of posts about how Frawley, Dan Sheahan, Ronan Kelleher etc should be sent south for the good of everybody.

Are you blind to the culture among some of your fellow fans and how much time they spend ogling in the window of Leinster's player roster?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121768104#Comment_121768104

Kilgallen has played 23 times (starting 15 times) in 5 seasons. He has played a similar number of minutes for Connacht in 5 season (1164) as Oliver did for Munster in his 5 seasons (1166). There's no need to act like he's playing 1000+ minutes a season.

Connacht aren't exactly short of back three options. This season as back three players they have: Bolton, Hansen, Jennings, Kilgallen, McNamara, McNulty, O'Halloran, Porch, Smith with Cordero to come back from injury. They also have 3 back-three players in the Academy. That's 10 senior players, plus the three academy lads.

Bearing in mind, I wouldn't consider Kilgallen an established Connacht starter and I don't mean to sound ignorant but why would a Munster starter leave for Connacht?

There's plenty of chat in each one of the provincial threads about what players a fan would like to see play for their province that are currently player at another province. There's no need to get so wound up over fan opinions. I've seen countless mentions here of suggestions that Connacht should attempt to sign x, y and z from such-and-such province.

Provinces make moves for starters from other provinces multiple times each season, its ultimately up to the player where they see their future lie.

phog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121768104#Comment_121768104

Look, I never wanted Henshaw to be allowed leave Connacht so it would be wrong of me to think Connacht losing Kilgallen to Munster is ok. Different players mind you as Henshaw was certain starter and Kilgallen does seem to have to earn a regular starting place.

But to be getting annoyed over fans (who have absolutely zero say in who moves where) thinking out loud over who would be an addition to their team is a bit extreme.

Zeugnis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121768160#Comment_121768160

Your comparison of Oliver with Kilgallen doesn't stand up, and this is obvious when you refer to minutes over five (five!) seasons. Kilgallen has been our top scorer in the URC this season. He started eight games last year despite injuries. There is no comparison with Oliver with his 300 mins in the two years before departure from Munster. Sorry, if you don't see that.

And no, it's fine, you're right, why would a Munster starter move to Connacht? You have a budget that's approx. 40% bigger than ours, have wealthy external benefactors, even get a top up to bring back the club golden boy Zebo from France! Yes, I don't like it, because we are treated like the runt of the litter, whereas Munster are indulged. And now in addition to the asymmetry of resources, it feels like Munster is picking Connacht's pocket.

I'm not keen to discuss our back three options with a Munster fan who has no stake in the success of the club I support. And if you don't like my attitude, well too bad, that's fandom for you. But I keep it in the Connacht thread, note that I feel no need to share my opinions in your corner.

Dubinusa

How does anyone here know the bugets?

realhorrorshow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121768397#Comment_121768397

"it feels like Munster is picking Connacht's pocket".

I understand this as an emotional reaction to frustrating news but tbh I'd be far quicker to blame our coaches/signings board for overstacking our squad massively in the back 3. We have 16 outside backs in our squad this season, with another 8 in the academy. Munster have 11+3, including Colm Hogan who is only on a short term deal. Even Leinster have only 12 + 6, there is absolutely no reason for us to carry more players than the bulk providers to team Ireland imo.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121768397#Comment_121768397

Oliver missed approx 6 months of one season after shoulder surgery, the following season he missed 12 or 13 weeks after a freak injury in the gym so no wonder his minutes were limited. His last injury free season in Munster saw him start 13 out of 14 games. I'm comparing them because they both have/had roughly the same amount of seasons under their belt at the same age, both came from Leinster into the respective academies and both moved on at a similar point in their careers.

Budget isn't the be all and end all. Munster can't outbid Connacht, the salary on offer would have been the same at whatever club he decided to stay at. The IRFU wouldn't have part-funded the Zebo return if they didn't think he was past it at international level.

Attitude? It's more like your sulking. You have 12 or 13 back three options, you can only realistically include 4 in a matchday squad.

Wegians89

Disappointed but not surprised, would like to see game time given to others now as happened with Dillane when he decided to move on. Josh O’Connor has looked exciting in the couple of pre season games I’ve seen him in

Zeugnis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121768589#Comment_121768589

We can't 'know' because the IRFU does not make them available. Jackman, who is not entirely clueless on the matter, says Connacht c.5m and Munster and Ulster c.7m, Leinster maybe 8.5m. This is my recollection from the42's podcast some time last year or in 2022.

Utopia Parkway

Kilgallen was definitely a starter for Connacht this season when fit. Obviously with the addendum that Cordero has missed the entire season and Hansen/Porch, etc, have both missed a big chunk of the season as well. As Munster can't outbid Connacht I presume they just whispered sweet nothings to Kilgallen and turned his head. So ultimately it's the player who made the decision. Definitely a sore one for Connacht though to lose an academy player just as he's made the breakthrough to being a regular starter.

I know Connacht say their playing budget won't be affected by a reduced capacity in the Sportsground for pretty much the next 2 years while they rebuild the stadium but I do wonder will there be some belt tightening going on as regards the spending on the playing squad.

ShineyShiney

There's a great opportunity for a player like killgalen at Munster. I think he right to take it.

I'd see it as a swap from 4/5/6th choice to 3rd choice with one of the guys ahead a regular enough 15.

Porch, cordero, mack, Royston, Bolton, smith,

Or

Nash, Daly, Killgalen, Coombes

I know I'm kind of ignoring Zebo but he hasn't that long left.

Seems smart to me especially if the Connacht coaches like what they've seen from Bolton

ShineyShiney

Big game this weekend.

I'd like to see

Buckley Heffernan Aungier

N Murray Joyce

Prendergast SHL

Sob

Blade Carty

Forde Farrell

Bolton porch

Toh

ElisaAtWar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121769199#Comment_121769199

Kilgallen when available would always be a starter at Connacht. And it's not about money. If Kilgallen decided to leave then there has to be a very good reason. And I just wonder if it is Wilkins. Just all the dynamics seem wrong this weather

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121769424#Comment_121769424

There was a someone in the 42 comments section mentioning something about Kilgallen not getting on with Mark Sexton. I'd take it with a pinch of salt but there's no smoke without fire.

realhorrorshow

Minutes played by players 23 or younger at the start of the season (01/09) after 13/22-25 games. Oisin McCormack is the only senior player who meets the criteria, but hasn't played yet this season.

2016Edinburgh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121769424#Comment_121769424

Agree with this.

Another disappointed but not surprised.

Once the rumours started, I thought if there is any truth he's talking to Munster, then he's gone.

He's our best winger in my opinion behind Mack (who was busy at the RWC and Ireland) and behind Santi who's out for most of the season.

DK had good start to the season, got dropped with no explanation/no injury, came back and got injured.

I'd be worried about any player out of contract, if Leinster/Munster, and top English team or Top14 team come in with an offer, I think they'll leave.

The way our season has gone, the weird selections of teams, players dropped, no outhalf, I would be very worried that players don't believe in the coaching team or that Connacht has any future in the next few years as things stand.

realhorrorshow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121770453#Comment_121770453

Yeah I can imagine the constant rotation is quite frustrating for players, especially in the back 3 where you particularly need consistency to build form and confidence imo. The only constants have been O'Halloran at 15 when fit, and Byron Ralston playing every single minute he's been available for, which I don't entirely get tbh. I do like him but we have other options who offer far more ball in hand.

• Bolton - nowhere to be seen for half the season then seemingly becomes a mainstay
• Jennings - barely seen
• Kilgallen - in and out of the team a couple of times then injured
• McNamara - sub first two games then banished to the AIL
• McNulty - barely seen
• Porch - in and out even when fit
• Smith - in and out despite being fit pretty much all season (?)

I may have forgotten some injuries but I think my general point is fair.

Wegians89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121770604#Comment_121770604

Just to note Bolton was class in preseason but picked up an injury, he’s been a mainstay once he got back fit.

Jennings was away with the 7s and called back after a few injures in the back three, not sure he was supposed to be with Connacht at all this side of the Olympics.

Porch does seem to be out of favour this year but he also has had a couple of different knocks.

realhorrorshow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121770643#Comment_121770643

Bolton had been with us for two full seasons prior without getting much of a shot. Makes absolutely no sense to call Jennings back because of a few injuries, we have more wingers than we know what to do with. If the plan was for him to focus on sevens for the year why disrupt that, he clearly wasn't needed seeing as he played so little.

Wegians89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121770701#Comment_121770701

Apart from his first year with Connacht, Bolton has been really hampered with injuries. Would recommend listening to Master of Nones interview with him.

From what I can remember Jennings only came back and was on the bench for two games before getting injured?

Dubinusa

Josh O'Connor is finishing up in the academy. He's similar type to Kilgallen. He should get a senior contract. Connacht have a big surplus in multiple positions. Inside center if swamped and there's no way they will all be kept. There's Devine, Hawkshaw, Gavin all in the academy. Contracted players are Aki, Daly and Hawkshaw. Cathal Forde could be seen as a 12 also. I can see Daly leaving or not getting re signed. There's also a glut of back rows. Losing Kilgalken hurts but, he's doing himself justice as there's better prospects of playing time at Munster.

conncussed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121770604#Comment_121770604

If we look out to next season and assume that everyone is magically fit we end up with a starting back three of Hansen, Cordero, and one other player. I think that ends up being Ralston by default. The coaching team really seem to like his rounded skills, reading of the game, and defensive interventions. I also think that they want a very fluid backline and are unlikely to select Bolton and Kilgallen in the same team. Smith is the player that they'll try to develop in a similar mould as Ralston.

We get very little insight into how the backs are coached but if it sounds anything like my above paragraph I'd be in the same boat as Kilgallen and moving South. They're very light in the back three and will get the ball wide lots.

Tadhg Beirne and Kilgallen were practically next door neighbours growing up in in Kildare. Apparently they're fairly close despite the age gap. I'm sure he's heard most of the off the record things he wanted to know about the Munster environment.

realhorrorshow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121771095#Comment_121771095

I liked what I saw of O'Connor last pre season but I don't want to us to sign him unless we have an actual plan for his development, and a realistic path to senior gametime. We'll see who else leaves but even with Kilgallen on the way out we have Cordero to come in, Mullins presumably focusing on 15s after the Olympics, and Gavin perhaps playing on the wing to ease into senior rugby. There's also the Bolton/Smith who'll be pushing hard for first choice and Jennings who will be at a critical point in his development.